Talk to me about Pit Bulls

[chancellor2]

Bluey,
I’d want to know more about that story before commenting on it. For instance, was the dog a resident dog or family pet?
Are they sure that the dog in question was a pit bull?
How do they know? Are they going on looks alone?
and there is often FAR more to the story than what the media reports.

Part of the reason the CDC report was retracted was because there was no good way to define whether the dog doing the biting was in fact a pit bull. Let’s face it, the media loves to say that any dog with a big head and/or a brindled coat is a pit bull. Frankly, I don’t KNOW that Scarlett is one either since she was a rescue and we don’t know her heritage.

Now Sadie, she was AKC. So I knew she was a pit bull(well, American Staffordshire Terrier). SHE would give my Siamese cat a bath every morning. The cat is STILL trying to get the other two dogs to give him a bath. They refuse.

[Logical]

[QUOTE=chancellor2;6226051]
GOOD LORD! Why do people still believe this bull shit??
There is no locking jaw mechanism. That is a fallacy further fueled by the media.

Additionally, SOME of the more intelligent insurance agencies are beginning to see the error of their ways and ARE insuring homes with pit bulls. Liberty Mutual here in MA insured us after meeting my (then) two pit bulls and realizing there was no way they were going to bite someone. Farmer’s insurance, I believe also has no unfair “breedist” rules on their books.

BTW, my Scarlett once had a small animal in her mouth. I yelled Drop it. And she did.[/QUOTE]

I feel the reason people want to believe the myths about these dogs is because they choose/want to be ignorant. Not saying the Melelio is choosing or wanting to be ignorant. Just a couple years ago I was told my pit mix would kill my baby because her brain would grow too big therefore causing pressure which would lead to her attacking. Really people? Locking jaws? Brains growing too big? Taste of blood equals a killer from now on?

Guess what, my kid is now 8y/o and my pit mix and the full pits have never laid a tooth on her! Now my mom’s two chihuahuas have bitten her several times (drawing blood a couple of times) and they are not the typical chi’s. Mom raises them like they are ‘big’ dogs and doesn’t do the whole carrying around in purses or coddling them.

I have 3 scars from 3 different dogs. 1 was a hound (I had stupidly stuck my hand into his kennel), the other 2 were labs that my family owned. Both bites were unprovoked. The one lab was PTS due to increasing aggression. He bite me because I was walking and happened to walk between him and my dad. I have never been bitten by a pit or even a pit looking dog. In fact, I have met more aggressive non-pit breeds than I have met pits and that’s saying something as I used to travel to shows to show my pit. In fact, at one show, a dog got lose and took off running. Everyone there just reached down picked up their puppies, or put their dogs back into their crates while the human kids were left to continue to play. The dog ran a big circle and came right back to his owner looking oh so pleased with himself.

I grew up believing in that pits were killing machines. When I became old enough I did my own research and guess what: Pit Bulls are by far my top choice for dog. And I have owned many types from mutts to collies to GSDs to Labs to Chows to Great Danes to Beagles to Chihuahuas. I love my pits. Granted I did put 2 of my dogs down due to increasing dog-on-dog aggression. They never showed aggression to a human whether adult or child, but for whatever reason they were getting more and more aggressive towards the other dogs. Despite behavioral training it kept on. So I did the right thing. The responsible thing.

[CrazyGuineaPigLady]

@Bluey;6226081

Then you have the stories like three months ago here, a lady left her week old baby in her bassinet and fell asleep in the sofa and woke up to their pit bull dragging the baby by it’s head around the room.

I wouldn’t have left my daughter alone with my 12.5 year old, arthritic, slept 20 hours a day, never showed a hint of aggression, Basset Hound for one second when I brought her home from the hospital. Or my mother’s Pomeranian. Babies cry and it’s upsetting to dogs and cats and probably birds that have never heard it.

That’s a stupid (or overwhelmed/overtired) human problem, not a Pitbull issue.

[FrenchFrytheEqHorse]

Interesting game:

http://www.understand-a-bull.com/Findthebull/findpitbull_v3.html

[JanM]

I’ve noticed that many times the brindle killer ‘pits’ are really something like boxer or other breed crosses and not any type of pit either.

[RougeEmpire]

Well this is all I have to say about owning Pitt Bulls. Owning a PB puts the dog at risk. I have several close friends spread out over the country who’s PBs were STOLEN right out of their homes, cars and back yards. A friends bitch was BEATEN with a pipe in her own back yard to steal her puppies. At least three of the stolen dogs I know of were “recovered” some time later but only because they were part of an Organized Dog Fighting bust. The recovered dogs once happy healthy family pets were vicious and covered in woulds and scars. All were euthanized because sadly for my close friends who had owned them bringing the dogs home was no longer an option.

My own brothers red nosed PB was almost stolen out of a parked car in San Francisco. Thankfully a passer bye saw some thug trying to jimmy the door open with a slim jim. These days Kuma the family PB is locked in the basement when no one is home (to hide him) and Hatties the Doberman patrols the property. The Dobe’s job is to protect the PB…from people. I have seen to many PBs outright stolen for the purpose to ODFing to ever taking the risk of owning one. Sadly the very act of owning a Pitt Bull puts the dog at risk.

[chancellor2]

[QUOTE=RougeEmpire;6226257]
Well this is all I have to say about owning Pitt Bulls. Owning a PB puts the dog at risk. I have several close friends spread out over the country who’s PBs were STOLEN right out of their homes, cars and back yards. A friends bitch was BEATEN with a pipe in her own back yard to steal her puppies. At least three of the stolen dogs I know of were “recovered” some time later but only because they were part of an Organized Dog Fighting bust. The recovered dogs once happy healthy family pets were vicious and covered in woulds and scars. All were euthanized because sadly for my close friends who had owned them bringing the dogs home was no longer an option.

My own brothers red nosed PB was almost stolen out of a parked car in San Francisco. Thankfully a passer bye saw some thug trying to jimmy the door open with a slim jim. These days Kuma the family PB is locked in the basement when no one is home (to hide him) and Hatties the Doberman patrols the property. The Dobe’s job is to protect the PB…from people. I have seen to many PBs outright stolen for the purpose to ODFing to ever taking the risk of owning one. Sadly the very act of owning a Pitt Bull puts the dog at risk.[/QUOTE]

Also not completely true. The people stealing dogs for bait dogs are stealing any kind of dog they can get. Pit bulls included. So, this is not a breed specific issue but a dog specific issue.

[RougeEmpire]

[QUOTE=chancellor2;6226276]
Also not completely true. The people stealing dogs for bait dogs are stealing any kind of dog they can get. Pit bulls included. So, this is not a breed specific issue but a dog specific issue.[/QUOTE]

The majority of PBs stolen are NOT stolen as “bait dogs”, they are stolen as potential fighters. Dog Fighters use other breeds as bait dogs as the PB it’s self is to valuable as a potential fighter. It’s such a big problem that shelters often padlock in PBs and some even have staff on around the clock as well as cameras to detour theft specificly of PBs. For the record my best friend works at an Animal Control Center in Los Angeles county. He tells me they “lock down” the PBs but don’t worry about the other breeds because no one steals the other dogs, but there is a BIG issue with PBs being stolen. Many many people have even been fired for taking payment from known ODFs to sneak PB dogs out.

He is also a person who after seeing how bad the problem really is swore to never own a PB. Having seen beloved family pets (mostly PBs) brought in by the Animal Control officers having been stolen, sold, trained, abused and fought he vowed to never own one again. The fact is theft of PBs is a BIG problem and a much much much bigger problem among PBs than other breeds. More specificly the theft of PBs for the purpose of dog fighting.

[chancellor2]

RogueEmpire, I have been involved with pit bull rescue for about 10 years now.
You are right that pit bulls are stolen and some are stolen as fighting dogs. This IS a problem. Is it SUCH a big problem that someone shouldn’t get one? In my opinion, no.
Saying things like that contributes to the bad stigma of these poor dogs. Someone is thinking of getting a pit bull (and there are so many needing good homes) and you are now making them worry about a problem that is fairly limited.
Yes, in the inner cities, you may see this. But if people are reasonable dog owners, ie don’t leave your dogs tied outside when no one is home, don’t leave your dogs running loose, worrying about having your dog stolen is akin to worrying about being struck by lightning on a cloudy day.

[Libby416]

Growing up riding at a backyard barn, the owner had two pitbulls that I think really showed how their behavior is really based on the individual, not the breed itself. She had a male and female, both from the same litter, both neutered. The female was the SWEETEST thing ever, wouldn’t leave you alone for kisses and rubs, and you have to remember that this is when I was younger, around like 7-8 yrs old, so I’m sure we tugged on her and did lots of obnoxious things to her, and she was like a nanny dog to us. The male on the other hand did not have free reign like she did. He had to be contained to his kennel during the day when people were there, as he was aggressive. They would let him out at night and he would guard their property like any good guard dog. He wasn’t the type to snarl and growl just from seeing us, since he knew us, but he definitely would not tolerate us like the female.

So if that tells you anything, it would be its the individual not the breed. She was a top notch barn dog, he was a top notch guard dog.

[wendy]

yes, individuals within a breed vary- but we have breeds because we want predictability in looks and behavior. Most members of a breed will all look fairly similar to each other, and have similar characteristics. If you’re looking for a new dog, you should careful study the various breeds and select a breed that has traits that fit in with what you want out of a dog. Once you’ve selected a breed, then you go about selecting an individual.
The two most important traits to select for dogs is their exercise needs, and their basic temperament traits. Persons who are couch-potatoes who select dogs who need hours of running exercise every day are probably not going to be happy dog owners, and their dogs are going to be equally unhappy; of course the reverse is also true. As to basic temperament, if you want a cuddly velcro dog who is eager to please and you choose a breed noted for being independent and to ask “what’s in it for me?” odds are you and the dog will not be happy together.
Most of what is said about pit bulls is completely wrong, but even considering the actual facts, they aren’t a breed that fits into most households. MOST pit bulls are dog-aggressive. MOST pit bulls have a strong prey drive. MOST need more exercise than the average pet owner is willing to provide. MOST need some kind of work, which most pet owners cannot provide. MOST need more skillful and consistent training than the average pet owner is able to provide. MOST should never be let off lead in most circumstances, in part due to their undeserved reputation. MANY insurance companies discriminate against them. MOST rental living situations won’t rent to owners of pit bulls. SOME places have laws banning their very existence.
It’s too bad so many end up in shelters- but that doesn’t mean everyone should run out and adopt one, because MOST people can’t provide a happy home for most of these dogs. Unfortunately, MOST of the pitties in the shelters are badly bred dogs who weren’t properly socialized as youngsters which makes them even more difficult to keep as good pets.
Exceptions abound, but I would advise few persons to get a pit bull. You can love a breed yet realize it is not a breed that most people should ever consider getting.

[chancellor2]

Wendy,
Out of curiosity, from where are you getting these ideas?

[marta]

[QUOTE=meupatdoes;6225724]

But, if my 12lb dachshund mix and 20lb pom/jack mix go running down the trail tails awag, the general public sees it as “two cute dogs doing the happy run.”
.[/QUOTE]

i don’t know where you live, but your attitude that you can let your dogs run around the park off leash and approach other people at will is selfish and irresponsible and in my state, illegal.
i don’t care if your dog is 2 lbs or 200 lbs, when in public it should be on a leash or trained to recall under any circumstances, so that other park users, whether with dogs or without, don’t have to be subjected to your dogs’ uninvited attention.
this is a big pet peeve of mine.

[Bluey]

It was an accident and because of the breed/s it was, it set back the fight against breed specific ban laws:

http://www.connectamarillo.com/news/story.aspx?id=670704#.T3X9i-3OFaU

[meupatdoes]

[QUOTE=marta;6226643]
i don’t know where you live, but your attitude that you can let your dogs run around the park off leash and approach other people at will is selfish and irresponsible and in my state, illegal.
i don’t care if your dog is 2 lbs or 200 lbs, when in public it should be on a leash or trained to recall under any circumstances, so that other park users, whether with dogs or without, don’t have to be subjected to your dogs’ uninvited attention.
this is a big pet peeve of mine.[/QUOTE]

Feel better now?

[chancellor2]

[QUOTE=Bluey;6226645]
It was an accident and because of the breed/s it was, it set back the fight against breed specific ban laws:

http://www.connectamarillo.com/news/story.aspx?id=670704#.T3X9i-3OFaU[/QUOTE]

What a horrible story! But honestly, can you say that this mother was wise in leaving a dog (ANY dog) unattended while she slept? I certainly wouldn’t.

I was re-reading Wendy’s rather negative post about pit bulls and wanted to clear a thing or two up.
First, just because a dog was poorly socialized young does not mean that they cannot learn to be decent members of society. Perhaps the greatest examples of this are some of Michael Vick’s dogs. They had to have had a rather horrific upbringing and yet, through the power of pit bull forgiveness are now leading lives as therapy dogs.

Pit bulls do not need any more exercise than your average labrador or golden retriever. Frankly, they may need less. What they DO need is to be with their people. The so-called resident dog (a dog who lives in the yard with little interaction with the family) is more of a problem than a family dog.

If you are looking for a dog to live outside that you pat as you walk out to the car, then a pit bull is not for you. They crave human interaction.

They ARE more stubborn sometimes than some other breeds of dogs. They are also more intelligent. It really does not take all that much to have a pit bull as your family pet.

Scarlett HAS declared war on chipmunks and squirrels in the yard. She is, after all, a terrier. I don’t have a problem with that. Has she chased a cat outside? Yes. I don’t know many dogs who don’t. Can I call her off? Absolutely.

Anyone of reasonable intelligence can raise a pit bull as a good member of society if they so choose.

[tabula_rashah]

I am not really a dog person at all, but I can honestly say I’ve never met a pit that I didn’t like. Our dog is part pit and is a big sweetie- he is fine with cats (we have 7 of them), walks like a gentleman off leash, knows all his basic commands and is great with kids. He is a bit intimidated by the horses though. Here’s a photo of the vicious beast hanging out on our boat.

[chancellor2]

I am sort of curious Tabula why you think your dog is part pit bull. He’s beautiful but I wouldn’t think “pit bull” when I see him!

[FrenchFrytheEqHorse]

[QUOTE=tabula rashah;6226706]
I am not really a dog person at all, but I can honestly say I’ve never met a pit that I didn’t like. Our dog is part pit and is a big sweetie- he is fine with cats (we have 7 of them), walks like a gentleman off leash, knows all his basic commands and is great with kids. He is a bit intimidated by the horses though. Here’s a photo of the vicious beast hanging out on our boat.[/QUOTE]

What makes you think your pup is part pit? Do you know his parents? I don’t see any pit in him at all…

[FrenchFrytheEqHorse]

Just to re-direct, I think the OP has gotten tons of great advice on the topic at hand. None of the pit bull owners on this thread have told her she should go out tomorrow and adopt a pit bull, and we’ve all be honest about the potential shortcomings of owning one of these dogs.

We’ve also talked about the positive aspects of responsibly owning a pit. We’ve spoken from our own, personal experiences doing this every day. Not from the perspective of the media, or someone who’s obviously bought into the media hype surrounding the breed. Would I trust my dog alone with a week old baby while I took a nap on the couch? Nope. But that’s not because she’s a pit bull, that’s because I’m not an idiot. Would I take her out walking in my crowded (city) neighborhood off-leash? Heck no, but not because she’s a pit bull… because there are leash laws here, lots of traffic, and lots of other dogs that we don’t know.