Spanish Horses/ Saddle Fit/ Hoop Trees

[sheltona01]

Just like sweat marks, nobody really knows what dirt marks mean. There are a lot of guess but nothing has been proven. Most people do not realize most of the pressure under the saddle is in the first 1/3 of the saddle.

I bigger indication to me is if the saddle is moving too much. If the saddle is too wide, it tend to do what I call “wag the tail”. The saddle does need to move with the horse’s movement, but too much movement is bad. If it is too wide, the cantle of the saddle tends to “swing” back and forth too much.

[eightpondfarm]

@sheltona01

Most people do not realize most of the pressure under the saddle is in the first 1/3 of the saddle.

and i guess from the spine’s point of view that is a good thing huh!
edit to say: have not noticed much saddle movement, but i will pay very close attention next ride. Thanks

[sheltona01]

The horse has the ultimate say in what is going on with the saddle. As long as they are comfortable and moving well, I would not worry about it. I try to start with the idea fit, but do not always end up there. They are living beings with their own feelings and ideas about what is right for them.

[JB]

@eightpondfarm

i just had my horse wear a thin white saddlepad and notice the dirt is more pronounced on withers. So, i am guessing the saddle is too wide at the pomel for him? Opinions please…

Picture?

In general, sweat and dirt marks on saddle pads aren’t all that reliable. Did the horse roll more on one side than the other? Is the rider sitting crooked?

When you say “on the wither” do you mean down the middle at the wither? Was the pad pulled well up into the gullet? No pad should get dirty along the spine, other than incidental dirt.

If you pulled the pad up, and it’s still dirty down the middle-ish, then yes, too wide

[eightpondfarm]

Not down the center, but on either side of the wither. About oh…four inches down on both sides …equal amounts of grime on both sides. It is an oval shape about 6 in x 4 inches. My saddle pad is down at the barn, so no pic tonight

[JB]

Panels need to sit alongside the withers, so there’s going to be sweat and dirt. Whether it’s the RIGHT sweat and dirt depends. 4" is fairly meaningless as it doesn’t tell anything about the relationship to the saddle.

[SBrentnall]

My Lusitano goes well in a Trilogy Verago. I also have an N2 Cardhu, but even after several fittings he doesn’t like it and it completely shuts down his movement. I’m going to have to sell it, which is a shame, because for the rider, it’s like being on a cloud!

[TequilaMockingbird]

My Andalusian/QH cross mare has a very similar back but yours looks possibly more short coupled than her. A lot of saddles bridged on her because of the upward curve towards the lumbar area. I looked at hoop trees but ultimately didn’t need one.

The most important things that my mare needed were a saddle with upswept rear panels and a short enough overall length that it did not go past the 18th vertebra. This pretty much requires a deep seated saddle on such a short coupled horse unless you can use a very small seat.

I’ve used an old Hulsebos (unknown model but at least 25 years old), County Perfection and a Takt TSD-37. Of the three the Takt fits the best but it’s also the only one I had custom made. The other two were used saddles and fit well except they were both too long. When I had a saddle custom made I was able to get the panels I needed and the overall length short enough. I think a Black Country or another County saddle would have worked as well if I had one custom made. But both those brands are poorly repped in my area and therefore too big of a risk.

[sheltona01]

Your local saddle fitter will make or break your experience with any brand. I tell people pick your saddle fitter, not the brand of saddles.

If they are a good saddle fitter, not just a brand rep, they will help you even if it is not a model that they sell.

[CanteringCarrot]

See, I ran into an issue with a deep seat on my short backed uphill PRE posted above. The deep seat put too much weight at the base of his long withers. Partially because I had less room in it and it tipped my weight a bit too far forward, and a deep seat doesn’t work for my shape (thanks to years of weight lifting and squats, I’ve got a booty).

So I went for the same size (17.5) in a slightly more open seat with more of a flat spot to it. My balance is perfect now. The panels are slightly upswept (not too crazy) and follow the shape of his back.

Usually when you have less room/back space I thought a more open seat would be better, I guess it could depend on your body shape though. You have to be careful focusing on short enough for the horse because it can distribute the weight of the rider unequally/in such a way that is harmful to the horse. Mine had a saddle that was just a tad too long for about 2 years but never any pain or issue with performance. When I tried to shorten and go with a deeper seat, this caused more of an issue for us.

[sheltona01]

Seat design is really individual about what your anatomy prefers. I have know plenty of riders with a booty that need more support behind rather than the flatter spot on the saddle.

Yes the new research is that sometimes it is ok to go past the last rib and have the rider more balanced in the saddle. Of course if it is possible, it is to be avoided. However by having the rider in a too small of saddle, they sit more on the cantle. This put more pressure on the back of the saddle which is what you are trying to avoid for the horse.

[Ponycatraz]

I was going to ask about this. My last two fitters had no problem fitting a longer saddle to my hony as long as it didn’t interfere with the hip. My hony likes the flatter saddle even if it goes further along his back.

[TequilaMockingbird]

My horse is croup high, short backed and mutton withered. Her back is banana shaped, hence why I need upswept rear panels. Flat saddles bridge or teeter/totter on her. The back shape is very similar to the OP’s pictures except that her withers/shoulder is not as high as OP’s horse.I regularly have to have the front flocking adjusted so that the saddle doesn’t become downhill. The primary difference the shorter saddle made was she was more willing to swing through her back than in a longer saddle. She is like the princess and the pea. If the saddle even slightly bothers her she is fussy, refuses to stay on my outside rein and won’t lift her back.

I ride in a 17.5" seat and have a big booty. Luckily the saddle fitter was able to keep the size seat I needed while getting the overall length short enough. It was definitely a smaller actual seat size vs 17.5" in my other saddles because of flat vs deep seat.