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Tennessee Walking Horse Soring Issue *Update post 1*

Off Course
#61

[QUOTE=equinedriver;6321048]
Okay, have no knowledge about this except that it has disgusted me for 40 years. Why on earth was he smacking the horse in the head with a stick??? I can understand the theory with soreing the feet, as disgusting as it is, but what are they trying to achieve by smacking them in the head or hitting them with cattle prods???[/QUOTE]

I would guess it’s to get them riled up? Make them flinchy? Considering they’d probably rather lay down and die, it probably takes considerable effort to get them into the flight mode to motivate them to show or train.

#62

I think the idea is to try to eventually make them afraid to move during pain - so that when inspectors poke and prod their legs, they don’t flinch.

#63

I knew W/W Trailmaster, aka “Duke”, he was a prime example of a cruelty-free trained horse, as are the majority of the horses and trainers of this breed. I do not and will never condone the cruel methods used by some trainers, but for me it is difficult to stand by and watch such a wonderful animal and their cruelty-free owners and trainers as a whole be punished for the acts of a few trainers. The trainers convicted should be tried and punished, but the public as a whole needs to be properly educated in the fact that the majority of horses are, as a general, are not abused in any way and that there are governing groups with the sole purpose to protect the animal from this kind of harm.

#64

[QUOTE=equinedriver;6321048]
Okay, have no knowledge about this except that it has disgusted me for 40 years. Why on earth was he smacking the horse in the head with a stick??? I can understand the theory with soreing the feet, as disgusting as it is, but what are they trying to achieve by smacking them in the head or hitting them with cattle prods???[/QUOTE]

When a DQP inspects a horse for being sored it’s done by manual palpation. You pick up the foot and apply pressure at certain points and look for a “pain reaction.” If the horse reacts and then that is probable cause to find the horse “sored” unless there is some clear, other reason (like an injury from some mechanical cause, etc.). You also visually examine the foot looking for any evidence of soring chemicals or processes. You also examine the foot for scars that would indicate previous soring.

“Stewarding” is the practice of teaching the horse not to respond to the pain of palpation. It’s a rather brutal practice no matter how it’s done. Frankly I don’t even understand the “stewarding” shown in the video because if you’re going to do it you’ve still got to abide by the 3 sec. rule or you’re just beating the horse for no reason.

There is a truly evil body of “scientific knowledge” behind soring and stewarding horses. Learing of it is not for the faint of heart. DQPs are taught the 5Ws of soring and stewarding so that they can recognize them and their sequellae.

Note that DQPs are hired by show management, the same as judges, vets, farriers, etc. It’s like a bar hiring a “bouncer.” What kind to you want? You want a “strict” one who might cost you money or do you want an “easy” one who won’t be too “anal” about the entire process?

Like I say, I’m no fan of the pads and chains, but the Big Lick is the tip of a much larger iceburg.

Regarding HSUS, the enemy of my enemy is not necessarily my friend.

G.

#65

[QUOTE=CarrieK;6321025]

I am absolutely with you all on stopping abuse. But what happens when my disciple is considered abuse? So no, I won’t support or ally myself with HSUS in any manner. I’d rather be suspicious and paranoid, if you think, than support someone who won’t support me.[/QUOTE]

So you won’t draw the line anywhere? That philosophy will actually garner MORE support for the radical extremists, as it is also an extreme position.

I think TWHBEA has had ample opportunity to get this under control. I once supported the rights of the padded performers (without soring) but they don’t seem to be able to draw a line either. I’ll stand with HSUS on this one.

#66

"“Stewarding” is the practice of teaching the horse not to respond to the pain of palpation. It’s a rather brutal practice no matter how it’s done. Frankly I don’t even understand the “stewarding” shown in the video because if you’re going to do it you’ve still got to abide by the 3 sec. rule or you’re just beating the horse for no reason.

There is a truly evil body of “scientific knowledge” behind soring and stewarding horses. Learing of it is not for the faint of heart. DQPs are taught the 5Ws of soring and stewarding so that they can recognize them and their sequellae."

^^ OMG that’s so sick. I never would have guessed it to be that sinister :(.

#67

I’ve been a horse owner for over 40 years. I grew up knowing about these practices. I don’t care who or how they get stopped as long as they. are. stopped. once and for all.

I do not fear for those who do no harm. I’m tired of folks getting away with these cruelties because of others fear of affect. The slippery slope is nothing but a fallacy enabling asshats to continue to be.

#68

I want to beat that man over the head with a bat like he does to his horses…

#69

[QUOTE=WalkInTheWoods;6320884]
I will try to find out the other major sponsors of the Celebration besides Pepsi, so they can be contacted and asked to stop supporting.

I will try to get some addresses together today.

Lets not let our dislike of HSUS negate the suffering the Big Lick horses have endured for decades.[/QUOTE]

Ford also sponsors the Celebration.

#70

Why on earth was he smacking the horse in the head with a stick??? I can understand the theory with soreing the feet, as disgusting as it is, but what are they trying to achieve by smacking them in the head or hitting them with cattle prods???

partly for the “stewarding”, namely, if you flinch when they inspect your feet you’ll get beaten- but also probably to break them down mentally. Induce a psychological state of “learned helplessness”: nothing you can do will stop or affect the pain, so you “break” and stop trying, stop fighting, stop objecting in any way.

#71

I just couldn’t watch it, but I am glad some people could.

As for the “vote with your dollars” – if the BL division gets to be a shameful thing to support, then people won’t support it.

As long as the wealthy think it’s a good thing, or something to cheer on, it will continue. But with this kind of publicity, it may be that it becomes a very underground and low-class thing, like dog fighting. Once the momentum of support starts to dwindle, this twisted part of the industry will die out, I truly believe that.

I hope that people are just ignorant about what is going on, and once it comes to light, the public outcry will put a stop to the financial support of these trainers. Anything done in the dark and secret can’t be good – that’s why they have to hide it. They know full well it’s wrong.

I remember the walking horse thread on this board a few months ago, and some people with these types of horses genuinely don’t think anything cruel is going on. At least now, from the description of the graphic video, that ignorance can be dispelled.

What amazes me is that they know it’s wrong, because the inspectors are trying to stop it, so they come up with even more cruel things to get around the rules. What kind of people are these?!

#72

The 5 W’s? what does that mean?

#73

[QUOTE=wendy;6321214]
partly for the “stewarding”, namely, if you flinch when they inspect your feet you’ll get beaten- but also probably to break them down mentally. Induce a psychological state of “learned helplessness”: nothing you can do will stop or affect the pain, so you “break” and stop trying, stop fighting, stop objecting in any way.[/QUOTE]

Jeebus this is the sickest thing I think I have EVER heard of. I cannot watch the show. I just can’t. Someone tell me where I can send some money to help stop this and I’ll do it. Today.

#74

[QUOTE=Kwill;6321224]
I just couldn’t watch it, but I am glad some people could.

As for the “vote with your dollars” – if the BL division gets to be a shameful thing to support, then people won’t support it.

As long as the wealthy think it’s a good thing, or something to cheer on, it will continue. But with this kind of publicity, it may be that it becomes a very underground and low-class thing, like dog fighting. Once the momentum of support starts to dwindle, this twisted part of the industry will die out, I truly believe that.

I hope that people are just ignorant about what is going on, and once it comes to light, the public outcry will put a stop to the financial support of these trainers. Anything done in the dark and secret can’t be good – that’s why they have to hide it. They know full well it’s wrong.

I remember the walking horse thread on this board a few months ago, and some people with these types of horses genuinely don’t think anything cruel is going on. At least now, from the description of the graphic video, that ignorance can be dispelled.

What amazes me is that they know it’s wrong, because the inspectors are trying to stop it, so they come up with even more cruel things to get around the rules. What kind of people are these?![/QUOTE]

What kind of people? The same type of “anything for a buck” psychopaths (remember, that means “incapable of empathy”) who were electrocuting, suffocating, and leg-breaking show jumpers back in the 80’s for the insurance money; the same ones who over-drug expendable horses on the track and literally run them into the ground; the same ones who beat pit-bull puppies with chains to make them vicious for fights. Some are desperate; some are arrogant; some just plain get off on it.

What WE have to do is make sure they have no PLACE to show their “product.” I think the analogy to dogfighting is entirely apt.

#75

For those of us who missed it is there a link to watch the sawyer expose?

#76

Usually the soring chemicals left knobby ropy scars on the pastern, plus the hair would grow in kinda wavy. That is what the DQPs were supposed to be looking for. Bad thing is the foxes were guarding the henhouse. DQPs were hired by show management.

Once horses were getting disqualified for evidence of soring scars, the BLers came up with something new. They would apply salicytic acid that would burn layers of the skin off and remove the ropy scars. Lovely.

I live in Michigan, far from Big Lick central. Some of that goes on up here. I have talked to a blacksmith who has been asked to used soring techniques on horses. He refused.

#77

I want to get a list together of people to write to and thank and people to write to and ask them to help/or stop being part of the problem. I am juggling a bunch of plates in my personal life and will get to it as soon as i can. For now, just be gathering your thoughts.

#78

And the same ones who deliberately let a draft horse’s hooves grow huge flares and slap scotchbottom shoes on to produce the Big Hitch/Stomp.

#79

5 - here is the link of the Brian Ross Nightline report last night.

http://abcnews.go.com/Nightline/video/tennessee-ross-brian-horses-torture-abuse-16365454

#80

Kairi - thanks for letting me know that Ford Motor Company is a Celebration sponsor. They need to be contacted.

Pepsi needs to be thanked for pulling sponsorship.

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