Sick Kitty and ER Vet issues (long and kind of rant-ish)

Wow, I am lucky to be near 2 excellent and affordable ER vet clinics.

We brought a pet mouse to one because he was in serious respiratory distress and it was a holiday weekend. We were told before coming in that it was $80 to see a vet…the receptionist was surprised we said ‘no biggie, we’re on our way’. Vet thanked us for bringing our mouse in and not letting him suffer. She did an exam and said the best thing to do was put him to sleep. We were not charged for the visit because the vet said she was “touched that someone cared that much about their mouse”.

Second ER visit there was with our 8 week old puppy that came down with kennel cough and bronchitis. Very quick treatment, bill was around $400 (included nebulizer treatment there, antibiotics, cough medicine).

Other ER visit was at the other 24 hour clinic. Monster doggie came home from daycare with a gaping wound in his side. He was lightly sedated, scrubbed, and stapled/stitched back together, and sent home on antibiotics. Bill was about $250.

It costs a lot more to staff a clinic 24/7. I work nights and it sucks…no way I would do it without a hefty shift differential and thus I expect to pay more for services on non-standard hours.

[QUOTE=TheresanAppfurthat;5623388]
Anyone ranting about emergency after hours clinics gets my full support. (Donning flame suit here). The issues aren’t always money but how they go about getting it and the way front office staff treats people coming in with often dearly beloved pets in dire straits. OMG. What I have seen, you do not want to know. I have had direct experience with local ER/after hours here and frankly before visiting one of those hell rooms I would get a vet to come out to my home and put my animal to sleep rather than take the animal to the local ER here in this area.

The directly abusive and aggressive behavior of “twenty-somethings with attitude” at local ER in this area toward people who bring animals in, animals that they love and care about and are worried about, is unconscionable and inexcusable.

Corollary issue: what people with pet insurance do not realize is that all pet insurance is reimbursement-based. They may think that an emergency after-hours clinic is going to “accept insurance.” They would be wrong.

Strategies ahead of the event to keep in mind: always have a wad of cash ready to throw at these greedy vultures who have zero interest in the welfare of the animal and an overwhelming desire to take as much money as possible from the pet’s owner/guardian/whatever - which explains the incredibly repetitive testing they demand; keep in mind that many ERs do not accept checks nor do they always accept credit cards and oh BTW no they are not going to let you leave your bleeding or vomiting or seizing animal there while you run to the atm, “take the animal out of here and come back when you have cash” is the way you likely will be treated. Always always always have at least a thousand dollars cash stashed just in case. Seriously. I have in my six decades of animal guardianship never seen an ER giving you an “estimate” for demanded up-front payment less than a grand. And that estimate will likely be exceeded. Sincere efforts there to exceed it, with more duplicative testing if necessary.

ER clinics need to do these things: a) have a fund for willing people to donate to for those who cannot afford emergency treatment b) have financial aid information readily at hand for same c) take some lessons in basic civility, respect and good manners d) lose the attitude generated by their mistaken belief that they have life and death control over you and your animal.[/QUOTE]

WHOA THERE HONEY.
This past week alone we have had 2 pets that needed major work (surgery). Vets and techs put in hours on them, and not to mention the drugs, etc.And low balled the estimate and “ignored” alot of stuff the dogs got because the pet needed them. Both were cases that, had they been charged for properly, would have easily been $600-800. Bills were “modified” to be in the couple of hundred dollar range. Neither owner paid one red cent. But got their dogs.

I treated an old chihuahua that had been in active labor for 24 hrs on Sunday afternoon. She came in at 2:30. I started working on her then (even though I had other patients waiting on me and several diagnostic proceedures I really needed to get done). The puppies were HUGE, and 2 of the 3 were not coming in a way that is easy to deliver. Momma dog weighed 6# at presentation and 5# at discharge. I have very small hands. It was all I could do to get one finger in to help deliver a puppy. This poor old girl realy really needed a c-section. Our usual estimate for a c-section will be in the $1,200 to $1,500 range if there are no major complications. Owner couldn’t afford that. I worked the estimate down and down and down, eliminating things like IV fluids, pain meds, charging a surgery fee for a spay instead of a c-section, etc. Even at that low number, the owner couldn’t afford it. So instead, this cold hearted money grubbing vet spent 3 hours delivering puppies that really had no business coming out the back hole of this poor old girl. For a whopping $200. And even at that I didn’t charge for the drugs I used (oxytocin). $15 per puppy (3 delivered). And a strip of clavamox. I gave her some metacam to go home with. Gave, as in no cost. So for 3 hours of work by 2 doctors and 4 technicians we didn’t make ANY money. We LOST money. Oh, and I x-rayed her too, twice. And didn’t charge for those either.
SO DON’T YOU DARE MAKE COMMENTS LIKE THIS.

And if any of our reception staff are rude, etc, they don’t have a job very long.

Boy, did you ever rattle my cage with these sorts of comments.

OH, and how about you start the fund that is supposed to support all the people who can’t afford to treat their neglected animals.

You need more than a flame suit here honey. I am absolutely livid and there is no way any typing can possibly convey how much.

I could rant to you for days but I have better things to do since I am actually HOME tonight. After 3 days of 14+ hr work days working as a greedy vulture who has zero interest in the welfare of the animal and an overwhelming desire to take as much money as possible from the pet’s owner/guardian/whatever.

Now I will just go spit before I explode.

Meghan Richey, DVM, MS, DACVA

I agree with Meghan 100%!!! Could you possibly have been more insulting Theresa to those of us who work incredibly hard providing care? To suggest that we have no interest in the welfare of animals is one of, if not,the rottenest things you could have said. And if you think you’re getting attitude when you go to an ER, it’s probably a reflection of your atrocious attitude. If ER clinics are going to remain open, they need to be paid enough to cover the bills.

[QUOTE=dalpal;5619719]
Most be something in the air. I was in the ER with my elderly orange boy this AM. He was just off, then I saw him straining in the liter box, couldn’t tell if he was trying to urinate or defecate.

Got to the ER and was greeted by a very friendly vet student, who turned out to be one of my former students of six years ago. :smiley: And she remembered my cat from her flute lessons from years back.[/QUOTE]

You have an orange cat and taught flute lessons? Must be a rule. My flute teacher had a big orange boy who never came out when her students were there…except me. Because Mom is allergic. So he had to go hang out with her, sit on her coat…

And I paid about the same $400-odd for Jet’s two-day stay, catheterization, and meds for his UTI and blockage. I thought that was pretty reasonable, all things considered. But my area’s not super-wealthy and this clinic in particular knows not to really push expensive treatments.

[QUOTE=Marshfield;5624114]
I agree with Meghan 100%!!! Could you possibly have been more insulting Theresa to those of us who work incredibly hard providing care? To suggest that we have no interest in the welfare of animals is one of, if not,the rottenest things you could have said. And if you think you’re getting attitude when you go to an ER, it’s probably a reflection of your atrocious attitude. If ER clinics are going to remain open, they need to be paid enough to cover the bills.[/QUOTE]

AMEN.
I couldn’t even respond to the horrible things that were said…it’s people like that who negate all the wonderful things that we can do for people and their animals. I can’t even begin to express my feelings…Theresanappforthat I hope you NEVER set foot into my ER. Ungrateful, revolting, disgusting attitude. You don’t know even a fraction of what happens in an ER hospital to make it possible to take GOOD care of animals in need no matter what time of day. You think it all revolves around money…what you probably have no comprehension of is that every single vet I know would do their job for FREE if they could and didn’t have to worry about bills. Things are NOT done unnecessarily; maybe you’re just not used to good QUALITY medicine done in emergency hospitals. God forbid you ever need that service again.

I gotta say, the anti-ER poster’s rant and proposed solutions struck me all wrong.

Owner gets special treatment-- from office staff and financial aid-- because their beloved animal is fubar and they don’t have the funds? Then euthanize it. That’s not the worst “solution” to an expensive animal crisis ever.

But I have found that when owners really step up to their responsibility-- and the buck stops with the owher-- then vets are more than happy to work with what they have, including constraints.

I was once part of a “broken-legged barn cat found by boarders on a sunday afternoon” type situation. BM was called and, of course, wanted no part of a big vet bill. Others with me wanted him treated… but not to pay for that. We took him to the nearby university clinic. The clinic did the standard “show me the money” while my friends made more phone calls to find people who would pay.

I was the hard-a$$ in the situation and said, “I don’t care what you vets do in the end, but leaving him unstabilized and in pain is unconscionable. I’ll pay for that part while you everyone figures out what to do next.” I think everyone was surprised. The cat didn’t need to suffer, they wouldn’t be cheated and someone stepped up. A vet tech ended up saving this cat. She called a rescue group who ended up taking over this cat’s treatment. The cat also saved himself. Usually an independent hunter who took no crap from anyone, this cat never raised a claw during this episode. He was in trouble and he knew it so it was especially nice to see everyone doing just their little piece to help him out.

[QUOTE=Pancakes;5624178]
AMEN.
You think it all revolves around money…what you probably have no comprehension of is that every single vet I know would do their job for FREE if they could and didn’t have to worry about bills. Things are NOT done unnecessarily; maybe you’re just not used to good QUALITY medicine done in emergency hospitals. God forbid you ever need that service again.[/QUOTE]

Trust me, if I could afford to live without an income, I would still be doing what I do. I love my job. I love the animals. I love helping them. I love helping the owners. I hate getting screwed though.

I do CRITICAL CARE, and referral care. Yes, “I” cost alot (no, I don’t get much of it, it all mostly overhead). Yes, I repeat alot of tests. I need to know what is going on with your pet before it is fubared, or how to fix the fubur and see how my fixit plan is working to stay ahead of it. Your regular vet doesn’t deal with the cases we see. And, while not meaning to be demeaning, they can’t successfully treat most of them.

Euthanasia is always a choice. And is often the most humane choice. Unfortunately some people have to make a choice between caring for their 2 legged family and caring for their 4 legged family member. I cannot, in good concious, ask an owner to drop several thousand dollars on their pet when they are struggling to make their own regular daily ends meet. If I had the financial wherewithall to do it all for free, I would in a minute. But I am not independantly wealthy. (Wish I were though!)

The other unfortunate facts of life are:

  1. you choose to get the pet. no one forced you to
  2. you are financially responsible for its care, not me
  3. you made the choice to come see me. I am not the only vet in town
  4. most of the things I treat were either totally preventable, or should have been seen by your regular veterinarian several days ago when it first got sick. (I dread the ones that are “he’s been sick since Monday” and it is now Friday afternoon.)
  5. using an emergency clinic as your regular vet is not smart financially. Get a regular vet and build a relationship with them.

End of my rant. gonna go ride while it is sunny and nice and I am off!

[QUOTE=TheresanAppfurthat;5623388]
Anyone ranting about emergency after hours clinics gets my full support. (Donning flame suit here). The issues aren’t always money but how they go about getting it and the way front office staff treats people coming in with often dearly beloved pets in dire straits. OMG. What I have seen, you do not want to know. I have had direct experience with local ER/after hours here and frankly before visiting one of those hell rooms I would get a vet to come out to my home and put my animal to sleep rather than take the animal to the local ER here in this area.

The directly abusive and aggressive behavior of “twenty-somethings with attitude” at local ER in this area toward people who bring animals in, animals that they love and care about and are worried about, is unconscionable and inexcusable.

Corollary issue: what people with pet insurance do not realize is that all pet insurance is reimbursement-based. They may think that an emergency after-hours clinic is going to “accept insurance.” They would be wrong.

Strategies ahead of the event to keep in mind: always have a wad of cash ready to throw at these greedy vultures who have zero interest in the welfare of the animal and an overwhelming desire to take as much money as possible from the pet’s owner/guardian/whatever - which explains the incredibly repetitive testing they demand; keep in mind that many ERs do not accept checks nor do they always accept credit cards and oh BTW no they are not going to let you leave your bleeding or vomiting or seizing animal there while you run to the atm, “take the animal out of here and come back when you have cash” is the way you likely will be treated. Always always always have at least a thousand dollars cash stashed just in case. Seriously. I have in my six decades of animal guardianship never seen an ER giving you an “estimate” for demanded up-front payment less than a grand. And that estimate will likely be exceeded. Sincere efforts there to exceed it, with more duplicative testing if necessary.

ER clinics need to do these things: a) have a fund for willing people to donate to for those who cannot afford emergency treatment b) have financial aid information readily at hand for same c) take some lessons in basic civility, respect and good manners d) lose the attitude generated by their mistaken belief that they have life and death control over you and your animal.[/QUOTE]

Vets are NOT charity workers!!! Holy cow! You have clearly NEVER worked in a vets office. I have! and guess what? Running an EMERGENCY hospital costs tons of money, often in the neighborhood of HUNDRENDS of THOUSANDS of dollars a year and even MILLIONS!

Vet school (Veterinarian/Tech/Assistant) is NOT free and infact is extremely expensive. They have to pay back those loans you know. The OVER HEAD on an Emergency facility is massive, plus the insurance and all the special costs that go into running it not to mention PAY ROLL. Vets have to get paid, the Tech have to get paid, the Assistants have to get paid, the landlord has to get paid, the insurance has to get paid!

It blows my mind that many people really honestly think that these facilities should be a freakin charity! Guess what suga, when you bring in a pet and it’s care racks up a 2k vet bill in two days and it STILL dies after you pay the bill the Emergency is NOT “making bank”. There is a markup on medication for a reason. It’s the balance the actual cost of RUNNING the place! Do you think all that really advanced equipment was free? Do you have any idea the BUSINESS (not charity) loans those places use to BUY extremely expensive cutting edge equipment? All that has to be PAID for!

I get that running a vet clinic is expensive. But why the does it seem that the same procedure, depending on the clinic, varies SO much?? And why does neutering a cat/dog cost so darn much now? I finally saw an ad on CL about a kinda-local H.S. that was advertising lower-cost spay/neuter (So happy to see that- since no one in our area does).

Of course, whenever we have an animal emergency, it WILL be after hours, on a weekend and our vet either will not be on call, or will be out of town. :frowning:

So sometimes, there is “only one clinic” that can help you. (Says the owner of Rowdy, the now $1000 barn cat).

Our regular small animal clinic saved my puppies, for which I will forever be grateful. Kind of a long story:

Had a litter of Collie puppies a few years back. Took them down to the cities to see the opthamologist for their eye checks, at 8 weeks old. These pups had their first shots, but not as early as some give them, (years before I had a puppy who we believe contracted enceph/brain swelling from vaccinations given at 6 weeks :frowning: Totally random and rare, but that was the vet’s best guess).

Home from the eye checks and a week later, in the evening, noticed one puppy not eating/lethargic/drooling. First thought was PARVO! Only place they could have picked it up was the opthamologists’. No contact with new people/other dogs/etc. Told Mom I thought we had a Parvo puppy! :frowning: She wanted me to bring him into the on-call clinic. I wanted to wait until morning and contact our regular clinic but was outvoted, and ended up bringing pup into on-call clinic to find out what I’d already guessed, (to the tune of I think around $300), that puppy had Parvo. Had to pay that directly, they don’t allow payments. They told me the pups would need to be hospitalized, it would cost a MINIMUM of $1000 per puppy, and I’ll repeat this: NO payments. Must pay in full at time of services. Did I mentioned I had 8 puppies in the litter? Eight thousand dollars (At a minimum!). Shed some tears at the vets office, I’m going to have to let all my puppies just die? Well, thanks for your time, we’ll contact our regular vet in the morning and see what they say.

I can’t remember exactly what our regular vet quoted me for prices in the beginning, if he even tried to do that. What I DO remember is that he stayed home from his vacation to take care of my pups. And he saved 6 of them. And for taking care of 8 puppies, in and out of the clinic for a week, on IV fluids, medications, taking care of the 2 that died, etc…he charged me $1200. And he took payments. We had 6 beautiful puppies that lived, and I was able to afford his services. I think of our Dr. often when vet service prices come up, and typing this now makes me realize that as much as I verbally thanked him, (and joked about naming my firstborn after him), I should send them a card and re-thank them for what they did. I don’t know how I’ll afford small-animal vet services once he retires, guess I’ll just have to have less pets! Or no pets?

And if anyone is wondering, Rowdy became an even more expensive cat when the kitties were 2+ weeks old and she developed mastitis… (Really, dear Rowdy! You hadn’t cost enough???). Hence the “$1000 barn cat”. So she had to be treated for that, and we had to hand-raise the kitties the rest of the way. They’re about 10 weeks old now, found great homes for 2 of them and are down to just “the twins”. I think I have a home lined up for one of them, but it’s a hard decision on whether to keep the last one or not. I have a lot of time and love and money invested in this litter of generic DSH kittens!! :wink:

Rowdy became an even more expensive cat when the kitties were 2+ weeks old and she developed mastitis…

Rowdy would’ve been a less expensive cat if you’d had her spayed…

Just sayin…

As for payment plans, do you ask the grocery store to take payment plans? Veterinary offices are not financial institutions, and while it’s fantastic that some clinics are kind enough to offer them, I certainly don’t think it should be expected. For future reference, you should ask about CareCredit.

You’re correct – having animals is expensive. That’s why I only have one dog.

PS - Parvo doesn’t require contact with new dogs or people. It can live in the soil for months.

And PPS - Your vet likely LOST money by treating your 8 puppies for only $1200 and missed his vacation. I’m glad you appreciate him – you should.

[QUOTE=1sock;5626151]
I get that running a vet clinic is expensive. But why the does it seem that the same procedure, depending on the clinic, varies SO much?? And why does neutering a cat/dog cost so darn much now? I finally saw an ad on CL about a kinda-local H.S. that was advertising lower-cost spay/neuter (So happy to see that- since no one in our area does).

Of course, whenever we have an animal emergency, it WILL be after hours, on a weekend and our vet either will not be on call, or will be out of town. :frowning:

So sometimes, there is “only one clinic” that can help you. (Says the owner of Rowdy, the now $1000 barn cat).

Our regular small animal clinic saved my puppies, for which I will forever be grateful. Kind of a long story:

Had a litter of Collie puppies a few years back. Took them down to the cities to see the opthamologist for their eye checks, at 8 weeks old. These pups had their first shots, but not as early as some give them, (years before I had a puppy who we believe contracted enceph/brain swelling from vaccinations given at 6 weeks :frowning: Totally random and rare, but that was the vet’s best guess).

Home from the eye checks and a week later, in the evening, noticed one puppy not eating/lethargic/drooling. First thought was PARVO! Only place they could have picked it up was the opthamologists’. No contact with new people/other dogs/etc. Told Mom I thought we had a Parvo puppy! :frowning: She wanted me to bring him into the on-call clinic. I wanted to wait until morning and contact our regular clinic but was outvoted, and ended up bringing pup into on-call clinic to find out what I’d already guessed, (to the tune of I think around $300), that puppy had Parvo. Had to pay that directly, they don’t allow payments. They told me the pups would need to be hospitalized, it would cost a MINIMUM of $1000 per puppy, and I’ll repeat this: NO payments. Must pay in full at time of services. Did I mentioned I had 8 puppies in the litter? Eight thousand dollars (At a minimum!). Shed some tears at the vets office, I’m going to have to let all my puppies just die? Well, thanks for your time, we’ll contact our regular vet in the morning and see what they say.

I can’t remember exactly what our regular vet quoted me for prices in the beginning, if he even tried to do that. What I DO remember is that he stayed home from his vacation to take care of my pups. And he saved 6 of them. And for taking care of 8 puppies, in and out of the clinic for a week, on IV fluids, medications, taking care of the 2 that died, etc…he charged me $1200. And he took payments. We had 6 beautiful puppies that lived, and I was able to afford his services. I think of our Dr. often when vet service prices come up, and typing this now makes me realize that as much as I verbally thanked him, (and joked about naming my firstborn after him), I should send them a card and re-thank them for what they did. I don’t know how I’ll afford small-animal vet services once he retires, guess I’ll just have to have less pets! Or no pets?

And if anyone is wondering, Rowdy became an even more expensive cat when the kitties were 2+ weeks old and she developed mastitis… (Really, dear Rowdy! You hadn’t cost enough???). Hence the “$1000 barn cat”. So she had to be treated for that, and we had to hand-raise the kitties the rest of the way. They’re about 10 weeks old now, found great homes for 2 of them and are down to just “the twins”. I think I have a home lined up for one of them, but it’s a hard decision on whether to keep the last one or not. I have a lot of time and love and money invested in this litter of generic DSH kittens!! ;)[/QUOTE]

Fees vary from vet to vet based on lots of things. To make it a short list:
What the anesthetic protocol is: premedicatons such as sedatives and pain meds? IV cath and fluids? IV cath at all? What drug is used for anesthetic induction? Are they on gas? What sort of monitoring is done? (this varies from only the vet doing surgery hopefully noting that the patient is still breathing to having an actually multiparameter monitor measuring ECG/blood pressure/SpO2/ETCO2/Temp with a certified technician recording the vitals every 5 minutes). What is monitored post op (is the pet just put on the floor or in a cage and not looked at until it moves or is it actually monitored/supported/etc)?
How is the surgery done: cap/mask/gown for surgeon? type of suture used? how much draping? how is the prep done?
Is there pre-op blood work done? (I have a personal opinion on that I don’t want to go there)
How long is the pet in the hospital after surgery?
Are pain medicines dispensed?
How much is their overhead?
In short: a spay is not a spay is not a spay.
My cost on just drugs and suture to do a spay is darned near $100. That doesn’t include my time, the cost of the monitor, the cost of the pack and its prep and maintance, the cost of the gas and oxygen, etc.

Parvo: Highly unlikely it was at an ophthomology practice. Incubation period can be longer than a week.
Parvo cost can vary alot depending, again, on how it is treated and how bad it is. Ours are treated with IV fluids, blood checks for glucose and protein to see if they need supplemented, IV antibiotics, anti-vomiting medicaitons, cages cleaned every couple of hours, 3-4 time a day physical exams, are cared for 24 hrs a day, etc. The average cost of an average parvo at my place is $1,000-1,200. They are alot of work!!
Yes, I know vets who treat with SQ fluids as out patients, or who do put them in the hospital on IV fluids but only from 8-6. Is the survival rate different? I don’t know. I do know that the ones we see are very very sick. Don’t know about the others.
And yes, I require a $1,000 deposit before I will admit the puppy. Why? Because the other vets that don’t account for a large part of our accounts recievable. Most people who can’t afford to vaccinate a puppy properly can’t afford to treat them either. yes, there are exceptions but those are prob less than 50% of them.

I am sorry if this sounds cold hearted but to give up a much needed and deserved vacation to generate $1,200 is not smart business. But if he was ok with it, so be it. I know our doors wouldn’t be able to say open that way.

We dont’ take payments because we dont’ have a regular, dpendable client base that we will see over and over. That is not our intent!! As such, it is highly unlikely we will ever see you again as you have no attachment to us.

As for a $1000 barn cat…I had a really hot strain of calicivirus come thru my barn. It about killed my older and most favorite barn cat and got another one really sick. Older kitty spent 2 weeks in the hospital, other spent a week. MY COST: over $1,000 in “stuff” and lab work.

Hate to say it but we pay the same amount for drugs, supplies, electricity, water other regular and usual costs as human hospitals. We just undervalue our services alot more. TBH, I really think I am worth a bit more than $43/hr after 30 years in practice, a masters, board certification in one specialty and a residency in a second. We have a part time tech that is also a nurse. She makes quite a bit more than I do. And has benefits way better than mine. My trainer charges more per hour for lessons than I make. Even trainers less qualified than him charge more!!

From my skewed perspective, there is something wrong with this picture. And the bitching.

Thank you, Meghan, for stating again what I was trying to get across. :yes:

We have an AWESOME vet ER. I never hesitate to run in when in doubt, and it’s odd how pets seem to only manage to injure themselves/get sick late at night, on holidays, or on long weekends, isn’t it? I do have pet insurance so I don’t really worry about the cost.
Caring, friendly, helpful, good at diagnosing and treating, if you need to euth they are so supportive. Yeah, they charge a lot more than your regular vet but you’ve got to expect that. An ER has to equip itself with far more equipment, in house full lab, more staff- overhead that gets added on the bill.
Although once they kept my dog there over the weekend getting intensive care without charging me a dime because she’d reacted badly to the chemo the same clinic had given her on Friday- they figured they had (inadvertently) caused the problem so no charge.

May I ask a question that has always perplexed me? Who decides what “off hours” and regular hours are? Why are the regular hours the ones during which most people work? Is it impossible to find a vet who would like the night shift to be his/her normal shift?

I am a night person, and if my job allowed me to work 11 p.m. to 7 a.m. I’d do it in a heartbeat. Instead I’m a 9-5 worker (7 to 7 with commute) who tries to fit everything into Saturdays and vacations. So that’s my perspective in asking this.

I would gladly take my dog or cat to a 10:00 p.m. or 11:00 p.m. regular vet appointment. I’d bet that people who work swing shift would take their animals for appointments in the wee hours of the morning. I sure would like to talk to someone that isn’t half asleep when my foal is born at 2:00 a.m. and doesn’t nurse right away. Not begrudging the sleeping vet, btw, more wondering why there isn’t someone somewhere that is awake.

So why is everything so firmly entrenched in the “workday” model? Does anyone have a vet (equine or small animal) that works, say, 4 p.m. to midnight as regular hours?

Joz, I think one reason is that it can be really hard to find enough qualified and responsible people to work some of those shifts. Besides, most people that spend hundreds of thousands on their education want to work the hours they want to work. :wink: And for most, that isn’t 2nd shift of weekends.

I worked at a clinic for nearly 10 years. We were open 7am to 8pm M-F, Saturday from 7-12. 2 doctor practice. About 30 staff in total. We had a lot of drop off in the a.m., pick up after work type clients. Shoot, we even had a drive thru for prescription pick ups! LOL I loved working there.

We also handled our own emergency call. That is something I really miss. Being able to see a vet you have a relationship with on emergency. But I realize that’s tough when you have a larger number of clients.

I am not a fan of the local Emergency Clinic owner/vet. But I won’t bore you with the long drawn out story. The short version is that that particular Dr. charged my $80 for a physical and never did one and told me I should wait til my regular vet opened in 30 min and let her deal with it. He wouldn’t even pull the blood so we could get some labs going–didn’t think there was much wrong. By the end of that day, I was in Detroit at Animal Neurology and MRI Center dropping 5k. THOSE people are wonderful btw. Just fabulous. And my dog is fine now.

[QUOTE=MeghanDACVA;5625188]
Yes, I repeat alot of tests. I need to know what is going on with your pet before it is fubared, or how to fix the fubur and see how my fixit plan is working to stay ahead of it. Your regular vet doesn’t deal with the cases we see. And, while not meaning to be demeaning, they can’t successfully treat most of them.[/QUOTE]

A serious question about this: Why do you all need to repeat a test done elsewhere within a reasonable time frame?

Truly, I never understand this and therefore get paranoid or huffy. Are you padding the bill? Do you not believe me or the other vet when I hand you the results of the last version of the test done? I’m more honest and intelligent than I look, but I do need to be educated. I’m good with motivations I can understand. Because this doesn’t work like human medicine where it’s “treat now, ask about cost later” I also want to have some part in deciding how “gentlemen… we can rebuild him” or “meh, he’s livestock” our treatment will be.

Sometimes I think it’s that I bring a “large animal” perspective to my relationship with small animal vets and it’s unwelcome. IME, horse vets dispense a lot of education along with treatment, so I expect that of all doctors. Woe be to the MD who ever has to treat me as the patient!

I’d hate to add up what I’ve spent at the vets for my animals. Some noteworhty ones that we joke helped pay for our lovely new vet’s building are:

  • $400 off the bat for the “free” cat to get spayed and have a small bald area that she was bothering lasered - turned out to be a 40 stitches surgery on her spine to remove an embedded piece of plastic from when some GSDs attacked her in her crate (long story)
  • seizure diagnosis and treatment, TPLO surgery, melanoma vaccine clinical trial, sudden onset blindness and ataxia (ivermectin poisoning), and the list goes on for our Maggie the Chesapeake Bay Retriever
  • corneal tear on new chihuahua puppy (puppy, meet nasty cat) that would not heal and required 2 weeks in the hospital for eye drops 4 times a day and then a visit to the specialist at UF, gastrointestinal “garbage gut” that required 2 weeks in the hospital
  • 2 diabetic cats and all of the accompanying bloodwork etc as needed (I have test strips and can do the insulin and daily work myself, the bloodwork is only maintenance or if they have an issue).

I could go on and on. We go to our wonderful regular vet, and have such a relationship with them (I have 5 cats and 4 dogs and 13 horses - the horses with a horse vet though lol), and they have an on-call number if needed. They are wonderful and that is partly because I am there just about every weekend buying special food for the corgi, getting someones nails trimmed or buying flea/tick/heartworm supplies every month for the cats and dogs or bringing someone in for shots etc. I have a CARE card for when we need to go to UF, and the rest I pay as I go at the vets. It is VERY expensive to own pets, but we plan for it and deal with it.

Bless the good vets, and yes, our local ER is not the same, but they are there for emergencies if needed and we at least have the choice to go to UF (which we do).

[QUOTE=mvp;5627137]
A serious question about this: Why do you all need to repeat a test done elsewhere within a reasonable time frame?

Truly, I never understand this and therefore get paranoid or huffy. Are you padding the bill? Do you not believe me or the other vet when I hand you the results of the last version of the test done? I’m more honest and intelligent than I look, but I do need to be educated. I’m good with motivations I can understand. Because this doesn’t work like human medicine where it’s “treat now, ask about cost later” I also want to have some part in deciding how “gentlemen… we can rebuild him” or “meh, he’s livestock” our treatment will be.

Sometimes I think it’s that I bring a “large animal” perspective to my relationship with small animal vets and it’s unwelcome. IME, horse vets dispense a lot of education along with treatment, so I expect that of all doctors. Woe be to the MD who ever has to treat me as the patient![/QUOTE]

It depends on the bloodwork/labs and what time frame you’re talking about. You ask a really good question though, and one I get a lot – why recheck? “But we just had them done!”

Certain values, such as kidney enzymes, can literally change overnight. Your cat that had mild kidney dysfunction yesterday looks even worse today? I’m going to recheck values to see how much worse, because values can double overnight indicating rapid loss of function or massive dehydration. Bilirubin is another one of those. If I see a yellow cat and you say he wasn’t yellow last week, we need to run full bloodwork to see why (usually liver/gallbladder, but can be red blood cell too). I could go on…

Cell blood counts (RBCs, WBCs) can also spike and drop RAPIDLY. Rechecking these tells me if I need to be really worried about a life-threatening infection and need to add more medication, or if I just need to hold tight for now. Finding a trend in RBC counts tell me if your dog is anemic like he always has been, or if he may need a transfusion tonight.

We also need to see starting points for some blood and urine values so we can see if our treatment is effective. I ALWAYS get a urine specific gravity (measure of concentration) before starting IV fluids and I don’t care if your vet did it yesterday; it can change and I need to know a starting point. Getting at least packed cell volume PCV/TS (also known as hematocrit and total solids) is something I need to know so I can decide what rate of fluids I need to give, and when I need to stop.

Electrolytes (potassium, sodium, and chloride) need to be checked since they can also rapidly change according to hydration status or disease state. Electrolyte imbalances can contribute to life-threatening disease states which need to be corrected, or they can also indicate specific kinds of diseases and provide diagnostic value (as in Addison’s).

Other times, we want to recheck lab work because in-house profiles may not be complete (like a mini-profile) with all of the lab values we need to properly diagnose and treat your animal. I know our critical care department is also reluctant to trust in-house lab analyzers, as they do not have the quality control in place that large labs (like Antech or Idexx) have.

And finally, sometimes a pet’s condition has changed SO drastically that it doesn’t matter to us if the bloodwork and urinalysis was normal a month ago, or even a week ago…the pet was healthy then, and now isn’t, so something HAS changed and we need to see what that may be.

Hope this helps and it’s not too medically heavy!

No, not too medical heavy! Thanks for taking the time to type that all out. You helped me and some future vets.

Reading down the list, the $$ meter in my head is going nuts. There are so many things about which I’d like to say, “Well, yeah, but can’t you tell some of that by looking at the outside of the cat?” Of course, cats are pretty stoic and look “not too bad”… until they look really bad!

I have to say, we have two not very good small animal ER vets. Friends have had multiple expensive, not good experiences.

Luckily my vet is wonderful (mind you, this is my 4th vet clinic); this vet is the best small animal vet I’ve used…ever! They will take phone calls until 9:30 every night for an emergency and my equine clinic is staffed 24/7, so if I had a disaster, I could at least have an animal put down.

I’m from Maryland. We had two excellent ERs. One was my regular vet, so as long as I made an appointment during the day (7 days a week), it wasn’t an emergency call. They were awesome too and none of my vets have ever been horribly expensive.