Standards/Averages for barn workers

[Scribbler]

I made a decision at 17 to not ever seek work in the horse industry, after watching a school friend drop out and go work at the race track for several years (she returned to school as an adult and got a PhD eventually).

She was at work by 6 am, home by 3 PM, slogging back from the bus stop too tired to ride her own horse.

I realized that most horse jobs involve supporting the riding of other people who earn more than you do. I would be better off earning a professional income in another field and being an amateur rider.

It took me to my 40s to return to riding with a good job but I have never regretted that. Now that I know trainers and barn managers I see that even they don’t get to ride and enjoy their own horses that much. They are either schooling other people’s problem horses or pitching in with the barn work.

I’m torn because barns need workers and also can’t afford to pay that much, so I don’t want to run around telling every barn worker to quit today and go back to school :). But it is what I would tell any young person I was friendly with, who wasn’t on an obvious Grand Prix international rider career track by age 18.

[peedin]

The manager at my former barn (there are stall cleaners but she takes care of 25 horses) gets free housing and NO PAY. She knew this when she started 18 years ago. No days off, boarders take care of emergency back ups. Crazy.

[BUSY]

Your situation is not good on many levels - legally - financially - physically - eventually emotionally.
Please re- evaluate this job -

1. Start by seeking out a new job * FIRST
2. Speak to your employer about your position salary -legal and benefits,and some ‘help’ and another day off!
3. If you can not negotiate for the above - seriously you need to find another reasonable job. IMHO

Good Luck - please take care of YOU !

[furlong47]

You list 4 or 5 negative things and then say the job is fantastic. No, it’s not. It sounds like you’re being kept there mainly due to being afraid what will happen to the horses if you leave. Someone was caring for them before you and the owner/manager will find someone to do so after you.

The lack of worker’s comp and insurance would be the end of it for me, right away. Young, unhandled horses have already come close to injuring you and you are doing a large amount of physical labor every day. If you sustain an injury where you can no longer work, you are likely to be out a paycheck, attempting to somehow pay for medical care, homeless, with nothing but a dying car and a horse that has no place to go.

Any barn I know with that number of horses (except perhaps for where all of the horses live out on pasture the majority of the time) has more than one employee doing the labor.

If you somehow really want to stay in this place, I would be insisting on worker’s comp, plus asking for at least a 50% raise (with future adjustments if they bring in even more horses - perhaps a daily rate per horse) or that they bring in a part time second employee for the 10+ additional horses.

What does this barn manager do all day?

[furlong47]

The manager at my former barn (there are stall cleaners but she takes care of 25 horses) gets free housing and NO PAY. She knew this when she started 18 years ago. No days off, boarders take care of emergency back ups. Crazy.

Is she married? If not, how does she pay for food/car/clothes/healthcare/etc?

[Duchysgirl]

I realize that this job has many drawbacks and it can be a burden, but i do it for the passion i hold for horses. I have tried many other career tracks since turning 18 and i am even a certified dog trainer(the drawback to that is no one will hire me as i have my own qualifications to run my own business), i have struggled with my mental and physical health my entire life, and horses seem to be the one going i can do and not burn out or be sick all the time. Working with them has done wonders for my health and what i believe i am meant to do. I am looking into other job opportunities but would prefer to try to improve my situation here first. The barn manager handles paperwork and scheduling farrier and vet visits, as well as some property maintenence and overseeing me. I’m trying to figure out what a reasonable pay and expectations would be for my workload so i have a basis to negotiate with before seriously pursuing another job, or if i need to move on now.

[keysfins]

@Duchysgirl

I realize that this job has many drawbacks and it can be a burden, but i do it for the passion i hold for horses. I have tried many other career tracks since turning 18 and i am even a certified dog trainer(the drawback to that is no one will hire me as i have my own qualifications to run my own business), i have struggled with my mental and physical health my entire life, and horses seem to be the one going i can do and not burn out or be sick all the time. Working with them has done wonders for my health and what i believe i am meant to do. I am looking into other job opportunities but would prefer to try to improve my situation here first. The barn manager handles paperwork and scheduling farrier and vet visits, as well as some property maintenence and overseeing me. I’m trying to figure out what a reasonable pay and expectations would be for my workload so i have a basis to negotiate with before seriously pursuing another job, or if i need to move on now.

Can you see a career path in the next five years or so? Do you have aspirations of moving up to barn management, training, vet tech or other “defined” career? What do you see your life like in five years? What is your ideal situation/dream job?

These questions may give you a broader vision, in place of “daily survival”.

[Scribbler]

@Duchysgirl

I realize that this job has many drawbacks and it can be a burden, but i do it for the passion i hold for horses. I have tried many other career tracks since turning 18 and i am even a certified dog trainer(the drawback to that is no one will hire me as i have my own qualifications to run my own business), i have struggled with my mental and physical health my entire life, and horses seem to be the one going i can do and not burn out or be sick all the time. Working with them has done wonders for my health and what i believe i am meant to do. I am looking into other job opportunities but would prefer to try to improve my situation here first. The barn manager handles paperwork and scheduling farrier and vet visits, as well as some property maintenence and overseeing me. I’m trying to figure out what a reasonable pay and expectations would be for my workload so i have a basis to negotiate with before seriously pursuing another job, or if i need to move on now.

This is a difficult situation. It sounds like OP is in a somewhat marginal situation economically and career wise and the barn manager may be taking advantage of that though perhaps not intentionally.

Given the extra details I am less concerned about career path and more that OP has an unsustainable work load.

The free apartment and horse board are probably more than OP could afford on another minimum wage job.

If the pay was a bit higher and the workload a bit less, for Instance you got a part time helper, a job like this could provide long term security to someone in the OPs situation.

I just worry that the OP will eventually get injured, either accident or chronic stress, be unable to work, and basically unemployable, and have nowhere to live.

[Chopper]

I agree with Scribbler. This could be a good situation for the OP if some things were improved.
I think it’s unrealistic to think the BO will provide insurance. Small companies or LLC’s are not under federal mandate to provide insurance because it’s very costly if you have under a certain number of employees. I’m guessing they don’t carry any actual employees and are either considering her a W9 or paying her under the table. Again, since her income is so low she won’t get hit with income taxes but that’s something to consider if her salary increases - she needs to stay under the poverty line where she is tax exempt. So this leaves opportunities for barter, which could work to her benefit and also suit the BO.
In terms of total package compensation, I would look at it like this:
Cost of Benefits + cash = Total Package
Right now you are getting:
Rent (600)+Utilities (50) + Board (300)+ 750 cash = $1700

I’d like to see the total package add up to $2880(ish) which would equal $12/hour for 60 hour workweeks.

Ideas for barter that won’t cost the BO more in ‘cash’ and can be written off as business expense.

1. Vehicle plus Gas (assuming a $400 car payment this could be a $500 benefit)
2. Grocery allowance (I’d ask for $75/week - total $300/month benefit)
3. Company Phone ($100/month)
4. Clothing or Supply Allowance
5. Farrier/vet costs (maintenance care to be paid for by the BO)
6. What other things do you pay for out of pocket on a regular basis that could be paid by the BO? Again, these things can be written off as business expense so it’s a ‘win-win’ for both you and the BO.
   If they don’t understand these concepts, advise them to talk to their accountant about how to make some of these ideas work for them financially.

Things to include in discussion:
Reduced workweek to max of 60/hours/week - anything above should be paid hourly at $12/hour
Another assumption that you need to clarify is that if you are injured, you are covered under their insurance or you will be able to file a claim against them that will fall under their liability insurance. This is a discussion point that they should be willing to work through with you. If not, I would consider this a very red, red flag.

[DJohn]

OP, I used to care for 38 horses (plus outdoor), mucking, turn in/out, feeding etc when I was 20(ish). I thought I could do it because I was so fast at first! I was strong and young and able. I lasted 8 MONTHS before I just absolutely hated going to work, could make it through the day but it took me longer, no one to cover when I was sick. I was paid decently, but not enough to hire a second person.

It will take a toll on you, on your body and on your mind. Eventually I moved on to another horse job and when I realized I was doing basically everything, I asked for a raise (and got it), but quit a few months later as I just couldn’t stand the laziness the owners showed when everyone else worked so hard.

Prior to those experiences I had worked for a Grand Prix trainer who taught me a lot, let me ride and although we worked hard and weren’t well paid- I was young and everyone worked as a team. The trainer/owner himself would come down and muck stalls if someone didn’t show up, he tacked his own horses most of the time and he let us in on tricks of the trade that I would never have learned elsewhere.

After all of that, I can say I would never if I could do it again have worked for the first 2 places I mentioned. They taught me absolutely nothing I didn’t already know, I never had the energy to ride my OWN horses and I was never appreciated for the hard work I did.

Long story short OP, you wont be able to do this for long. You can ask for more $$ but what you really need is more $$ and more HELP. When I left the first farm (38 horses/1 worker), they had to hire 2 people to do that job because they realized it was impossible for one person.

If I were you, I’d start looking for a better barn job that allows your horse to come along. Or, do what I (and one other poster above) did- and decided to NEVER work for a barn again. I found myself a good job, and now my work is over when it’s supposed to be and I ride my horse more than ever!

-End super long post-.

[candyappy]

@Duchysgirl

I am being paid a little less than $7 an hour with no benefits or insurance should i get hurt.

You just answered your own question.

I understand your passion and desire to work with horses and at your age I would have done the same thing and loved every minute of it ( kind of did). Just realize that one day your body will pay for your hard work ( ask me how I know) and that this job is limited and has no long term benefits for you, but many for your employer.

You need to be paying taxes ( W-2) You need to be compensated for medical insurance. You deserve a better hourly wage.

[KittyinAus]

Oh heck. You guys in the USA don’t have easy access to free medical care and subsidized medication like we do here in Australia, and even here your pay situation would give me the yips. If you were a working pupil and doing less horses, your job would be great, but as a proper employee, not great.

[BeeHoney]

While Chopper has some good ideas, I am less optimistic about this employer agreeing to offer a better package. Too many things are wrong with what they are doing. Also, in their minds, why should they pay more? The OP has already shown that she is willing to do the job for a ridiculously low wage, so I think it is likely that they will assume they can find someone else to do the job if the OP won’t. The employer also may feel that because they are also the OP’s landlord that they have more leverage over her vs. a regular employee.

One piece of advice that I can give is to not underestimate the importance of communication with your employer. I appreciate it when my employees tell me up front when there are issues with the workload, equipment, other workers, etc. Sometimes an employee comes to me upset about something that I had no idea about. Employers are not all-knowing, and being able to calmly and professionally give feedback using numbers, common sense, examples, etc. is a really excellent skill to have.

No matter what the deal is with this employer, I would approach this problem in a calm and professional manner. Document and present to your employer the hours you are working vs. the pay. Educate yourself on the tax issues and bring that up as well. Offer solutions that are reasonable and professional and that would be satisfactory to you. Perhaps in addition to you being paid more fairly, the farm needs another PT worker.

[clanter]

@KittyinAus

Oh heck. You guys in the USA don’t have easy access to free medical care and subsidized medication like we do here in Australia, and even here your pay situation would give me the yips. If you were a working pupil and doing less horses, your job would be great, but as a proper employee, not great.

We do not have universal coverage however OP with her merger earnings would easily qualify her for Medicaid

https://www.medicaid.gov/medicaid/eligibility/

[KittyinAus]

@clanter

We do not have universal coverage however OP with her merger earnings would easily qualify her for Medicaid

https://www.medicaid.gov/medicaid/eligibility/

So she could get free visits to the doctor and free hospital stays and subsidized medication? Having a sleep deprived dumb moment and couldn’t understand the document you gave me a link to.

[Palm_Beach]

@furlong47

The lack of worker’s comp and insurance would be the end of it for me, right away. Young, unhandled horses have already come close to injuring you and you are doing a large amount of physical labor every day. If you sustain an injury where you can no longer work, you are likely to be out a paycheck, attempting to somehow pay for medical care, homeless, with nothing but a dying car and a horse that has no place to go.

This is simply not true. You ARE covered by state law, and if the employer does not have workers comp insurance, then your payments come out of a state fund or the employer’s pocket. But you ARE COVERED. The OP may be getting paid as an independent contractor but she is not an independent contractor.

It’s like auto insurance - if you let your insurance lapse and cause an accident, you are still liable for the damage even though you don’t have insurance. The employer is liable for employees who get hurt at work. If there is no insurance in place, the state steps in.

[Gloria]

Also please note that the 50% increase for 30 horses vs 20, with no additional pay increase should be based on 50% of “total compensation,” not just the $750 increase.

Your current compensation;
$750 salary
$600 apartment
$100 utility
$300 board.
Total: $1750
Increase of 50% equals $2650 ($1750*1.5).

Now minus the $2650 by $1000 ($600 apartment + $100 utility + $300 board) gives you $1650. This is the equivalent pay from where you started, to take care of 30 horses instead of 20. This gives you $10/hour based on 65 hours work week. I personally think this is still too low, judging by how hard you work.