Selling eventer flop as a hunter....?

[SquishTheBunny]

I know some eventers that double as hunters, honestly they usually have one thing going from them right off the bat - a good canter.

Lead changes, and automatic ones…ideally before a corner, are important. He will have to be spot on with these to get $$ as a hunter prospect. If you are marketing him in a lower price bracket, “sticky” changes may be forgiven as long as there is hope for them!

Also don’t think that buyers want a low head for the hunters, self balance is just as important in the hunter ring as eventing. Often they travel on a light contact so self balance is important. They must be able to back off or move up for fences when needed (without the rider piloting them!) to allow for the best jump possible. A horse that will run to the base of a jump may be ok in the eventing world, but in hunterland, they need to be comfortable with finding the sweet spot either by rider choice, or even better, by horse choice.

And lastly, jumping style. Start doing lots of oxers to improve front end. When showing him to potential buyers, set a course of all oxers as these are most frequently what is seen in the ring (or "verticles that are built up so much in front that thy are really oxers!). It will help square the front end and slow the jump, to make him appear more hunter type.

[SidesaddleRider]

You can absolutely make an eventer into a hunter. I have a former 2* horse in the barn that has become the most hunterish of all hunters (and fox hunts too), and has finally settled enough in the hack to get a ribbon at Upperville! (A pic of him can be found on the top left of my website home page)

As others have said, lead changes are a MUST. Get those nailed down by someone who knows what they are doing, and then show him. Luckily, here in NoVA, we have lots of hunter schooling shows to get mileage. Also, work on getting him used to the “hunter gap” spot for jumping, rather than always going to the base of the jump.

[Zaney]

Thanks for all the info! This is great to read and giving me a lot to keep in mind. I have set up to bring him over for a lesson/evaul at a hunter barn on thurs!
Also, what are some dress code/fashion does and dont’s? I will leave my multi color helmet at home

[SidesaddleRider]

[QUOTE=Zaney;7637805]
Also, what are some dress code/fashion does and dont’s? I will leave my multi color helmet at home [/QUOTE]

For your attire: think conservative. For your lesson, wear your normal schooling breeches, boots or half chaps, and a polo.
For your horse: Regular jumping saddle vs a monoflap, if possible; no breastplate; hunter-legal bit (d-ring, loose ring, full cheek), no flash noseband.

It isn’t really a big deal while you are just starting out, and you can look at some pics from shows to see what people are wearing.

[arlosmine]

I have sold several horses who started their careers on another discipline into the hunter world.

I agree that changes are a huge deal breaker, and that they are very specific. Of you dont know how to put a hunter change on a horse, DON’T try to do it yourself. I’m a dressage rider, and find the hunter change to be a completely different feeling than a good dressage change. better to have the changes green but well started, than started wrong. No trainer wants to spend time un-doing stuff if they don’t have to.

Work on maintaining a perfect, indelible rhythm in canter at all times, on any rein length, on any rein tension. I disagree with the poster above who mentioned something about going to the base of Xcountry obstacles. In my experience, most eventers and their horses go for the long spot and have to work hard at getting to the base for stadium. If the horse is quiet and will add, that’s a plus.

From what I’ve seen, either a horse has “the look”, or they don’t, and the trainer examining them will know in two minutes if they are interested or not.

[Linny]

Lead changes and self carriage are key. Getting an evaluation from a hunter expert is going to tell you what you need. They should be able to tell you strengths and weaknesses and offer advice on how to make your horse more desirable to hunter buyers. They might be able to offer advice on what level you want to market your horse.

Just as in eventing, there are many levels of “hunters.” Marketing a horse well involves locating the right niche for him.

The fact that you have come here looking for advice indicates that you are willing to be open to suggestions. Listen to the trainer’s advice. Consider getting a “second opinion” from a different trainer and seeing if they are in sync.

[Dune]

[QUOTE=cripplecreekfrm;7636571]
Dune - This mare actually tried to crawl out of the ring when others would run up her butt in the hacks. She was also very tense and would drop her butt and scoot when they ran up behind her. I was surprised as well because I did ride her in the ring during warmup time and she was fine. She has beautiful courses just couldn’t relax in the hacks. I am so thankful that I decided to ride her myself then putting one of my students on her. I attributed it to doing dressage tests alone that she wasn’t used to hacking in big groups. Maybe I was wrong and it was just her.[/QUOTE]

I totally understand the “racing pack” mentality that can sometimes manifest itself in a hack class, I just didn’t understand the advice to get said horsie into a warm-up arena with “horses going 15 different directions”. I’m sure as an event horse he has experienced that, I’d advise her to as others have as well, to try to mimic the hack class experience, lol!

[QUOTE=Zaney;7637805]Thanks for all the info! This is great to read and giving me a lot to keep in mind. I have set up to bring him over for a lesson/evaul at a hunter barn on thurs!
Also, what are some dress code/fashion does and dont’s? I will leave my multi color helmet at home [/QUOTE]

Yes, your boring black helmet would be best. Standard is tan/beige breeches, polo or long sleeve shirt of almost any solid color, tucked in with a belt, tall boots are best but many these days ride in paddocks/half chaps, spurs if needed, crop and gloves should complete your ensemble. Ditto what everyone else said about the lead changes and play around with said horsie going around with little to no contact. Every hunter person is a little bit different about that, might throw your horse for a loop (literally, lol!) if he is suddenly asked to go around without as much direction from the reins. Just a thought…

[SidesaddleRider]

[QUOTE=SidesaddleRider;7637790]
Also, work on getting him used to the “hunter gap” spot for jumping, rather than always going to the base of the jump.[/QUOTE]

@arlosmine;7637917

I disagree with the poster above who mentioned something about going to the base of Xcountry obstacles. In my experience, most eventers and their horses go for the long spot and have to work hard at getting to the base for stadium.

Just to clarify - I NEVER said anything about going to the base of xc obstacles!! Hunters typically show in a ring, so I was talking about jumping the horse in a ring. Some eventers may have to work for it, but in my experience (of having ridden and worked with eventing or jumper horses) when it comes to jumping IN A RING, it is usually for stadium jumping or schooling, and they are typically expected to go to the base of the jump, otherwise there is far too much chance of having a rail by going for the long spot. Obviously, when going xc, they are supposed to be galloping on and therefore will typically get the spot or be slightly long rather than get deep and stall out over a wide obstacle.

[Darkwave]

FWIW, there are two former upper level eventing horses - From and In the Fog - currently competing successfully in the amateur hunter divisions. I believe the Chronicle did an article on them about a year or two ago.

Addition: here’s a picture of In The Fog with professional Elizabeth Solter on him. http://www.chronofhorse.com/photos_videos?nid=33042#33056 I think this was just a year after he retired from eventing.

[SidesaddleRider]

[QUOTE=Darkwave;7638335]
FWIW, there are two former upper level eventing horses - From and In the Fog - currently competing successfully in the amateur hunter divisions. I believe the Chronicle did an article on them about a year or two ago.[/QUOTE]

A friend of mine owns Simon (“In the Fog”). Here is video of him, both as an eventer and hunter. http://horsejunkiesunited.com/?p=61405 He is a doll! One couldn’t ask for a better eventer --> hunter success story.

[RugBug]

[QUOTE=SidesaddleRider;7638414]
A friend of mine owns Simon (“In the Fog”). Here is video of him, both as an eventer and hunter. http://horsejunkiesunited.com/?p=61405 He is a doll! One couldn’t ask for a better eventer --> hunter success story.[/QUOTE]

OMG! He’s so adorable. Honestly, I was like “cute” at the first picture, but watching his video? I want to take him home. I loved the way he came out of the XC start box. “Okay, here we go, nice and easy.” Such a lovely way of going…

[Zaney]

Thanks Darkwave! Very cool. I also know RF Amber Eyes just transitioned form ** eventer to hunter ring very successfully… think her show name begins with a C now… don’t remember much else except she won a big class right off the bat!
Will be interesting to think of what the trainer thinks of my guy. And I do agree w SidesaddleRider that the hunter gap may be something I need to re-learn! I am used to riding right up to the base in SJ :eek:
And sounds like I need to get some help with lead changes…! See what I am working with!

[Zaney]

Also should I be trying to add a little weight onto him? He is currently prelim-fit, so pretty trim and can feel ribs. When he has weight on him he really fills out and has a lot to him, though he certainly isn’t scrawny looking now!

[independentlyawesome]

[QUOTE=Zaney;7638645]
Also should I be trying to add a little weight onto him? He is currently prelim-fit, so pretty trim and can feel ribs. When he has weight on him he really fills out and has a lot to him, though he certainly isn’t scrawny looking now![/QUOTE]

Hunters usually like their horses fat, so…

[Linny]

When he stops going prelim he will probably plump up.

I love Simon. He looks like a joy to ride. Even in the cc video, he showed immaculate jumping form.

[yellowbritches]

Definitely put a little weight on him and, if you aren’t going to keep eventing him at prelim, back off the fitness. I’ve sold a lot of eventers as hunters and/or eq horses, and often the biggest complaint about the ones that are still actively eventing is that they are “too skinny.” But, do know, it is VERY possible to get a really pleasing look on a horse without making them obese.

It can definitely be done and if he’s as nice as you describe AND he can get his changes without fuss, he should be quite marketable with a little mileage.

[RugBug]

[QUOTE=yellowbritches;7638915]
often the biggest complaint about the ones that are still actively eventing is that they are “too skinny.”[/QUOTE]

Which is super silly. It’s like looking at a house to buy and complaining about the color of the walls. Now, I might be concerned if I thought the horse was going to get high on more food, but other than that, skinny can usually be fixed.

[yellowbritches]

[QUOTE=RugBug;7638922]
Which is super silly. It’s like looking at a house to buy and complaining about the color of the walls. Now, I might be concerned if I thought the horse was going to get high on more food, but other than that, skinny can usually be fixed.[/QUOTE]
I completely and totally agree!

I do think that sometimes the concern is “is this horse going to be a nightmare to keep weight on?” If a buyer doesn’t have a good idea of what eventing entails, it can be hard to make them understand that they are lean because of their level of fitness. But when you get someone who is knowledgeable of the sport, they usually get it and worry far less about it.

All that being said, trying to market a lean horse as a hunter, while easily fixable, can be a little bit like trying to sell a messy house. It’s a perfectly nice house, but it might be hard to see if it is cluttered and dirty.

[RugBug]

[QUOTE=yellowbritches;7638949]

All that being said, trying to market a lean horse as a hunter, while easily fixable, can be a little bit like trying to sell a messy house. It’s a perfectly nice house, but it might be hard to see if it is cluttered and dirty.[/QUOTE]

Too true.

(I just looked at a house with a messy, messy tenant. Cute house, but it was hard to look past the clutter. I had to pass…not just because of the mess but also the fact that a multiple murderer lived there just before he committed two murders. Um, creepy and no thanks.)

[equisusan]

[QUOTE=RugBug;7638960]

(I had to pass…not just because of the mess but also the fact that a multiple murderer lived there just before he committed two murders. Um, creepy and no thanks.)[/QUOTE]

Yea that would be a non-starter for me,