Tack Lockers IN Stalls

[RolltopTX]

@MsM

I have known of barns that had a similar setup (mostly saddleseat for some reason). I get the pain of having crossties in the aisle, but as a boarder, I would rather deal with that.
I like to stand on a clean surface without shavings to do grooming and tacking. My horse would be very upset if he had remaining hay and I crosstied him so it was just out of reach. And my horse would either hurt himself or destroy any hardware on a tack locker in his stall. (I had to modify his bucket handles!)
OP, do you have boarders now? Are they okay with crosstieing in the stall? Are their horses not too inquisitive or destructive?

Since we have more pasture boarders than stall boarders, if the wash rack is busy or it’s super windy (my washrack is outdoors but covered) the rule is that anyone can cross tie in any empty stall but must leave the horse tied and clean up after themselves. I had one boarder who wanted a crazy amount of shavings in her horses stall (which she bought herself) but wasn’t crazy about extra people tacking in there and using up the shavings. The solution was that we always scraped the shavings to the sides and the back corners so any horse that came in were standing on stall mats just like a regular cross tie area. I really liked the idea and started doing it more. I have little collapsible saddle racks on the front of each stall and I’ve had boarders who were crazy about the idea at first that actually ended up loving it because if they needed to step away for a few minutes (like to use the restroom before they mount up, they could leave their horse crossed in their stall, and close the stall door and know their horse couldn’t break free and run loose around property wearing expensive tack.

Your concern about your horse being ticked off at not being able to eat left over hay is definitely valid. It’s something we come across a lot especially for pasture boarded horses that aren’t used to their own private stash of hay, but to be honest it really hasn’t been a big deal. If there is hay in there, of course they always try to reach for it and want to check the grain bucket for left overs but we don’t let them. For the extra persistent ones, after a sharp tug on the cross tie or two, they get over it. If it’s the boarder’s own stall, they’ll usually just hook on the one cross tie and let them munch on hay while grooming/tacking. I suppose you could also hang the cross ties so the horse faces away from the hay… this could also be the solution if you’re concerned about horses kicking and getting hung up in the tack locker (although with 16ft long stalls I think the horse would have to have some pretty long legs to reach).

Could you PM me the facility info of the ones who have had this set up? I’d love to contact them to get their feed back.

[Bluey]

Could you make the stalls 14’ and the lockers between stalls then, 3’ - 4’ by the length of half the stall width?
So the walls between stalls are a full length two lockers, opening one half into that stall, the other opens into the other stall?

Something like this:

I
I_____I I_____I_____I I_____I

Well, doesn’t want to leave the middle bars in the right space, but you get the idea for one more option, if you don’t lose too much space to the lockers.

[RolltopTX]

@Bluey

Could you make the stalls 14’ and the lockers between stalls then, 3’ - 4’ by the length of half the stall width?
So the walls between stalls are a full length two lockers, opening one half into that stall, the other opens into the other stall?

Something like this:

I
I_____I I_____I_____I I_____I

Well, doesn’t want to leave the middle bars in the right space, but you get the idea for one more option, if you don’t lose too much space to the lockers.

I’m not sure I’m understanding what you mean but I always love to brainstorm!

[Emily7rose]

As a boarder I would hate having to walk into the stall to access the locker, I’ve been to a friends barn who’s had that and they ended up changing it afterwards since most people conplained, also I don’t wear my boots to the barn I wear running shoes, sometimes not even barn ones depending on where I’m coming from. I don’t want to have to go walking through my horses dirty stall to switch shoes. Stick them in a corner but have the access point from the outside of the stall.

[vxf111]

@RolltopTX

although with 16ft long stalls I think the horse would have to have some pretty long legs to reach).

That’s not the scenario I am envisioning (horse kicking at the locker while tied). I am imagining a panicked horse getting loose while the locker is open and backing his whole body into the locker. Or swinging himself around and bashing his face.

The ties would have to be breakaway of some sort, or else boy they’re REALLY unsafe. Let’s say a horse spooks, breaks the ties, and now backs into the locker in panic as he backed up and broke the ties. That’s what I am envisioning. And not only is the horse at risk of being hurt on this 3D object, the rider might be in there too getting things from the locker. No way I want to be trapped in a stall with a freaking out/spooking horse backed up against a thing with lots of 3D projections at eye level.

Sh*t happens. That’s why we try to make stalls safe. And even in the safest stalls, horses have accidents. But this, to me, increases the risk.

[MissAriel]

Among some of the other points brought up earlier, my horse is mouthy and inquisitive. He has toys in his stall, but also considers any protrusion in his stall as a toy. So the latch on the door would have to be solid. I would have to put the crossties out each time I used them and put them away when finished or he would mangle them. It would be hard to clean tack with him loose, so I would have to keep him tied.

I would much prefer the door opening to the aisle with hinges that allow the door to swing open all the way then secured back to the wall to keep the aisle clear. With a sliding door you won’t be able to utilize the door to hang bridles, etc.

I would also miss the social aspect of the community cross ties if we tacked up in the stall. I enjoy talking with my fellow boarders about our horses, families, jobs, etc while grooming, cleaning tack and tacking up.

I am looking forward to moving to the new barn where there will be a community tack room with lockers, which I think is the best of both worlds. Everyone gets a locker they can organize how they wish and will contain “tack creep” from spilling over into the other boarder’s stuff.

But since you are planning on going this route for your boarders, a couple more thoughts:

• cleaning the floor of the closet if you can’t sweep it out the 18 inch high door will be tough, and dirt/dust is a given.
• be sure you build the door and hinges to support the weight of a saddle (or two) if you mount the saddle rack to the door. I have seen vertical tack trunks with shelving on the doors and the door needed a wheel supporting it so the entire weight of the door/shelves wasn’t hanging on the hinges when open.
• whether this was a deal breaker or not for me would entirely depend on the other amenities, costs and options available, but I, personally, would likely consider this setup with the “cons” rather than “pros”

[RolltopTX]

@vxf111

No, I don’t like this any better based on the pictures. In photo #1 there is a hinge for the horse to rub on and scratch himself. Even while the locker is closed. And there’s a lovely pile of manure right in front of the door. Which I think illustrates why this design is flawed. No one wants to traverse manure to get their tack.

With either #1 or #2, all you need is one good spook when the locker is opened and now you’re desperately holding a wound closed while waiting for the emergency vet to come out with sutures. The whole point of stalls is NOT to have 3D stuff. Now you’re adding 3D stuff. The whole point of stalls is to create a safe, relatively private place for horses. Adding a bunch of 3D stuff, moving parts, and electricity that could be exposed is asking for injuries. And with mouthy horses, they’re going to be trying to get in to the lockers, and they eventually will.

In addition, no one wants to tack up or store their stuff amid shavings and manure. No one. No one wants to walk around a horse, through dirty shavings, to get their helmet or their gloves. Why not put some shavings and manure in your garage for a couple weeks and see how you like going to/from your car through that every day? I bet you wouldn’t. Same idea.

I get that you want to do upscale and I agree that the idea of lockers is a nice idea. But I think this design is one of those things that fancy rich people who aren’t that horsey think sounds good on paper, but not something that actual horsemen would want/appreciate.

I 100% agree on the hinges… I would never install doors with the hinges like that. I want a door that is totally flush with the wall… with no hinges or latches that stick out or can catch on a tail. As for “eventually this or that will happen”, you’re probably right. However, I don’t see it as being any more of a risk/ hazard than a normal cross tie area (when you’re tacking up). There are pros and cons to both in that sense. Like a horse spooking in the wash rack could break free, run around and get a major injury as well. Electricity wouldn’t be in the horses stall, it would be in the tack locker. This is no different from an outlet being placed between 2 stall fronts. As for there being more 3D objects, not really. The angled “corner” will be there regardless of a tack locker or not because the truss is there and there has to be an access panel for occasional maintenance. I figured I might as well make the space useful ;o) The tack locker door being open would account for like less than 5% of the time as well. If I can pull it off without using to much room, I would prefer the saddle racks stay in the locker. But like someone else said, that makes it a PIA to clean tack… so I’d love to at least have the option of a collapsible style saddle rack on the door for the occasional cleaning.

As for being more hazardous because of the amount of time spent alone in their stall, we do as much turn out as possible. When they are in due to bad weather, we try to keep hay in front of them 24/7 with slow feeders to keep them happy and occupied (makes the stall easier to clean too). Most stalls have grill partitions so they can see their buddies and the busy bodies usually have a toy of some sort as well to play with. With the door being flush with the wall, it’s just going to be the same as any other wall so I don’t see horses breaking in being very likely. I think boarder error would be more likely in that case. However, this is why I would love to hear from other facilities with this set up so I can do my best to avoid certain issues.

I can see how shavings might be annoying for some. We had a lot of success with banking shavings against the wall after they were cleaned and this worked awesome! It really saved a lot of shavings being scooped up by riders not so skilled in the art of manure sifting. Obviously this solution won’t work if the weather is bad and the horse is in though. What I hate more than shavings is boarders/students in the cross ties who will scoop up their horse’s manure (half-assed usually) but won’t sweep/pick up hoof pickings… so we lead our horses in stepping on rock hard mud chunks or little gravel pieces. I even have funny signs reminding people to sweep up hoof pickings… it still happens.

I know you can’t please everyone but I’d like to do my best to make it as functional as possible. Let’s say your barn was expanding but short on space…What if having a tack locker meant the barn could add a nice climate controlled lounge with a nicer bathroom? or 4 more stalls to help pay the bills so board doesn’t have to go up? or space for a theraplate and solarium? Would you put up with tacking in your stall to gain access to those? I’d love to be rich and have it all with all the room in the world to do it on but sadly… ;o)

[vxf111]

The kind of people who can afford a barn with a theraplate and solarium

1. Don’t want to wade around manure to get to their stuff
2. Have grooms (largely)

No matter how you try to convince me I want this-- I don’t. It would be a huge negative and I’d either have to have very limited options or for the other benefits to be hugely outweighed for me to go for it.

[vxf111]

And no, I actually don’t want a solarium. I want, in this order…

1. Good care
2. Safe
3. Good turnout
4. Nice riding facilities
5. People I like working with

Having my own tack locker is so low on the list that I wouldn’t even list it. I don’t need a solarium at the barn. I can vibrate my horse on the trailer if I’m in the mood.

Maybe I’m not the kind of boarder you’re looking for. I don’t care about fancy, I care about SAFE.

And, interestingly, I am perfectly capable of cleaning up after myself and putting my tack away.

I think your lockers are less likely to appeal to the kind of rider I am. But perhaps you’re not looking for boarders like me? To each his/her own. Someone cares about having crystal chandeliers in the barn. It’s just not me.

[buck22]

I am going to go completely against the tide and say I’d be open to this as a boarder, and might even learn to love it - but the concept is fraught with hazards, as many have pointed out.

Having spent many years in an extremely busy barn with more horses and boarders than grooming/tacking capacity, I frequently groomed and tacked my horse in his stall. There were many days where there just was no other option. I finally got very comfortable with the routine and liked the coziness. As I tend to shy away from excessive chit chat with other boarders as my time is limited, the privacy suited me well.

I also rather like the idea of someone having to get past my horse to get to my stuff : ) Not that he’s dangerous or not easily bribed, but its a measure of additional privacy I think I’d enjoy - as again, years at a busy barn had me carving my name into everything I owned, and even that wasn’t enough - my gear frequently went missing, and I even had a rather nice saddle stolen once.

I can see a lot of things being annoying, like stepping around manure, brushing shavings away from polo wraps - but as the owner of a horse who’s pretty tidy, and my tendency to use quick wraps over polos, I don’t think I’d be bothered. As the owner of a horse who likes to pee in the aisle, this would save having to clean up a mess.

I would also anticipate quite the war with my horse if I attempted to remove him from his hay to cross time him just a few feet away for grooming and tacking. That would NOT go over well. But, there may be a way to position everything safely so the horse can munch while being groomed.

I don’t think of it as a particularly fancy feature to have in a barn - unless you’re intending to go all ooh la la over it - but I can see it as being a good way to maximize space in a smallish area. I would certainly prefer to have a larger stall for my horse as a trade off - provided there were adequate areas to clean tack, boots, sit, etc.

There are NUMEROUS safety issues, however, a lot of thought has to go into it. And I don’t think its a good solution for every horse and rider, but I’m sure there are some out there like me that would like it just fine.

[StormyDay]

@vxf111

That’s not the scenario I am envisioning (horse kicking at the locker while tied). I am imagining a panicked horse getting loose while the locker is open and backing his whole body into the locker. Or swinging himself around and bashing his face.

The ties would have to be breakaway of some sort, or else boy they’re REALLY unsafe. Let’s say a horse spooks, breaks the ties, and now backs into the locker in panic as he backed up and broke the ties. That’s what I am envisioning. And not only is the horse at risk of being hurt on this 3D object, the rider might be in there too getting things from the locker. No way I want to be trapped in a stall with a freaking out/spooking horse backed up against a thing with lots of 3D projections at eye level.

Sh*t happens. That’s why we try to make stalls safe. And even in the safest stalls, horses have accidents. But this, to me, increases the risk.

This is exactly what I was worried about as well. The horse backs in the locker, or catches their hip. My flighty TB would definitely be likely to do this, and even my calm guy would injure himself if he caught his hip on the door.

[Wayside]

I agree with vxf111 completely. It seems like it would be tedious on a good day, but more importantly, there are just way too many things that could go horribly wrong with this on a bad one.

[vxf111]

OP I just noticed on another thread that you’re putting these stalls in the indoor? If I understood you correctly.

First of all, I find that to be a nightmare from a health perspective. All the dust kicked up by riding gets to be breathed in by the horses when they’re in the stalls. So for that reason alone, I would pass.

But in terms of the tack lockers. This means is Suzie Q wants to take her saddle to her car, she has to do the following…

1. Walk through the riding arena, dodging riders/horses
2. Get into her stall without letting her horse escape into the ring
3. Tie her horse up
4. Dodge poop and pee on the way to the locker
5. Open the tack locker and take out her saddle, closing and locking the locker behind her (one handed I guess)
6. Untie her horse (one handed)
7. Dodge poop on the way out
8. Get out of the stall (one handed) without again letting her horse escape
9. Carry her saddle through the riding arena, dodging riders/horses

I mean, stop for a minute and put yourself in the boarder’s shoes. Is that a practical way to access one’s tack?

Having read your other thread it seems like you’re really attracted to amenities that seem “fancy” but that don’t really benefit the horse/rider. Is a horse getting a disease from or bitten by his neighbor over a shared Nelson waterer better than hanging individual buckets? Sure, Nelsons seem fancier but is it really better if you can’t afford to properly do one per stall? Is a tack locker really convenient if you have to dodge a horse to use it? Sure, tack lockers seem fancier but even a Stanley trunk in the aisle is better if it’s easier to get things in/out? I assume the stalls inside the arena is because you have no other choice-- but it’s a really unpleasant setup for lots of reasons. Plus there are trusses that are giving you really odd-sized stalls. 10x16 but a truss blocks the corner. Big horses in a 10x16 stall with a corner carved out could find that space tight. I don’t really like having big horses in anything smaller than 12x12 and I don’t think going deeper is as good as square in terms of horse comfort/not getting cast. Those Nelsons are going to carve out another chunk of space too.

Would it make more sense to scale back the fancy, skip the lockers and Nelsons, and build a smaller separate building with 12x12 stalls and more practical amenities?

I don’t know where you are geographically or what things cost in your area-- but for the $50,000 you threw out as a budget you could build a very nice 10 stall concrete center aisle barn with basic electric and water. Which I would take any day over the shared nelsons, tack locker in stall, and stalls in the indoor.

Assuming I’m your sort of client. Again, I guess it depends whether your clientele is more focused on safety/practicality or on flash. If flash is what they want though, I bet they won’t be high on shared waterers or stalls in the indoor

I looked at one barn in SLC that clearly had been designed with flash in mind and not practicality. They had constant turnover. As soon as people moved in and realized what a PITA the facility was, they started looking to move. They had a LOT of empty stalls with corner lockers (that opened into the aisle).

[trubandloki]

I have no problem tacking in my stall, generally. I do it at home where there is no one but me.
I also have lived my entire life with out a heated or air conditioned tack room so that part does not bother me either.

I admit that the idea of every random person using my stall to tack is not appealing to me though. And that leads to another issue with your lockers in the stall thing, are they lockable? If anyone can use any stall for tacking then my locker in my stall will be easily accessible by anyone using my stall to tack.

Where will the pasture kept horses, that I assume do not have stalls since they are using any open stall to tack, going to keep their tack and supplies?

[mmeqcenter]

In line with most other responses - as a boarder I would have not have liked tack lockers only accessible from inside the stall. I boarded at one barn that had lockers attached to the stalls, and they were the ones on the corner that open into the aisle. That was fine.
As a boarder, I would not have been happy with other boarders (pasture boarders) putting their horse in my stall. I do not allow the sharing of boarder stalls now at my barn that I own.

Both of these items on their own would prevent me from boarding at a facility, much less combined.

I am fine with cross ties in the stall, although as others pointed out, dodging manure to tack up isn’t ideal.

[CPL713]

I have no problem tacking in my stall, but I agree with all of the other points being made about why a boarder might not want a tack locker IN their stall. One that opens into the aisle wouldn’t bother me at all.

I grew up in a high-end A barn with wealthy/“fancy” clientele. I feel confident in saying they would really dislike the idea of having their tack locker in their stall and wouldn’t care at all about a solarium (sorry, but that is the last thing any rider I know has on their mind when going to the barn). You would be able to sell a few of them on a theraplate, and even more on a nice lounge area, but if the trade-off was a tack locker that opened in the stall, I don’t think they’d go for it.

One of my previous barns wound up raising board costs and used that money to install new grooming stalls, refresh the footing, and do a few other capital improvements. Boarders seem okay with that trade-off, because it benefitted them. (Mind you, I would leave my current facility if they raised the rates, but that’s because the pro/con list I keep in my head would be overweight on cons if the cost went up. lol)

Sorry to say it, but a tack locker in my horse’s stall would go on the con side of my pro/con list when looking at boarding facilities.

ETA: I didn’t realize what you were talking about when you said “solarium” - we always just called them heat lights. Oops. So that would be a nice benefit, but still not that important when all other things are considered in the grand scheme of choosing a barn.

[MissAriel]

@RolltopTX

the rule is that anyone can cross tie in any empty stall but must leave the horse tied and clean up after themselves. … we always scraped the shavings to the sides and the back corners so any horse that came in were standing on stall mats just like a regular cross tie area.

I’m not sure how I missed this detail that pasture boarders could be using my stall for tacking up. Where will their tack be located then, and what if I need to untack before they are finished tacking? And I have to sweep up the shavings along the sides?? I guess it works for you and your boarders but for me this would be a big negative.

Also you keep mentioning the completely flush doors. How will you be able to secure them closed or open them with no protruding hardware?

[Bluey]

I never heard of people with pasture boarding coming into other boarder’s stalls for anything?

They may come into grooming stalls, wash stalls, tacking up stalls.
Stalls other boarders pay for, have water, bedding and feed in there for their horse?
Much less a tack locker?
Not sure I would think that is ok, for several good reasons.

Guess you learn something new all the time.

The local upscale riding club here for decades had each horse stabled in it’s own small and separated from others 12’ x 24’ shed with a 24’ x 34’ to 60’ run.
The 4’ shed corner was an enclosed tack/feed room, where you kept all your horse supplies and you fed out of.

Every one came and went and fed and cleaned as they got around to, or had the club’s dedicated grooms do that for them.

That is the only place I know where supplies were kept in individual enclosures.
Practically all other barns we had dedicated tack and feed rooms for those supplies.

I would also question anyone thinking that a fabric covered structure can be considered any of the more fancy horse barns.

Will be interesting to see what the OP comes up with and how it works for her.

[RolltopTX]

@vxf111

OP I just noticed on another thread that you’re putting these stalls in the indoor? If I understood you correctly.

First of all, I find that to be a nightmare from a health perspective. All the dust kicked up by riding gets to be breathed in by the horses when they’re in the stalls. So for that reason alone, I would pass.

But in terms of the tack lockers. This means is Suzie Q wants to take her saddle to her car, she has to do the following…

1. Walk through the riding arena, dodging riders/horses
2. Get into her stall without letting her horse escape into the ring
3. Tie her horse up
4. Dodge poop and pee on the way to the locker
5. Open the tack locker and take out her saddle, closing and locking the locker behind her (one handed I guess)
6. Untie her horse (one handed)
7. Dodge poop on the way out
8. Get out of the stall (one handed) without again letting her horse escape
9. Carry her saddle through the riding arena, dodging riders/horses

I mean, stop for a minute and put yourself in the boarder’s shoes. Is that a practical way to access one’s tack?

Having read your other thread it seems like you’re really attracted to amenities that seem “fancy” but that don’t really benefit the horse/rider. Is a horse getting a disease from or bitten by his neighbor over a shared Nelson waterer better than hanging individual buckets? Sure, Nelsons seem fancier but is it really better if you can’t afford to properly do one per stall? Is a tack locker really convenient if you have to dodge a horse to use it? Sure, tack lockers seem fancier but even a Stanley trunk in the aisle is better if it’s easier to get things in/out? I assume the stalls inside the arena is because you have no other choice-- but it’s a really unpleasant setup for lots of reasons. Plus there are trusses that are giving you really odd-sized stalls. 10x16 but a truss blocks the corner. Big horses in a 10x16 stall with a corner carved out could find that space tight. I don’t really like having big horses in anything smaller than 12x12 and I don’t think going deeper is as good as square in terms of horse comfort/not getting cast. Those Nelsons are going to carve out another chunk of space too.

Would it make more sense to scale back the fancy, skip the lockers and Nelsons, and build a smaller separate building with 12x12 stalls and more practical amenities?

I don’t know where you are geographically or what things cost in your area-- but for the $50,000 you threw out as a budget you could build a very nice 10 stall concrete center aisle barn with basic electric and water. Which I would take any day over the shared nelsons, tack locker in stall, and stalls in the indoor.

Assuming I’m your sort of client. Again, I guess it depends whether your clientele is more focused on safety/practicality or on flash. If flash is what they want though, I bet they won’t be high on shared waterers or stalls in the indoor

I looked at one barn in SLC that clearly had been designed with flash in mind and not practicality. They had constant turnover. As soon as people moved in and realized what a PITA the facility was, they started looking to move. They had a LOT of empty stalls with corner lockers (that opened into the aisle).

The building is 72x300’ and houses my 200’ dressage arena. The stalls would be in the front 100’ ft of the building so it’s not in the actual arena… just under the same roof.

A 10x16 stall with the tack locker is still 8 sq ft larger than a regular 12x12. Lets say I went with 12x12 stalls, I would have to set them 3 ft away from the actual building wall to allow for height clearance from the trusses. That would be 420sq ft of wasted space. The tack lockers for 18 stalls take up a combined 144 sq ft. Lets say I use a 12x24 space for a tack room, that’s 288 sq ft and means I would lose 2 stalls. Lets each stall is $500 a month. Now 16 boarders would have to pay an additional $62.50 a month for 8 sq ft less of space. This also doesn’t account for loss lesson/training revenue that could come from 2 stalls… board would have to go up $100 for 2 less stalls and there wouldn’t be any space to add additional amenities later. Is a separate tack room worth $100 extra a month?

Its not going to be super fancy at all, but 50k is a tight budget considering it’s 18 stalls and having to also run plumbing and electric through out. Heated/easy to clean/durable automatic waterers are a “must have” on my list since I do all the maintenance myself and will have to do chores occasionally when the help calls in sick.

[Nestor]

@RolltopTX

Is a separate tack room worth $100 extra a month?

YES.

I wouldn’t mind the idea of a tack locker on the stall, IF it was only opened onto the aisle, and IF I only had to use it for brushes, wraps, meds, etc. that are handy to have stored right at the stall. Tack should be in a temperature-controlled space. If you envision boarders tacking up in their stalls, have a folding saddle rack next to each stall door. Boarders can bring their tack to that when it’s time to ride, and otherwise use their stalls as you envision.

A tack room does not have to be that big. My BO just built one that had to be in an L shape, and it has room for 16 individual lockers and 15 saddle racks, plus a big couch, a bench for putting on boots, and some other free space that we couldn’t put anything in because of the layout. And it’s BEAUTIFUL. I believe it’s 10x14 with another 8x10 section, so 220sf. Again, if you are starting from scratch and can create a square room without the funky layout things we had to deal with (random electrical panel we can’t cover, an exterior door, funny L shape), you can EASILY fit the same into a 10x14 space (or 10x16, so one of your stalls).