No, they just waited intil the start of the next show year, moved it a state or two over, renamed it and started a Green career at the new height. Particularly if it was a younger grey during its first show career, one white Pony looks like another
[QUOTE=bauhaus;8283783]
It’s been repeatedly mentioned that the way to stop drugging is to take away the incentive to cheat. Obviously, the incentive to cheat is winning. So, make it harder for every horse in a trainer’s barn to win. Every horse showing under the barn name of a trainer who has been set down has an automatic deduction of points on every round, for a certain amount of time. You could do a scale based on how many times the trainer has had a horse test positive:
1 strike, 5 points off - x # of months
2 strikes, 10 points off - x # of months
3 strikes, 20 points off - x # of months
4 strikes, 50 points off - permanently
After 3 strikes it wouldn’t prevent a trainer from showing, but it would prevent him/her from winning, ever. I think to hit where it hurts you need to hit right on the prestige, name recognition, reputation for putting out winning horses and riders.[/QUOTE]
This is creative and original, but since trainers run the governing bodies, not likely ever to happen.
The core of the incentives to do things that win is in the judging standards.
That’s the bottom line. Everything else is chasing and chasing and chasing the cheaters (that never ends), rules, sanctions, scandal, conflict and acrimony.
It’s a choice. One the entire community makes - by either action or inaction. 
I don’t think USEF has any desire to impose sanctions that might make trainers and all their clients pick up their toys and leave the sandbox…
[QUOTE=OverandOnward;8283882]
The core of the incentives to do things that win is in the judging standards.
That’s the bottom line. Everything else is chasing and chasing and chasing the cheaters (that never ends), rules, sanctions, scandal, conflict and acrimony.
It’s a choice. One the entire community makes - by either action or inaction. :)[/QUOTE]
All disciplines across the board have not remained static over time. Changing judging standards will not stop drugging horses…it’s an age-old cheating method that simply changes in response to the governing body’s ability to test for the latest drug of choice. Changing the punishment for getting caught WILL make a difference. Make it hurt, and hurt bad where it counts, in the trainer’s pocketbook.
Anything else is just lip service on the USEF’s part.
If you really want to have more of an effect, suspend the people responsible for the horse AND the horse, which has certainly been discussed before.
Remain skeptical, I really don’t care:D
It’s really hard to enforce rules when the federation won’t follow through on known cases of fraud. I called and sent paper work regarding a horse whose name was changed as well as it’s breed. All verifiable. The result? NOTHING. The federation makes it easy to cheat. So disappointing. As far as calming supplement? Search this forum for a hundred threads about it. Many many many people use nutraceuticals trying to alter behavior, even removing oats or other percieved hot feeds. It happens. When this went from a sport to a BIG business, that sportsman’s charter went out the window. Money wins.
I don’t see why Tori’s mom can’t watch her at medal finals. A few years ago I pointed out a USEF suspended person at HITS to one of the stewards and I was told by the steward to “stop being a tattle tale”. Seems like they don’t really care.
[QUOTE=Jumphigh83;8284533]
Many many many people use nutraceuticals trying to alter behavior, even removing oats or other percieved hot feeds. It happens. When this went from a sport to a BIG business, that sportsman’s charter went out the window. Money wins.[/QUOTE]
But are you really saying removing oats would be a violation of the rules? It seems like feeding the horse whatever natural substances produce the most level-headed, relaxed animal is a good thing-- for example, I banned an oat hay mix for my daughter’s horse because it seemed to get her fired up.
At some point this is no different from how we might limit sugar for little kids.
Of course, actual sedatives or things that need to be injected are a different story.
[QUOTE=lando;8268594]
Its quite sad what the hunters have come to, although sometimes I tend to believe an injection is safer than lunging a horse around aimlessly for 2.5h a day to get it calm before its 5 classes, and loading it on triple dosages of PP. Although it isn’t just the hunters, the industry as a whole turns a blind eye to a number of things, walking through FEI at night opens your eyes to a whole new world sometimes, and the officials don’t even care.[/QUOTE]
Sadly the hunter world has changed way too much. They shouldn’t be dinged for having a motor and some pep. But they are. I feel a true hunter in the field would not go around like a drugged elephant.
Just sayin.
[QUOTE=Mel0309;8285329]
I don’t see why Tori’s mom can’t watch her at medal finals. A few years ago I pointed out a USEF suspended person at HITS to one of the stewards and I was told by the steward to “stop being a tattle tale”. Seems like they don’t really care.[/QUOTE]
Wow, that’s pretty bad.
Heck, BW watched his son on numerous occasions. Openly. Imagine a person could wear a hat and plain clothing, lay low and keep quiet and most would never know they were in the big crowd at a sports arena style venue.
Just sayin here…
[QUOTE=findeight;8285491]
Heck, BW watched his son on numerous occasions. Openly. Imagine a person could wear a hat and plain clothing, lay low and keep quiet and most would never know they were in the big crowd at a sports arena style venue.
Just sayin here…[/QUOTE]
And even if people knew BW was there, few would have spoken up. That is the sad thing about rule breaking. Many know it is happening but most want to keep the harmony or, because USEF’s power is quite limited, nothing gets done.
Around here, there is a trainer that is supposedly giving the horses the flu vaccine on show days to make them sluggish. I have heard this from several people. What can you do?! 
[QUOTE=APirateLooksAtForty;8282512]
My best friend had a pony that had the wither-shaving surgery. This was the late 90s. I know exactly which veterinary hospital and I know exactly which vet. Don’t care to elaborate but it has been done.[/QUOTE]
Disgusting. That is animal abuse…
[QUOTE=Limerick;8285613]
And even if people knew BW was there, few would have spoken up. That is the sad thing about rule breaking. Many know it is happening but most want to keep the harmony or, because USEF’s power is quite limited, nothing gets done.
-([/QUOTE]
Oh, everybody knew he was there, no effort at blending in at all. IIRC the fed or whatever they were calling themselves at the time ended up calling the cops and charging him with trespass, been awhile so the details are foggy but it went to court, maybe he sued too…he lost.
But USEF is not the cops, just a hobby club and their authority is very limited. Pretty sure many suspended folks have quietly been where they are not supposed to be and the majority of others there don’t recognize them, especially if they do nothing to attract attention in a large crowd.
Don’t condone that but…just sayin…
[QUOTE=bauhaus;8283783]
It’s been repeatedly mentioned that the way to stop drugging is to take away the incentive to cheat. Obviously, the incentive to cheat is winning. So, make it harder for every horse in a trainer’s barn to win. Every horse showing under the barn name of a trainer who has been set down has an automatic deduction of points on every round, for a certain amount of time. [/QUOTE]
All that would happen is that the horses would “show under a different barn name”, nominally owned by someone else.
[QUOTE=Janet;8285658]
All that would happen is that the horses would “show under a different barn name”, nominally owned by someone else.[/QUOTE]
Owner can show it under their own name if uninvolved in the violation too, sign as responsible person as well. Stable with whoever temporarily takes over the show string and things go on as usual.
I read about how USEF drug tests and here is one of the paragraphs I read -
The choice is pretty much random. “We test at 20 to 25 percent of competitions each year,” Dr. Schumacher says. “There is a focus on upper levels, where more is at stake and violations may be more likely to occur, but we test lower levels as well.” He selects the shows and then asks one of the veterinarians who works with the program to test perhaps one day out of four, at his or her convenience. The odds of being tested are greater for horses who display unusual behavior or place in the top five of their classes, but anyone can be selected. For example, in a dressage class, horses are picked randomly as they leave the ring before the placings are decided.
Now on these big money classes why doesn’t USEF just have a mandatory drug test to the top three or five horses??? If they implemented such a rule this would more than likely slow drugs in these classes in fear you would win and get mandatory testing. You enter to win that kind of money you should be willing to put your equine management skills out to the world.
Also the judges need some mind set changes too. A hunter should not be too quiet and they need to stop rewarding this temperament especially since it is taking drugs or hours of longe time to get them there.
These people would deliberately throw a class if the testers showed up and they made it public the winner or top 3 or whatever would be tested. Or never leave the barn with a “sore foot” if they knew far enough out the testers were on the property.
Theres enough classes out there with no testers it’s no problem for them to scratch one or deliberately screw one up and glibly lie about what happened.
Most have no idea just how ruthless the real bad eggs can be and make the mistake of assuming they even care about horse welfare or rules let alone have any morals or ethics. What would deter most normal people is a joke and nuisance to them. Only going after the owners that keep them in business and possibly getting them to pull the plug is going to really change the game for those people.
