something to kill adult Onchocerca? 19 CASE STUDIES POSTED-PAGE 58

[ozhorses]

I have spent a fortune on different things - I use a website where you enter the horses detail and diet and you can then work out what your horse needs or what needs to be decreased. I haven’t mentioned the name of the site as I’m not sure if you are allowed to on this forum!! I also found a good mineral supplement. I have had his hair tested, used herbal supplements, added black sunflower seeds, different oils etc. etc. but there is no difference! I had the vet out who took a skin sample for lice (nothing) but advised to treat them anyway (which i did)! I keep this horse covered which helps a lot and apply an insecticide to him regularly. In fact I spend most of my time just trying to keep up with his itchiness!!:sigh:

So this is day 3 after the first DD - at present the horses haven’t come up for their morning feed but I will report in here any changes!!!

Cheers!

[ozhorses]

A Summary of this Thread

Phew! I’ve spent most of today reading the whole thread. Let’s hope my brain can take it all in. This is how I summarize it in very general terms:

To treat a horse with NTW - DD Equimax - then 14 days later DD Equimax again. If there is still a problem DD again at 21 days. Then follow with your regular worming routine but you can add monthly Ivermectin???

You will be killing off the juveniles - not the adults - which can live for approx. 10 years.

Horses which have been diagnosed with Queensland (Sweet) Itch MAY in fact have a NTW (neck threadworm) infestation which is actually causing the itch - or adding to it.

These worms are spread by midges.

They do not invade the gut - but take up residence under the skin, in joints etc. Telltale signs could be lumps and bumps - particularly on the neck, withers, midline. A horse may be lame due to these worms. They also reside in the head area - causing itching, and sometimes eye problems.

Equimax has been found to be the best wormer to use for this treatment.

After treatment the horse may get worse before it gets better - increase in scratching etc. These are the young worms dying off.

Not all horses will show symptoms - some may not be particularly sensitive to them.

This idea is not well known in veterinary circles, but unofficial trials have been performed by Little D.

ChocoMare has compiled a list of results from cases reported in this thread.

There is one reported death in this thread - but not necessarily from the DD of Equimax. The horse also had other issues.

Always consult your vet if in doubt - these results are anecdotal!

PS. happy to report - Saadi has stopped rubbing his tail! - Day 3 of first DD - fingers crossed!

I’ve typed this summary out as it helps me to remember - but PLEASE - all you worm experts - add to the summary!!!

Cheers!!:lol:

[Rbow]

@ozhorses;6229247

This idea is not well known in veterinary circles, but unofficial trials have been performed by Little D.

I wouldn’t say this idea is not well known in veterinary medicine, I’d say it’s dismissed for the more practical standard treatment (more frequent use of normal dose ivermectin/Equimax).

I agree, at the practitioner level, many vets do not consider onchocerciasis as a likely contributor to itchy horses, and few vets offer or are prepared to skin biopsy to confirm. I believe it should always be considered due to its link to uveitis.

From what I’ve read, the itching is due to a hypersensitity (i.e. allergic response) to the larva of the worm. There are 3 variants of the parasite however the only one common in North America does not invade the tendons. I’m not a Vet, but the Vet textbook I’ve got states appx. 85% of horses are infected in many areas of the US (where gnats are prevalent I suppose - and no supporting research is offered so I don’t know which study they’re quoting from). Most horses have no problem.

The parasite has a short cycle to maturity but a very long life as an adult.

A normal dose of ivermectin is just as lethal to the larva as a double dose and a double dose does not kill the adults.

I personally would not frequently and casually double dose with wormer without more science (and a vet) behind it. The cumulative effects to the kidneys and liver have not been assessed. For me, a better approach is to manage the parasite and the allergy to protect the long-term wellness of the horse. This is one of those things that can’t be “cured” due to constant re-exposure to the parasite and the allergic nature of the affliction.

[EqTrainer]

It has a reference to it on most dewormer boxes now, and that is relatively new. I blame it on COTH

[Calamber]

I do not know how to find this other than the University of Washington’s basement papers, but there is a study done that was published in a British veterinary journal of horses in Iceland who were suffering from sweet itch, some in the herd were affected some were not. They found that the ones who suffered were low in copper and when supplemented were either greatly helped or cured. I would have the blood checked on these horses. Dynamite makes a mineral/clay supplement that I used with great success on one horse that I worked with, that and giving her a bath with Equiss sp? (black bottle) fungal bath. Her skin was hard caked with it, skin was raised and ridged, she did get better within a month. I also had her Power Pac dewormed by the vet.

[quarterhorse4me]

Today is day 7 and my mare is showing improvement. She is not nearly as sensitive to the touch and some of the almost bold spots are much improved. She does seen to have a lot of dandruff/flaking. We did not have all the lumps and bumps that many have seen after the DD. She only had one pea sized lump which is starting to flatten. I am pleased with the results so far and will DD again on day 14.

I would note that she came from a farm where there are roughly 30 horses turned out with no regular, if any worming. She is almost 5 so I am sure that getting on a consistent worming schedule will make a tremendous difference. One of my other horses came from the same place with no apparent problems but I did get her when she was only two and I have always used ivermectin in my regular worming schedule.

Rbow may very well be correct about the single does being enough. I would be afraid to double dose too often and only used ivermectin for the DD not the equimax (although I have it on hand if necessary.)

[birdsong]

I DD twice! He now has a shiny dappled coat but still itching!

I have to add that I live in a wet, boggy type area in Fl.

After DD, and using antihistamine without complete results …I resorted to the 2 week DEX regime hoping to break the cycle.

At least I have confirmed that he has Sweet Itch and not NTW.

He presently has regrown hair on the sides of face and most of the belly but still itching the fool out of that poor tail! All the hair is now gone at the top 6".

So thats my report…wish it had been NTW I’m thinking.

[quarterhorse4me]

Birdsong if it appears that sweet itch is part of the problem, if not the whole problem, you may want to try supplementing him with ground flax seed. There appears to be a significant amount of research out there suggesting that flax seed helps naturally reduce the skins allergic reaction to gnat bites as well as other irritants (a layman’s summary of the research.)

I started the flax seed shortly before I did the DD and am seeing improvement but I cannot say which is the cause of the improvement. I have not done the second DD yet. From all that I read on the flax seed, I started all of mine on it. Along with my problem mare, I have a black gelding that always has dandruff and somewhat sensitive skin.

Good Luck

[sunridge1]

I never posted my story. Four year old, born and raised here, had not yet left the property. Itchy lesions on his neck, chest and shoulders, every season for a year. Read this thread. DD and 2 weeks DD again. Gone! Never had it before and haven’t had it since.

[ozhorses]

[QUOTE=sunridge1;6236115]
I never posted my story. Four year old, born and raised here, had not yet left the property. Itchy lesions on his neck, chest and shoulders, every season for a year. Read this thread. DD and 2 weeks DD again. Gone! Never had it before and haven’t had it since.[/QUOTE]

Oh that’s great! I have only DD once so far. My horse’s tail is great but face still so itchy even though he wears a fly mask with ears. I’m looking forward to seeing more results from the second DD!

[quarterhorse4me]

After the first dose of DD my new mare showed significant improvement. She has not been digging as much, hair is growing back and crusties on her stomach are going away. I did the second DD this morning and she is ill as a snake this afternoon. She appears to be pretty itchy and sensitive to the touch this afternoon. I noticed she kept biting at her legs in the stall this evening.

I am hoping I see another wave of improvement. I have also put her on flax seed to help her skin and coat with the new growth. Keeping my fingers crossed.

[EqTrainer]

Killllll them :lol:

[ChocoMare]

@EqTrainer;6244165

Killllll them :lol:

:lol:

I prefer “Permanently deter.” :winkgrin:

[jeano]

Alls I know is last summer I DD’d, then DD again, then gave a tube of generic ivermectin at the first sign of tail or mane rubbing, which meant a tube every 2-3 weeks when it was hot and damp, and maybe once a month to six weeks when it was hot and dry. Did that from first itchy spell in the spring, until first frost in the fall. Sadie kept her mane and tail last year. She has had her Equimax and I am poised to continue the ivermectin on an as needed basis again this summer.

It might not be NTW, it might not be sweet itch, it might be any blessed thing under the sun, but a VET recommended monthly ivermectin for her years ago, for the ITCHING, postulating it was NTW, and she got better then. Years when I havent been prompt in starting and consistent in maintaining the regimen, she’s lost her mane and tail.
So, well, duh.

So, choco, enjoying the spring weather now that we’ve already had a month of summer?

[Rbow]

@jeano;6244944

a VET recommended monthly ivermectin for her years ago, for the ITCHING, postulating it was NTW, and she got better then. Years when I havent been prompt in starting and consistent in maintaining the regimen, she’s lost her mane and tail.
So, well, duh.

Yes. If the problem is NTW, more frequent use of a normal dose (monthly is recommended) would be just as effective as the DD Equimax every 4 weeks.

It would probably be required for the life of the horse as although you would eventually kill off the adults in 10 years or so, once you stop the horse will likely be reinfected.

Many who suspect NTW allergies, note that the horse seems better able to handle them during the winter months when other allergies aren’t stressing the system. I return to the strategic worming guidelines in the winter months to give the horse’s system a break.

[ChocoMare]

Yeah, jeano… this has been a weird one. Such a pickle: you like the milder winter since you avoid ice storms, frozen tanks & hoses, etc. but you have the bugs en masse.

Miss Penny mare, thank GOD, is a dream to deworm. Just shoot and go. Otherwise, she’d be one giant scab down her belly midline. Wretched g-nats.

[quarterhorse4me]

It is now one week after my mares second DD. She is much less sensitive and her coat is starting to look way better. There are still some lumps under her skin but she does not appear to be digging! I will follow up with monthly ivermectin throughout the summer.

Thank you ChocoMare. This thread has been a life saver! Had I not stumbled across this forum as I desperately searched for an answer to “sweet itch” I may not have kept this mare. I was sure she would never make it literally living in the swamp. We appear to be turning the corner.

If the ivermectin doesn’t continue to work I may just try the BLUE POP ROCKS. They seem to work on everything else!

[runNjump86]

Okay after reading the first few pages, then realizing there were 76 !!! pages total, I am SO creeped out, and feel the need to DD my horse like, yesterday. :lol:

It has been years since I’ve heard of sweet itch, and I never really knew what caused it. Aha, I have been educated! My gelding isn’t very itchy, but he has a “eh” coat (that is coming in different shades from his body clip last month…oiy), some small bumps along his topline, and a couple “moles” on his body as well.

Just to be on the safe side, I will be DD him with Equimax as soon as the shipment arrives. Amazing how much cheaper it is online than in tack stores.

I have always given him the full tube of wormer, even though he weighs in around 950lbs. Would two tubes cause him to keel over? I read several posts that say wormer is tested up to like, 4x the suggested amount? I’d rather give him a little extra than not enough.

Chocomare, you rock.

[ChocoMare]

Glad it’s helping. Even tho “testing” up to 5X normal dose showed no adverse reaction, do draw up the proper weight dosage and then times two for administration to your horse.

[spotteddrafter]

I am so glad I re-read this thread! I’ve been faithfully following protocol until this year - life blew up and things kind of fell behind. Then my mare started having major eye drainage and itchies on the neck again. Hmmm…I totally forgot that the NTW can affect the eyes too! Off to the store!