Here is the link to the gateway to sign in to see the list of HPA violators maintained by FOSH- Friends of the sound Horse. You will have to provide an email address to sign in and see this list.
Here is link to the List of World Grand Champion horses, their owners and trainers.
[QUOTE=Dispatcher;6321619]
I have to know when it comes to soring. How long are the horses in that excructiating pain? From the time they are wrapped? Is it hours? days?[/QUOTE]
I don’t know specifics since I’ve never worked with sore horses but I did buy a sore horse off the family of a local wanna-be big lick trainer after he got sent to prison for domestic violence (anyone surprised?). He was pressure shod when I brought him home and had been chemically sored too at some point, had the scarring on the front pasterns. Shoes were taken off about 2 hours after I unloaded him at the barn, vet was out to see him first thing the next morning. It took about a month to get his feet sorted out and pain-free. His front soles were pretty sore and he wound up blowing a couple abscesses in that time. He’d also get stiff in the back, likely from bearing much of his weight on his hind end.
Physically he was a-OK after about a month but the mental trauma was a whole other can of worms. That still rears its ugly head from time to time even 15 years later, usually with loud-voiced men he isn’t familiar with.
[QUOTE=Dispatcher;6321652]
Tenderness on the pasterns is one thing. Excruciating pain, enough to make the horse go down, is completely different.[/QUOTE]
“Tenderness” in the pasterns is not a NORMAL condition for any horse. Tenderness indicates inflamation. Soring is soring- it is like being pregnent- a horse is sored or it is not.
IMO there is no shuch thing as being “just a little sored.”
To stop it, all of the money has to dry up. That’s why it’s so hard. First of all, fines and penalties for soring have to be increased. I’d like to see a stiff jail term, plus confiscation of farm, horses, farm machinery, tack, trailers, homes, cars, and bank accounts of persons responsible. That’s not likely to happen, but you get the idea.
Then as someone else mentioned earlier, don’t buy from or sell to, someone soring. No stud fees, no horse sales, no boarding income, no training income. Put the bad trainers out of a job. Forever.
Then hit the miscellaneous stuff. Does the breed association have a magazine? Who advertises in it? Can they be persuaded to pull their advertising dollars? What venues host TWH shows? Can sponsors stop supporting them? TWH shows usually charge admission fees. Don’t go. Empty stands say a lot. Do civic organizations run the concession stands at smaller shows? It would be nice if they refused. During the weeks of the Celebration, I believe schools are closed so the kids can help at the event. Let’s keep the kids in school and away from this bad influence.
Basically, you have to shut down the entire economy of the sore horse industry, or divert the money to the un-sore part of the industry. It’s gonna be real hard.
Go here to find an interactive map to click on to get contact info for your state’s congressmen
http://www.contactingthecongress.org/
Im going to email them something along these lines
In view of the upcoming elections I would like get your opinion of this:
http://abcnews.go.com/Nightline/vide...abuse-16365454
Is this not in violation of the HPA of 1970 ? I would like to hear your views on this matter.
I could smack my local affiliate. They interviewed a local big lick trainer and he of course said the usual spin. Turns out he has HPA violations.
[QUOTE=WalkInTheWoods;6321379]
i went here:
http://www.ford.com/help/contact/
then clicked on sales and advertising down on the right
an email window popped up and i chose Advertising from the dropdown
This is what i wrote:
After viewing Brian Ross’s Nightline report on Tennessee Walking Horse Abuse I would like to ask you to consider ending your affiliation with the Celebration horse show in Shelbyville, Tennessee. The secretive protected abuse that has been going on for decades is now seeing the light of day. I hope you follow Pepsi’s example and pull any support of the Celebration.[/QUOTE]
Thanks for providing this contact information. I sent a similar message.
[QUOTE=WalkInTheWoods;6321597]
did i already give out contact info to thank ABC ? my mind is getting scrambled
http://abcnews.go.com/Site/page?id=3271346&cat=Nightline[/QUOTE]
Thanks for the link. I posted the following message:
Thanks so much for your recent report of the inhumane treatment of Tennessee Walking horses in the TWHBEA show world. Unfortunately, your report was not comprehensive enough to eliminate the torture of these truly majestic animals. A follow up to your report would be greatly appreciated by all humane horse owners.
Thanks so much!!
[QUOTE=MistyStormy;6321773]
I could smack my local affiliate. They interviewed a local big lick trainer and he of course said the usual spin. Turns out he has HPA violations.
Thanks to bayou-bengal showing us the link to the HPA violation site. Nathan had 4 scar rule violations from 2002 to 2007. Why dont you contact the affiliate with this information.
[QUOTE=WalkInTheWoods;6321813]
Thanks to bayou-bengal showing us the link to the HPA violation site. Nathan had 4 scar rule violations from 2002 to 2007. Why dont you contact the affiliate with this information.[/QUOTE] I did 
I read a quip somewhere that goes something like:
“When bad horses die, they aren’t punished in hell. They’re resurrected as Tennessee Walkers.”
I probably don’t have it exactly right, but it’s something along those lines.
TWH
this subject is heart wrenching: Now wItw has stepped up,can we all hope to continue this until the gates open at the Celebration.can we keep it in the news,keep asking the question WHY let this happen at the Biggest Gaited Show in the USA.
I say either STOP ALL SORING or CLOSE the GATES in SHELBYVILLE TN
oh i do have a question,in order to show in TN.all equine need a current neg: coggins right are all the VETS that pull these state required test BLIND? surly they know that these horses are being hurt.aren’t they required by LAW to report abuse.
Money talks. . Would you believe there are vets and vet’s family members in TN who own interest in BL walkers and in BL walking horse breeding farms? Sure you would - if hope. Because it’s true.
I knew a woman whose father was a vet. She showed one or two BL “prospects” each year, keeping them at a BNT barn in TN and “flipping” them for a profit as soon as they had a couple of wins. She always had one or two prospects available each year. She either bred them or bought them at one of the prestigious yearling sales like the one at Harlansdale Farm (home of Midnight Sun and a slew of his WGC offspring). She never kept her show horses for more than a couple of years before selling for a profit.
She had two or three well-bred mares that she would send to the “WGC do jour” to be bred. These mares were the only horses she kept year after year. All the others were “prospects” in training with various BNT who woud market them for her. The trainers got a percentage for acting as her agents. Do you think that she- a vet’s daughter- didn’t know what was being done to make her “prospects” win Do you think her father didn’t know. Do you think that the faculty members at Middle Tennessee University in their vet school and animal science department didn’t know?
Do you really think the members of the TWHBEA and their employees didn’t know? And don’t forget the folks at the Celebration and all of the small service organizations like the Kwanis and the Lions Clubs that used these shows to raise money for their charity events, do you think none of them knew?
To go farther-- Do you think the owners of the tack shops that stock some of the chemicals as well as the leg hose, and green grease, action devices and other stuff didn’t know? What about the people who own the various publications that sold ads to promote the horses and the shows and showed BL walkers themselves- do you think they didn’t know?
And don’t forget the saddle suit tailors and the truck dealers and the trailer dealers in Middle Tennessee that buy advertisments and box seats and have sales booths at the Celebration – and the artists, too as well as the cap and T-shirt sellers. Do you really think that NONE of them knew what was REALLY going on?
Think of Shelbyville and most of Middle Tennessee as Stepford for walking horses. You do remember the movies and book about the Stepford Wives?
I used to think that being the target horse in a horse tripping event was the worst thing fate that could befall a horse.
Now that I know about it I think what they do to the achieve the Big Lick gait has eclipsed that.
geez - another place to write - AAEP - ive got a couple of questions for them concerning the health certificates for TWHs that end up being disqualified for scarring violations.
Does somebody want to find out how farriers in general feel about the big stacked shoe jobs ?
It takes a whole team to do the wrong thing or turn their heads and keep their mouths shut.
Trainers, owners, riders, some breeders, vets, farriers, DQPs, judges, etc all have a hand in it. Lets see where do we start.
If the judges would not place these horses, the trickle down effect would effect all of the other people. I guess we need to go higher. Who certifies and who hires the judges ?
[QUOTE=Dispatcher;6321619]
I have to know when it comes to soring. How long are the horses in that excructiating pain? From the time they are wrapped? Is it hours? days?[/QUOTE]
I’m not going to write a “how to” manual, but suffice it to say that soring chemicals are generally used 3-5 days before a show. This allows them to “cook” for a time and achieve maximum effectiveness.
To help reduce the chances of a “ticket” topical anasthetics are often used that will get them through the “in gate” inspection. The soring chemicals will be then be most “active” during the class.
The “out gate” inspection (mandatory for the first two placings) tend to be much quicker and less thorough (remember who hired the DQP).
During the off-season the pads are left on but there’s generally no soring done as chemicals cost money.
In the Light and Flat shod world similary practices are followed.
A few years back I was looking at morbidity and mortality rates for horse insurance. The TWH was rated in the same risk category as a three day event horse. The three day eventer clearly faces some real athletic challenges. The Walker going 'round and 'round in circles…not so much. I asked the agent why this was and they informed me that the risk of “chemical colic” in Walkers was real and substantial. Thus the very high rating. Note that this information is a few years old and things may have changed.
None of what ABC presented is really a “secret” in the Walker world.
G.
[QUOTE=WalkInTheWoods;6322015]
geez - another place to write - AAEP - ive got a couple of questions for them concerning the health certificates for TWHs that end up being disqualified for scarring violations.
If the judges would not place these horses, the trickle down effect would effect all of the other people. I guess we need to go higher. Who certifies and who hires the judges ?[/QUOTE]
You do realize, don’t you, that most of the judges are also professional trainers who belong to the Walking Horse Trainers Association, don’t you?
That is how it works- one hand washes the other. Trainer A may be judging Trainer B’s horse at a show this weekend and NEXT weekend Tranier B will be the Judge and Trainer A will be showing in front of him.
Do you really expect these trainers/ judges to police themselves? Some of the guys who work as farriers are also qualified to sit as DQPs. Or at least, it was that way when we had walkers. I believe the McConnells have been officers of that WHTA several times in several positions of leadership. I believe they both hold SHOW judge’s cards as well.
twh
So lets ask the Dept Head of that Vet School if they teach vet Students how to sore a TWH knowing that its a violation of HPA,or do they teach them how too look the other way.
i’ll do it. and let ya know what they report.
[QUOTE=WalkInTheWoods;6321379]
i went here:
http://www.ford.com/help/contact/
then clicked on sales and advertising down on the right
an email window popped up and i chose Advertising from the dropdown
This is what i wrote:
After viewing Brian Ross’s Nightline report on Tennessee Walking Horse Abuse I would like to ask you to consider ending your affiliation with the Celebration horse show in Shelbyville, Tennessee. The secretive protected abuse that has been going on for decades is now seeing the light of day. I hope you follow Pepsi’s example and pull any support of the Celebration.[/QUOTE]
Thanks for providing the link. I took wrote something similar and submitted it to Ford as well. I hope all here will do the same.
[QUOTE=Guilherme;6322029]
I’m not going to write a “how to” manual, but suffice it to say that soring chemicals are generally used 3-5 days before a show. This allows them to “cook” for a time and achieve maximum effectiveness.
To help reduce the chances of a “ticket” topical anasthetics are often used that will get them through the “in gate” inspection. The soring chemicals will be then be most “active” during the class.
The “out gate” inspection (mandatory for the first two placings) tend to be much quicker and less thorough (remember who hired the DQP).
During the off-season the pads are left on but there’s generally no soring done as chemicals cost money.
In the Light and Flat shod world similary practices are followed.
A few years back I was looking at morbidity and mortality rates for horse insurance. The TWH was rated in the same risk category as a three day event horse. The three day eventer clearly faces some real athletic challenges. The Walker going 'round and 'round in circles…not so much. I asked the agent why this was and they informed me that the risk of “chemical colic” in Walkers was real and substantial. Thus the very high rating. Note that this information is a few years old and things may have changed.
None of what ABC presented is really a “secret” in the Walker world.
G.[/QUOTE]
Considering that MOST of the high roller TWH owner/ exhibitors show almost every weekend, but usually at least two weekends a month, during show season, their horses are rerely pain free from about late Feb. when the trainers start getting them ready for the spring shows through November when the Walking Horse Trainers Fall Show usually signals the end of the season for most of them.
So most of hte heavily campaigned TWHs get December and January and maybe some of Feb. “off” from the brutal routine that starts up each year with the spring shows and continues through the fall.
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