I don’t know that rider in particular so I can’t speak to what his reasons were
Most riders spend the majority of their time on the buckle or on a really loose rein so even if you have a martingale on, it’s not always coming in to play
I showed the above pics to several endurance rider friends, who also know many of those who just did Tevis, including the latest winner/who the post started about (and his wife)
The gray is probably a stallion who is a handful at the best of times, and when you’re doing Cougar Rock, there is no room for error, because this is what can happen, this is the wife of the winner (and it’s a public image on her FB page, not grabbing a private photo )
Don’t know the ladies in the 2nd pic.
BUT, what they also said, is that while a lot of the RMs are used fairly short, it’s also true, as tabula said above, that most horses, most of the time, are going around on a loose rein. And when the rider has a need for the RM, it’s often an “oh crap” need and it needs to have an immediate impact. Watch most pictures of most endurance rides, Tevis or otherwise, and you’ll see MOST of the time, the reins are loose. Those horses aren’t on contact most of the time, especially not 75-100m rides. So they do have relief most of the time.
It is very possible that the pair of horses in the last pic, especially the once closest to the camera, were much more relaxed right until they spotted the photographer and their heads went up
I guess I would think that attempting to limit the motion of the horse’s head on something like Cougar Rock would be a bad idea. They need to be able to balance, and if the poo hit the fan that horse was screwed.
The position of a horse’s head has nothing to do with whether the martingale is short or not. Correct adjustment puts it into effect when the horse is flipping his head around and you want the pressure of the bit to land on the bars. That grey horse won’t find relief from the pressure or a straight line from hand to bit until his mouth and head are outrageously low, which is quite unfair. And good luck to anyone trying to direct rein steer with a martingale that short!
No way can I judge a moment in time, on what’s possibly a difficult horse, on what’s truly a VERY difficult section (it’s optional for a reason!) of a VERY difficult ride, but my guess is, they don’t get to that level by constantly being in their horse’s face, and those horses aren’t noobs to the whole discipline.
I find it interesting that different disciplines seem to want to focus on the negative of other disciplines. I like to take the best of other disciplines and apply them to my own training or conditioning program. In every discipline there will be a side that is crappy horsemanship, abusive, cheating, etc. There will also be amazing horsemen and women who we all would do well to learn from. Surround yourself and try to
learn from the best, those with absolute integrity, apply lessons from all disciplines and keep the horse always happy and healthy in its job and in my mind you are ahead of the game. The winner of the Tevis Cup this year I feel is a good horseman and has a wonderful long term relationship with his mare–they have had numerous successes at many events over the years and she is in her teens. Her willingness to complete a 100 miles with him in only a neck rope illustrates this relationship. We all can learn much from the best in other disciplines.
If I saw martingales that short in a jumper ring, I’d say the same thing. It’s not fair to ask a horse to be athletic while you’re pulling their face to their knees - difficult or not.
That’s just my opinion. When American endurance is touted as a sort of pinnacle of horsemanship, I was surprised to see the same things you see in the WP show world, in such an iconic shot of the “race”.
Ouch!!
Are you looking at different photos than the photos you posted or are you exaggerating for some reason?
In order for the grey to get relief from that martingale, he would need a nearly WP headset, ie, his mouth would between point of shoulder and knees. Draw the line on the picture if you don’t believe me.
Why someone would put that martingale on a horse whose natural headset is that of a friesian is beyond me. Want a low head? Buy one.
I think it can be put down to drama and not understanding that it’s the length of rein that allows release no matter where the “crunch” point of the running martingale is and not how short/“tight” it is. There is nothing about the set of that martingale that would prevent the horse from reaching up, out, forwards, sideways, down to the ground, etc. The length of rein (and we don’t know the actual physical length of those particular reins) is the only potential limiting factor in how much a horse can reach while wearing a running martingale.
Additionally, imo, if the horse had its neck much lower, it would be pulling itself up the mountain with its front legs instead of using its entire body to get the job done safely and efficiently. I mean I know damn well where my horse’s head is when I go up a steep hill and it ain’t level with her withers.
The why is the martingale telling the horse to put his head there, rider with tight reins?
The lateral steering is also an issue with martingales that short.
But hey, different strokes for different folks. Maybe a leather band over a horse’s nose isn’t a problem after all!
@endlessclimb I sincerely encourage you to go to an endurance ride- volunteer or even try to get a catch ride and experience it for yourself. You seem to have some weird vendetta against it and yet have no actual experience with the sport.
I actually agree that for my likes, his martingale is too short but since I’m not the one climbing Cougar Rock on a super fit and fairly fresh stallion (that point is only about 25 miles into the ride), my opinion ain’t worth spit on the matter
But the vast majority of the miles are not on contact. When they need the RM, they need it right now because they need the horse to react right now. They aren’t using these to keep the horse’s head out of their face because they’re ignoring the bit, where it’s the horse who’s bringing the RM into play. They need it to not fall off the edge of a cliff (exaggerating, kinda sorta)
WP is entirely different, they have so much training that truly forces heads to stay low, not at all comparable.
None of us here know the story of that picture. All I even know is from friends who think that horse is a stallion who is a bit of a handful, and you do not want surprises l going up Cougar Rock. Not a single person here knows what the previous or next frame in that sequence looked like. That’s like trying to bash a Dressage rider for having the horse’s chin to his chest when the whole sequence was a horse who was in the process of bolting.
If you’re steering laterally going up CR, you’re doing it wrong. Maybe you’re not really familiar enough with how endurance rides go. Very little real steering required, and I guarantee horses at that level don’t need much in the way of reins to do it well enough
For those of you harping on the grey stallion, that is one moment in time. The pictures leading up to that moment tell a more complete story, including the fact that Boomer (the stallion) basically tried to launch himself up Cougar Rock instead of taking the normal step pattern.
Rider apparently had an “oh sh*t” moment but got himself and his horse back together by the top
This is the horse’s first time at Tevis, he’s an ex-racer (arab, not thoroughbred) and rider is John Steven… who said his arms were like rubber from trying to hold Boomer back on the first 50. Sometimes a young, hot horse is going to require more active riding for both his and his rider’s safety.
You can also see them coming in here - https://www.facebook.com/watch/live/?ref=watch_permalink&v=1045890536819398 at roughly the 45 minute mark. Nice, loose reins and free neck when they aren’t about to die due to poor decisions on the horse’s part.
Word for word my reaction!
THANK YOU. There’s always more to the story. It’s clear from John’s hands that they are up there on purpose as a way to purposefully engage the RM.
I’m curious - do you know where the original pic of them falls in relation to the 2 you posted?
Here is a good video of riders going up Cougar Rock
(it’s from 2007 and I think I’ve watched it 100 times at least lol)
The second one I posted is supposedly right when they crested the top, so it’s the last in the series. I don’t know the hill intimately, so I can’t tell from the landscape. Endlessclimb’s photo and my other one, I don’t know the order for those.
His crew have been posting pictures and videos and it’s clear instead of “climbing” the hill, Boomer tried bouncing up it, which must have been terrifying.