Swayback--Owner Obesity

[QUOTE=Tho![](as_1;2468123]

Indeed there’s evidence at Hadrians Wall - which is the border of England and Scotland ;)-
[IMG]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v258/flodden_edge/armour.jpg)
[/QUOTE]

    what ?!?!!!  (waking up quickly and looking  befuddled) :eek::eek:

there’s a border there ??? who knew…dang…the things you learn here :yes:

    Tamara in TN         :p

proof?

[QUOTE=Coup De Des;2457334]
Did you know, there is no such thing as being “big boned”. Bones can be spread further apart from person to person… Different ethnicities MAY have bigger bones - BUT the difference in size is by mere millimeters hardly enough to warrent being overweight.[/QUOTE]

Empirical observations lead me to disagree with this statement. Can you provide scientific evidence to support it?

http://www.weightlossjourney.org/myths.html

http://lists.topica.com/lists/burnbodyfat/read/message.html?sort=&mid=811245965

http://en.allexperts.com/q/Women-s-Health-3228/Big-boned.htm

http://www.essentialnutrition.org/pdf/alert_myths.pdf

So, let’s review: The reason you don’t have horses that could accomodate riders drawn from the half of the population that’s overweight (since your top weight is really not that far over the average weight, so you are presumably excluding slightly less than half the population of potential clients) is…oh, right…

But you don’t dislike fat people, oh no, not you.

Kinda like fashionable women’s clothing stores don’t dislike women larger than a US size 12-14/UK 16.

Errr…

You have the right to be prejudiced against anyone you choose, I guess, since as far as I can tell it’s not directly hurting anyone in a legally actionable way. That said, prejudice in any form is distasteful to say the least. Lying about it after the fact moves you into real jackass territory.

J Swan, I couldn’t have said it better than you did–it seems that people feel some need to judge and control other people who are doing no one any harm. It’s baffling. Perhaps all those folks could use the time and energy they spend deploring the existence of the obese in doing something nice for their horses instead? Or, heaven forbid, doing something for all the rescued animals out there? But I guess that wouldn’t be as satisfying as repeatedly bashing women who have the colossal chutzpah to take up more than their “share” of space in the world…

Why SHOULD he have a draft horse??

In this age of accountability… why SHOULD HE!! If they want to ride a horse, they need to hold themselves accountable for their own weight, and get themselves down to an acceptable weight TO ride a horse. The answer is NOT get a bigger horse. Ok… it’s just NOT the answer.

Why SHOULD aeroplanes have bigger seats to accomodate the morbidly obese? How about we fix the problem - not make accomodations for it.

Airplanes accomodate obese people? Heck they can’t even accomodate average people! When was the last time you flew in one of these sardine cans?

If my horses are comfortable carring me then I will ride, if not then I won’t. At this point in time they appear to be capable. I have had my horses for a number of years and ride fairly regularly, I would think they would be showing some wear and tear (physically and mentally) by now if it was a issue. They seem willing to accomidate me.

[QUOTE=Tamara in TN;2469346]
what ?!?!!! (waking up quickly and looking befuddled) :eek::eek:
there’s a border there ??? who knew…dang…the things you learn here :yes:

    Tamara in TN         :p[/QUOTE]

You prune…:lol: Its not like the Berlin wall! It was built in AD122 by the Romans to keep the marauding Scots out!

Its a little delapidated now :yes: And the actual border is now in a different place & deviates from much of the wall and due to a lot of border conflict through the centuries - including Flodden Battle in 1513: and that was the one that led to the unification. Or to put it another way the United Kingdom.

King James of Scotland was killed in battle on land that I farm. He was the last King to die in battle. Prior to that England and Scotland were two totally separate nations with a King apiece.

Now they form part of the United Kingdom (with Wales and Northern Ireland) with a national parliament and sovereign. However just to complicate matters, Scotland does have a degree of devolution and 9 years ago a Scottish Parliament was formed that has certain regulated authority for different specific local regulation and law.

[QUOTE=criss;2469514]
So, let’s review: The reason you don’t have horses that could accomodate riders drawn from the half of the population that’s overweight (since your top weight is really not that far over the average weight, so you are presumably excluding slightly less than half the population of potential clients) is…oh, right…[/QUOTE] Madam you are a fool with a vivid imagination

First of all if you take trouble to read what I actually posted, you will see that I take people that are up to 50 lbs overweight according to the government health guidelines

I also run a “be fit to ride class”.

And I do actually have some great big horses for big people.

I also provide carriage driving for those who for whatever reason can’t ride but wish to do something with horses

I have a specifically purpose built carriage for those who are wheelchair users, semi-ambulent or otherwise less mobile. This carriage also has a VERY large seat - bigger than Panam aeroplanes!!

The weight limit is for the specific horse

However as I’m particularly interested in eventing and horse driving trials I’m hardly likely to have a great load of huge horses. duhhh

But you don’t dislike fat people, oh no, not you.
No. But you madam have a vivid imagination and a bug up your ass!

Kinda like fashionable women’s clothing stores don’t dislike women larger than a US size 12-14/UK 16.
Don’t be a fool. You clearly haven’t got a clue about what sort of horses do what sort of work. By your silly reconing I should keep a bunch of shetlands just in case folks with vertigo come.

You have the right to be prejudiced against anyone you choose,
Its got nothing to do with prejudice and everything to do with the horses I have and looking after their health whilst providing a safe environment for my customers. I have a duty of care to ensure that I don’t overface a customer by sticking them on a great big horse when they’re likely to be unbalanced and unfit and fall off - whether they’re 110 or 220 lbs!

If you come to this country you will be totally beside yourself with shock and horror because all riding schools and riding establishments have weight limits and you know what… mine is way in excess of a lot of them!

By example, Chris Bartle who runs this one is the coach for the German Eventing Team and a **** Eventer himself. His limit is 175 lbs :

http://www.yrc.co.uk/lessons.html

I guess, since as far as I can tell it’s not directly hurting anyone in a legally actionable way. That said, prejudice in any form is distasteful to say the least. Lying about it after the fact moves you into real jackass territory.
And madam I am not a liar but you have an imagination that knows no bounds!

You might well be totally unconcerned for what weight a horse has to bear and you might not have a clue about what damage it does to a horse to carry an unbalanced load that is too heavy for it to bear and you might have horses that have to have a chiropracter or osteopath or vet or you might be too stupid to know when the horse is suffering in silence or in pain.

I on the other hand, know what I’m doing: in terms of providing for my horses and customers and in relation to providing accessible facilities which can be enjoyed by people of all ages and abilities.

I note you hide behind anonymity but what precisely are you doing in terms of providing facilities saying as you’re so opinionated?

I don’t see what y’all are arguing about. It’s pretty evident that we all know we should eat a healthy diet and be active.

And again - many of you are using the word “obese” very broadly - and inaccurately.

People naturally come in all shapes and sizes. What’s important is that we are healthy.

Society’s current ideal of physical beauty is a very very slender physique. Nothing to do with BMI, nothing to do with fitness. If that is the ideal - it is unattainable for the majority of the female population (and it shouldn’t be attainable)

At the other extreme are the morbidly obese (as that is defined by medical professionals - not Jerry Springer). Folks - those people are dying. Don’t worry about them riding a horse - they can’t even climb a flight of stairs. Just hope that they get medical help.

The rest of us fall somewhere in between - and there is a horse for all of us. If a lesson program has a weight limit - so be it. Find another instructor or challenge yourself to lose the weight to get in. No shame.

If you expect your horse to be an athlete - I know you expect the same of yourself. Even then - athletes come in all shapes and sizes.

If you’re a pleasure rider that loves to trail ride - who cares if you have dunlap disease. I’m happy to see you out on the trails - and I’m sure your horse is happy to be out and about.

I’m not excusing unhealthy eating habits or lifestyles - nor am I condoning them. I don’t understand why people feel it is ok to shame and ridicule. Some of the folks on this BB - kind, decent people and good horsemen, are among those people label “obese” (as laypeople define obesity - anyone who doesn’t look like a model)

Their horses seem to be fine and dandy.

I’ll let y’all in on a little secret. Some folks are happy, and healthy, and active, and fit - and not skinny. Some skinny people are in terrible health. Some aren’t.

The range for a healthy weight is something like 30 lbs. That means that what y’all are bitc*ing about is probably nothing more than a person at the upper range of what is considered normal for their weight.

I’m with J Swan’s comments. But if you want to see some poor ponies who are carrying some very overweight people (tourists) go to Rarotonga and have a look. Would make you cry… what I am getting at is that there are ignorant people out there who get on ponies that are much too small for them. But they are not “riders” as such. One had been in the “Biggest Loser” program and had lost 70kg but whew…these poor thin ponies are only around 14hh.

You might well be totally unconcerned for what weight a horse has to bear and you might not have a clue about what damage it does to a horse to carry an unbalanced load that is too heavy for it to bear and you might have horses that have to have a chiropracter or osteopath or vet or you might be too stupid to know when the horse is suffering in silence or in pain.

Thomas I: If I am ever in your neck of the woods I am buying you a round!

Oh for God’s sake - what piffle. If you have something intelligent to add to the conversation -please do so.

Any experienced horseman knows how to choose and condition a horse to carry the required load - whether it is a dead load or live load.

You babbling about horses suffering is melodramatic and adds nothing substantive to the discussion.

Oh - in case you’re wondering - I’m not obese. I merely do not judge people’s worth based on their size, skin color, religion or sexual orientation. We all have value - I see no good in humiliating people.

[QUOTE=Life of Riley;2469683]
You might well be totally unconcerned for what weight a horse has to bear and you might not have a clue about what damage it does to a horse to carry an unbalanced load that is too heavy for it to bear and you might have horses that have to have a chiropracter or osteopath or vet or you might be too stupid to know when the horse is suffering in silence or in pain.

Thomas I: If I am ever in your neck of the woods I am buying you a round![/QUOTE]

First I must apologize to Thomas I. Being a “greenie” I did not post his quote properly in my last posting which was the first paragraph.

Because this topic was listed under Horse Care I assumed we were discussing the physical well being of the horse and what the extra weight of a rider may or may not do to a horse. If my concerns are “babbling and melodramatic” for the horse’s well being than so be it …I am babbling and melodramatic! Also I never gave it a second thought who here was emaciated or overweight. My babbling and melodramatic conerns have been on the effects on the horse’s physical condition. This has obviously turned out for some to be an avenue to discuss some other personal underlying issues. So fling what you have, I will not respond nor do I care to.

If I sound irritated - it is because this subject often comes up - and reading some of the comments gets my goat. But being new to the BB - there was no way for you to put my comments in context.

There is another thread on the same subject in Off Course - another reason to be irritated. Same overbroad definitions of “obesity”, complete with ridicule. It’s simply not necessary - nor does it help anyone.

Of course - any good horseman is always concerned about the horse’s welfare and I don’t think any reasonable person would dispute that. Though it broke my heart to do so, I refrained from allowing a very dear friend to hunt my horse - because - though a good rider - he had gained an extraordinary amount of weight… and I could tell my horse was not conditioned to carry it. It wasn’t going to work.

I didn’t shame my friend, I didn’t tell him to skip a meal. I don’t expect him (or anyone else) to be “thin” - and I won’t judge a person’s merit or worth based on whether or not their saddle makes their butt look big.

Because what most people are talking about when they refer to “fat people shouldn’t ride” - they don’t mean the medically obese. They mean anyone who is not very slender or at the very bottom of the range for their normal weight. In short - the beautiful people. You’d be surprised what the average person thinks is “obese”. It’s not the medical definition.

While I’m concerned about the horse’s welfare first and foremost - I think a contented, well cared for horse that is conditioned for the work it is asked to do, and well matched to the rider - is a reasonable goal. In the case of a lesson barn - it is appropriate to ensure that any rider of any level is appropriately mounted - if no mount is available - the student should seek instruction elsewhere.

Personally - I try to be as fit as my horses - because we both have to work hard during the season. But that does not mean I am thin, slender, or one of the beautiful people. Maybe in my next life - but in this one I’m Jane Average in dire need of a nosejob.

Chances are - the folks maligning “fat riders” are pointing fingers at regular healthy people of varying shapes and sizes - or going to the extreme and pointing at the morbidly obese - and those folks aren’t riding anyway.

[QUOTE=Life of Riley;2469832]
First I must apologize to Thomas I. Being a “greenie” I did not post his quote properly in my last posting which was the first paragraph.

Because this topic was listed under Horse Care I assumed we were discussing the physical well being of the horse and what the extra weight of a rider may or may not do to a horse. If my concerns are “babbling and melodramatic” for the horse’s well being than so be it …I am babbling and melodramatic! Also I never gave it a second thought who here was emaciated or overweight. My babbling and melodramatic conerns have been on the effects on the horse’s physical condition. This has obviously turned out for some to be an avenue to discuss some other personal underlying issues. So fling what you have, I will not respond nor do I care to.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Coup De Des;2469519]
Why SHOULD he have a draft horse??

In this age of accountability… why SHOULD HE!! If they want to ride a horse, they need to hold themselves accountable for their own weight, and get themselves down to an acceptable weight TO ride a horse. The answer is NOT get a bigger horse. Ok… it’s just NOT the answer.

Why SHOULD aeroplanes have bigger seats to accomodate the morbidly obese? How about we fix the problem - not make accomodations for it. [/QUOTE]

–you must be perfect. :yes:

You Know, as other posters have stated losing weight is not easy–as much as YOU think it may be. And Im sorry, but you cant tell me that their is no such thing as being “big boned” because it is bluntly obvious when you look at a size “0’s” hip bones compared to a size “12’s” hip bones. People come in all different SHAPES and SIZES. I think i learned that in kindergarden.

Im sorry if you have problems with fat ppl, but im sorry to say that no matter how much you rant that “fat ppl shouldnt ride”, and “fat ppl should just lose the weight”, its not going to happen.

If you care that much and fat ppl bother you that much, then why dont u take an effective step and write places about “serving sizes” or “soda & sugar”.

These “Obesity” threads are just endless arguements, and i dont understand why people keep brining them up. theres a new one everyday.

This is pretty pathetic if you ask me~

hubby is 6’2" 230 and isn’t fat, wears a 34 waist…

[QUOTE=MayS;2468255]
If you feel drafts can carry the weight of a person in armor, why can’t they carry the weight of a large adult?

If so, then why do you put a 210lb weight restriction on your own riders? Why not just get draft horses? Do you feel drafts are no longer suitable for riding for some reason?

In the US the average man weights 191 lbs according to our government (source). That is the average. It means many men are over 191 lbs, since 191 is just what it averages out to be. There are lots of close-to-average guys out there who are around 200-210. Your limitations would possibly ban them from riding. Is 210 a realistic number?


I think that is fair number… My hubbyis fantastically built (from my eyes)…he actually weighs less now than when we met (he used to always ride my 14.3 hand palamino) weighing 244 and having 6 % body fat…he had 21 inch “guns”, great thighs and a “8 pack”…he was one of the fastest on the field in foot ball…large number on the weight department doesn’t mean “fat”.

I’m fat. I’m riding my horse.

Bite me.

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Me thinks I wanna see a pic of your DHs body, Horsecrazy…

OK well alot of times

[QUOTE=Coup De Des;2469519]
Why SHOULD he have a draft horse??

In this age of accountability… why SHOULD HE!! If they want to ride a horse, they need to hold themselves accountable for their own weight, and get themselves down to an acceptable weight TO ride a horse. The answer is NOT get a bigger horse. Ok… it’s just NOT the answer.

Why SHOULD aeroplanes have bigger seats to accomodate the morbidly obese? How about we fix the problem - not make accomodations for it. [/QUOTE]

I do not agree with you but this one you are DEAD ON!!! :wink: