Stupid question - how to load 60cc syringe?

[RedHorses]

@Palm Beach

I would suggest teaching your horse to stand quiet to be dosed, and that way you can squirt it to the back of the mouth where the horse will swallow it. Then for the rest of her life, she will be easy to worm, dose, etc. If she likes peppermints, you can add a bit of some liquid breathing supplement to your mixture.

I’m sorry, Palm Beach, but you have me howling with laughter. :lol:

For anyone who missed it, Palm Beach said : why would you use applesauce, just train your horse to accept nasty tasting stuff squirted into his mouth. But if he likes peppermint you could add something that tastes like peppermint. :lol: :lol:

For the OP, I got one of mine to eat a high volume of powder (ground up caplets) mixed with a half cup or so of applesauce, which was then mixed with his feed. That was antibiotics. He absolutely will not eat antihistamines so that goes in a syringe with apple cider vinegar and he’ll swallow that happily after rolling it around in his mouth a bit - because he likes the taste of the acv.

​​​​As for why use applesauce, aside from the taste, some pills/powders will not dissolve in water and will settle before you can get the syringe into the horse’s mouth. The powder stays suspended in the applesauce. Some pills/powders are gritty enough to make it tough to push the plunger through - applesauce provides a little grease.

[RedHorses]

endlessclimb - My horse was prescribed Prednisone when his heaves were confirmed a few years ago. The vet explained it to me like this: Prednisone is converted by the body into Prednilosone, which then does it’s thing. People, in general, are very good at this conversion. Horses, in general, are very bad at it. There are exceptions, enough that the consideration of lower cost, and greater drug stability have that vet prescribe Prednisone first, only moving to Prednilosone if the Prednisone doesn’t work. The pills I have are 50mg - I don’t know if that would mean fewer pills per dose… Or if you have already tried the Prednisone first…

Just a thought.

I can empathize with the daily dosing. One of mine will get at least one, more often two or more syringe dosings every day for the rest of his life. He is my exceptional horse though, and doesn’t give me trouble (most often a heavy sigh when I show up with the syringe(s).

[bdj]

If you’re thinking about trying fenugreek, try cheap pancake syrup - that’s what they use to make it taste “maple-y”. Also, it often comes in a bottle with a little bit of a spout, which makes it easier to squirt into a syringe!
For the record, my method, last time I had to use it, was to crush up the pills (SMZs, as I recall) with a pill crusher, pour in a little warm water, cover the open tip with a finger, squirt in some syrup, dump in the powder (usually off a rolled up piece of paper), insert the plunger (as much as I could), flip it over (attempting to keep my finger over the tip) and shake the whole mess until it was sort of combined. Squirt it into pony and then give her a handful of some kind of treat as fast as possible once she’d swallowed the icky stuff…
Why has no one ever created a cap for the end of those damnable 60cc syringes yet? That would make the mixing process at least a little easier!

[luvmyhackney]

I use water to make it liquidy, then use the bottled water flavoring packs in orange or fruit punch. Mix that and shake and my guy sucks it down. He licks up his dribble if I let him. It’s super cheap but if you use Hawian Punch it does stain their lips and tongue.

[NancyM]

When dosing anything into a horse’s mouth that he needs to swallow, pull his tongue out first, to the side. Then insert the dosing syringe, and eject the medication. This places the medication further back in the mouth than just where the syringe would normally put it without pulling the tongue out first. Then let the tongue go, and it snaps back into the mouth, taking the medication with it to the BACK of the throat, and is less likely to be spat out or run out of the mouth. Then tip the horse’s nose upwards, creating a downhill slide for the medication into the throat. Then immediately place your fist up into the horse’s throat between the cheekbones, and press upwards with your fist. This will make him swallow, and the suction created will carry most of the medication down in that one swallow, with little chance of losing anything.

[paintedpony]

Summit Pharmacy (near my home) will compound as instructed. When required they do oral antibiotics for us as well. If your Vet is not able to supply directly, request a script, and visit a human compounding pharmacy. My costs so far, have been identical, tablet, granule, or suspension.

[Ghazzu]

@NancyM

When dosing anything into a horse’s mouth that he needs to swallow, pull his tongue out first, to the side. Then insert the dosing syringe, and eject the medication. This places the medication further back in the mouth than just where the syringe would normally put it without pulling the tongue out first. Then let the tongue go, and it snaps back into the mouth, taking the medication with it to the BACK of the throat, and is less likely to be spat out or run out of the mouth. Then tip the horse’s nose upwards, creating a downhill slide for the medication into the throat. Then immediately place your fist up into the horse’s throat between the cheekbones, and press upwards with your fist. This will make him swallow, and the suction created will carry most of the medication down in that one swallow, with little chance of losing anything.

Have you ever looked at the mechanics of swallowing?
Hint: it doesn’t work the way you think it does.

[PeteyPie]

I would give two syringes. The first would contain the pills mixed with applesauce, using the methods suggested to thin it out sufficiently. That would be followed immediately by a dosing of plain applesauce to end the session on an especially pleasant note and help wash down any bad-tasting residue.

[Tee]

I haven’t read all the comments, but I am treating one of mine for a Clostridium infection in his neck, which is twice a day of two different antibiotics, going on 3 weeks now. I make a small glass with a bit of molasses and water, heat it up to just boiling, and then dump all the pills in (there are 63 of total). By morning they have melted and I can just mix it up and draw it into the syringes. I’ve found that 2 35cc syringes are far more manageable than one 60cc. My hands just aren’t that big.

Aries isn’t wild about the mixture, but it’s just thick enough he can’t spit it out, and the syringes are manageable enough that I can get it pretty far back in his mouth.

[JB]

Be careful of water that hot that you aren’t degrading the medication being used. I’m not sure why water has to be 210*to effectively dissolve anything water soluble, especially if it’s left overnight?

I kind of like the idea of splitting the dose, and using a 60cc syringe for both, so that the last half of each split can be pure yummy stuff.

[gumtree]

“I would suggest teaching your horse to stand quiet to be dosed, and that way you can squirt it to the back of the mouth where the horse will swallow it”

Well, IME managing a large population and good part of that dealt with rehab, “exotic health issues” They’ll stand quietly for the first couple of days at best, After that they wise up. I don’t care what kind of “sweets” are mixed in, lol. How much prior “schooling” they’ve had. Some will put up with it, most get don’t after multiple days

Sorry Doc, but I HATE the dosing syringe you pictured. For a “one off” it’s OK. But is a total PITA to work with when dosing a horse for days and days after they have “wised up”. Fine if you have a partner to hold their head securely and and the person dosing has both hands to work with. But that is not always the case for most us us. That have to go down the isle giving meds.

My vets may give the first dose with me at their head. Then they hand me the meds and I’m pretty much on my own there after.

The plastic dosing syringes are a PITA to work with one handed. Big, hard to keep you thumb on the plunger with an unruly horse. Hard to push thick meds out with just one finger.

There are old school big metal dosing syringes to be had, But they are unwieldy. I far prefer this one pictured. 50 cc nice pistol grip, rounded long balled tip so not to scratch, irritate the mouth. Grab the horse by the halter, lay it against the side of their mouth, time it right while they are throwing their head around, some more than others, slide it in and to the back of the mouth, tongue, squirt quickly and "tickle: their tongue to make them swallow. Bob’s you uncle you’re done. ALL of the meds are in and where they are suppose to go.

For lager doses I load 2. Hide in my back pocket, if not they can see it coming. For some I give a treat before and after. Depends on the horse. It is also a good reason to have a stall, place with a low ceiling to give meds. They can only rear up so far.

I don’t play games when it comes to giving meds. I didn’t like taking meds as a kid and my parents didn’t play games either. To each their own on this.

This dosing syringe works well enough. But it is on the cheap side of things. The plastic cylinder gets easily warn, as does the cheap O seal. After being used X times with abrasive pilled meds it doesn’t slid as easily. A glass body and rubber O ring seal would work and last a lot longer. But it only cost around $15.

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[monstrpony]

@Ghazzu

A) 60 cc syringes with a “catheter tip” come with a cap.
B) If you put TMP/SMZ in a small amount of warm water, it becomes a sludge (not really soluble in water) It’s way less work than crushing the stuff.

And then, if you add about a tablespoon of molasses to the sludge and mix, the whole thing liquifies and is easy to pour into the syringe, or ever pull up into the syringe.

Don’t know why this works (I suspect the drug has a lot of water associated with it, even though it appears dry; the sugar pulls the water off and into solution somehow). It’s really freaky to watch–you think there’s no way this is going to be anything but glue, and suddenly it just turns liquid.

If you lose the cap, you can use the caps that come on the ends of a needle in its place. Not the part that covers the needle, but the cap on the end that attaches to a syringe)

The best part is that you will finally completely perfect the process the day before your horse’s prescription ends.

[JB]

@monstrpony

And then, if you add about a tablespoon of molasses to the sludge and mix, the whole thing liquifies and is easy to pour into the syringe, or ever pull up into the syringe.

Don’t know why this works (I suspect the drug has a lot of water associated with it, even though it appears dry; the sugar pulls the water off and into solution somehow). It’s really freaky to watch–you think there’s no way this is going to be anything but glue, and suddenly it just turns liquid.

If you lose the cap, you can use the caps that come on the ends of a needle in its place. Not the part that covers the needle, but the cap on the end that attaches to a syringe)

Good to know on both accounts!

The best part is that you will finally completely perfect the process the day before your horse’s prescription ends.

:lol: :lol: :yes: :yes: It’s always that way!

[Palm_Beach]

@RedHorses

I’m sorry, Palm Beach, but you have me howling with laughter. :lol:

For anyone who missed it, Palm Beach said : why would you use applesauce, just train your horse to accept nasty tasting stuff squirted into his mouth. But if he likes peppermint you could add something that tastes like peppermint. :lol: :lol:

Peppermint for the smell, not taste, you silly goose. If I have one that is really bad, I just use my finger to smear a drop on the outside of the syringe so the horse can smell the peppermint. Happy to have provided you with some fun!

[mswillie]

@Tee

I haven’t read all the comments, but I am treating one of mine for a Clostridium infection in his neck, which is twice a day of two different antibiotics, going on 3 weeks now. I make a small glass with a bit of molasses and water, heat it up to just boiling, and then dump all the pills in (there are 63 of total). By morning they have melted and I can just mix it up and draw it into the syringes. I’ve found that 2 35cc syringes are far more manageable than one 60cc. My hands just aren’t that big.

Aries isn’t wild about the mixture, but it’s just thick enough he can’t spit it out, and the syringes are manageable enough that I can get it pretty far back in his mouth.

You quite likely are compromising the stability of the meds with heat and water. Heat and humidity are the two things most likely to degrade the medication. (why keeping meds in the bathroom or cabinet near a stove is not recommended)

[Ghazzu]

@mswillie

You quite likely are compromising the stability of the meds with heat and water. Heat and humidity are the two things most likely to degrade the medication. (why keeping meds in the bathroom or cabinet near a stove is not recommended)

Heat, maybe. Water, unlikely, since TMP/SMZ is also available as a suspension which contains water.

[mydogs]

I haven’t read all 3 pages, so apologies if this has already been said.

When I had to dose my horse with bute or SMZs, there were a few things that I learned the hard way:

1. Premixing in a cup is better for the syringe - the syringe won’t “stick” as much in the future. I started mixing in the syringe by taking the plunger out but after a few weeks, I couldn’t get the plunger inside the tub anymore. It became useless and a physical battle. No idea why. But a previous barn staff told me he doesn’t mix it in the syringe because it ruins it. He was right.

2. Premixing in the cup was a pain in the ass. I either used too much water and still had medicine left in the cup, or not enough water and left a lot of the mix in the cup and couldn’t suck it up with the syringe. No clue how the barn staff did it at my last barn. He seemed a pro at it.

Either way, I ended up mixing in a cup, using the syringe to determine how much water I needed. Then pour the mixture from the cup into the syringe. Or I would mix a few pills at a time in the syringe, add water, shake, then add more pills & water. So then I wasn’t stuck with somewhat mixed pills at one end of the syringe.

I know some horses at the barn would have their pills crushed by going through a coffee grinder machine. That seemed to make mixing with water a bit easier.

[islgrl]

@SinMiedo

I’m not sure how it compares to the pills cost wise, but in my human-dosing job, we regularly use liquid sucralfate. I was on it at one point and it was surprisingly not disgusting.
I’ve only ever seen it in liquid form as Carafate (the brand name), though, so cost might be prohibitive.

I actually now buy it flavored from Wedgewood and he eats in in his food. (mercifully!)

[Dubarry]

https://www.ridingwarehouse.com/Welcon_Pill_Crusher_Dosing_Syringe_60cc/descpage-WPCS.html

This has worked well for me. Hard to see in the picture but there’s two plastic pieces to grip with your finger and a thumb loop for leverage. Definitely work $2.

[Tee]

@mswillie

You quite likely are compromising the stability of the meds with heat and water. Heat and humidity are the two things most likely to degrade the medication. (why keeping meds in the bathroom or cabinet near a stove is not recommended)

I told my vet what I was doing with the meds and she didn’t seem concerned, so hopefully, all is well. He’s healing up nicely, so something is working.