Wasn’t it Peter Leone? 84 for LA Team?
Then, Leslie was placed on the team over Kursinski, which caused more problems.
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This article from a few years back mentions the lawsuit by Debbie Dolan, and the perhaps unintended results of the strictly objective selection system, which is why it did not last for long.
I sort of think maybe Armand Leone was one of the lawyers involved in the lawsuit, but I won’t swear to that part. I just have a vague recollection that he was connected somehow.
I know somebody who came this/close to making the Olympic team for Barcelona as a result of the new objective system, but similar to Greg Best, he was eliminated from an Olympic slot by one bad class out of the six trials at the very last one at Gladstone.
If they had decided to only hold five trials that year and everything had gone the same way, he would have gone to the Olympics in 1992.
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How well do show jumpers (horses) hold their “form” and how are they handled so the horses can peak at the right time but still show they deserve to be on the Team? (My uneducated concern, seems like they have to do a lot of jumping and showing this spring?).
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I was talking to somebody that was an Olympian, but not a jumper. He was saying how a person had to have a laser focus on that goal, to the exclusion of so many other facets of their life and how few people really had that kind of drive. Which wasn’t really that bad of a thing to not want to give up your life for it. If you wanted it, you had to leave behind a lot of things and sacrifice personal relationships. He wasn’t disparaging the effort but felt that it took a whole special mindset that most people did not have and talent was not enough.
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I think that already applies to an awful lot of horse people who compete at the very top level and are successful at it.
I would imagine it is similar for many sports, but definitely with horses, the whole venture is pretty all consuming once you get near the top of the pyramid. And certainly as you are climbing the pyramid as well.
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From a practical standpoint, there is probably also some consideration of the prize money involved, or lack thereof.
With all the shows that offer huge amounts of prize money now, skipping a bunch of those to focus on a run at the Olympics, and then actually go through the quarantine process and attend the Olympics if you manage to get a slot on the team, might seem impractical to some people.
Obviously not everyone, but some people.
And it’s not as if a horse person is too likely to get on the cover of a Wheaties box any time soon. Or land a huge endorsement deal with Nike or whatever.
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It’s kind of interesting that Brazil just names the riders, not the horses.
Here’s the, I think, official Olympic list of qualified riders/horses for the Olympic show jumping. https://inside.fei.org/system/files/Paris%202024%20OG_Jumping%20Nominated%20Entries%20List_FINAL.pdf
I think both Peter Leone and Debbie Dolan each protested being left off Olympic teams at different times, as did the eventer Kerry Milliken and The Pirate, who broke her leg during a mandatory outing but was the best combination the US had.
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I think we have to decide if we want to be sending teams to the Olympics that can be competitive or ones who we deem “worthy” of getting there.
The sport is where it is, we cannot change that funding it at the top levels is wildly expensive. We all want to root for underdogs who worked hard and broke through despite the odds against them.
But we also really want to win team medals. And those are going to go to the best horse/rider pairs. So we cannot ignore that people with independent means will have a leg up.
Independently wealthy riders also have more luxury in developing their horses more slowly than some of the most wealthy owners will allow. I used to train with someone who rode a few horses for a high profile owner and the pressure for results or have the horse taken away was tremendous. I think it’s why Kent prefers to buy younger horses and develop them and maintain some ownership, he has a bit more control in what they do and how they progress.
Look, I’m not a big fan of Karl and his arrogance. But I do respect his horse management. Caracole is not the first tricky mare he’s had, the results he’s gotten out of Kalinka are impressive. When things go sideways for him, he does step horses down to rebuild confidence. Or in the case of a talented horse he doesn’t gel with, he’s not too proud to pass the ride, like he did with Cashpaid, who he still owns a part of.
People are welcomed to hate on his riding and his attitude, but the fact is, he is getting exceptional results out of a brilliant mare, who is not the most straightforward ride. So I think he deserves some credit just as a rider, wealthy or not, for being able to get as far as he has with her.
To me, the biggest question is not Caracole and Karl’s ability to perform as a team. It’s his mental game when it’s a team situation. The pressure is totally different. And I think he really did not do himself any favors at the PanAm games. Kent, Laura, and McLain have each really delivered in clutch situations on horses with much less ability than Caracole. Like we would all take Beezie on a donkey most days bc of her incredible mental fortitude in high pressure situations.
So I can see it both ways for Robert Ridland. But I think we need to be honest that because the sport has gotten so expensive, we are naturally going to have more independently wealthy riders if we want to win medals. That doesn’t mean there isn’t room for the Skylar Wireman’s we are all rooting for. It just means riders like her have to be keep honing the interpersonal skills it takes to find owners to support her.
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Bingo.
I think Kent in particular has a long history of getting more results out of horses at the top levels than anyone might have expected of them, although McLain and Beezie have certainly done that as well.
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I think you summed it up perfectly although I feel with a bit more experience Karl could be an asset to the team, but not yet. The purpose of the Olympics is to win medals and I think Kent, Laura and McLain are our best shot at doing that. I do think Karl deserves to be the reserve though. If only they would go back to the four rider team format.
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World of Show Jumping published the horses
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Probably unpopular opinion, but I think I still remember 2012 a little too clearly to feel this way. Amazing riders can only make up for so much. I remember watching the early rounds of the individual qualifier where Via Volo looked a bit deer in the headlights, and they ended up eliminated.
Because Beezie is the rider she is, they finished the games very strong when with anyone else it would have just kept going downhill. But if we have the opportunity to have depth of rider experience in Laura and either Kent or McLain, and have an incredible horse on the team in Caracole, and build towards the potential future of the sport with Karl…I’m not going to rule that out in favor of McLain being able to pull a win out of his pocket on the strength of him being McLain Ward.
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Lillie Keenan is at Spruce Meadows and I suspect since the announcer said that her horses are in Spruce, and her Olympic prospect did the Pan American Cup on Sunday that the short list is shorter. One can wonder did she read the writing on the wall or did Robert give the riders an updated list?
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I’m not even sure it’s as simple as he just choked. Karl does have a decent amount of World Cup Finals experience (which isn’t the same I know but its not nothing). Plus it was speed day when he had the issue
They were a relatively new partnership and he had switched the bridle the former rider used because he didn’t like the feel of the hackamore. They’d been ok in the lead up but I don’t think the courses were as technical/had the atmosphere of the Pan Ams. Clearly it didn’t work at the Pan Ams. They’ve since come up with a routine where he warms up in a bit and switches to the hackamore right before he goes in and it seems to work.
As someone else mentioned Beezie and Via Volo struggled at the 2012 Olympics. McLain and Kent are great riders, but do they have the real championship horse. Karl has less experience but is sitting on a championship horse
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It may have always been her plan to go to Spruce, I think there is a 5* next week and she may wanted to compete in it. It’s nothing for these horses and riders to hop on a plane to Europe
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I follow eventing much more than sj, and I remember the deal with Kerry Miliken. IIRC, she had two horses to ride at Kentucky to qualify. She broke her leg in a fall, and if this was in 88, I think I took a picture of it! But anyway, I think she understood Pirate was good enough to be picked. But with a broken leg, she couldn’t ride him. I think he was the best horse that year, and she did sue. It didn’t end well.
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Kerry broke her leg on her first ride, HMS Dash, so wasn’t able to ride The Pirate in KY which was a mandatory outing. My friend was one of the selectors for the Olympics that year, all she had to do was complete and she would have made the team. I don’t think she brought a lawsuit though, IIRC it went to arbitration or mediation, but regardless the rule was that she had to complete KY on The Pirate to make the team, which she did not do. Personally I think they should have made an exception since they were one of the best if not the best combination the US had that year.
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I seem to recall something similar happened with Margie Engle one year.
She had a really great horse. I think it might have been that big bay mare. And they were really on a hot streak, but unfortunately Margie got hurt and was not able to do one of the designated trials or something.
Or maybe she did the trials and then got hurt afterwards, so there was a question about whether she would heal in time to go to the games. Something like that. Very unfortunate.
I do sort of question the concept of the last mandatory outing for just that reason. If you have your team already picked, why make them do one last competition where you take the chance of a horse or rider getting hurt?
That crossed my mind this year with the US eventing team. I believe one of the riders fell off at the recent mandatory outing, although it might have been from a different horse. And luckily the person was not hurt, but it could have just as easily gone the other way, and then that person would miss the Olympics after getting that far.
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