I am really glad that ALL of you are so passionate, persistent, and consciencious about your horses and programs. I love the diversity and the difference in opinions! 
I really do think choice is a lot of it. I used to pamper my horses and bring them in a lotā¦if it was too hot or too coldā¦and then I visited a Wyoming ranch where the horses winter out without so much as a windbreak eating hay and what grass they can find. Yes, some are too thin and the horses were not all in perfect conditionā¦but the message I took from that was that horses are a hell of a lot tougher than I gave them credit to be. The horses there live a long healthy life if they are fed well as old horses and my stallionās sire lived to be 31ā¦he was never in a barn one day of his life.
So, I started to change how I did things as I got more horses of my own and stopped pampering them so much. I have very few problems and they are sound and healthy. I do have a couple who have gotten too fat on oat hay and am having to adjust for that nowā¦but normally I would not feed that much of that kind of hayā¦thank you droughtā¦will be getting in some better grass hay soon.
I feed in pans on the groundā¦one per horseā¦and inevitably they shift from pan to pan or share with their friends. No one is chased off and not allowed to eat. I also only grain once a day for a number of my horses and hay/grass makes up the majority of their diet. Mares and foals do get grained twice a dayā¦small amounts and mostly for a check to make sure all is well with everyone and to give me a chance to play with the foals.
I now have client mares/foals living out the same way as my own now and those babies are so much happier and healthier now. The client foals that were in daily all had diarhea at some point where my foals never got it. Once we turned them out, the diarhea cleared up. Their owner remarks constantly when she comes to visit how much happier they seem. Even their foot quality has improved with the additional exercise and I know it has to be so much better for their joints and development as well.
I am also stunned when I see what some folks will spend to get a mare in foal. Unbelievableā¦no thanksā¦not for me. Iād never get it back out of the foal so a mare that does not settle easily would not work for me at all.
I admit I havenāt read all the replies, but here is the flip side:
Why does a BUYER purchase said 10,000 foal? Do you know anyone who would say they purchased a horse for 10k b/c the breeder fed it alfalfa, kept it in a box stall with shavings, etc. OR would they say, the foal had the pedigree, conformation, and talent I was looking for? I donāt disagree with a 10k price tag per say, IF the horse is worth it. Period. If somebody is spending 8k to breed a horse that is only worth 4k and then trying to market it as 10k to recoup the costs to feed it, and thinks that this makes sense??? Really??
Maybe it costs that much or more to breed that foal, but for the buyers out there, that foal sure as heck better be worth it in lineage, conformation, etc. to make the purchase appeal to them.
And if people are asking 10k JUST based on ābreeding costsā they really need to rethink their job. JMHO.
Now, Iām not saying anyone here falls into that catagory, but by arguing that YOU buyer MUST pay ME seller 10k for this foal b/c it cost ME 10k to breed it, you just lose some credibility as a seller. Just what are you marketing? A quality foal, or basic food and shelter you gave it?
[QUOTE=okggo;2607152]
I admit I havenāt read all the replies, but here is the flip side:
Why does a BUYER purchase said 10,000 foal? Do you know anyone who would say they purchased a horse for 10k b/c the breeder fed it alfalfa, kept it in a box stall with shavings, etc. OR would they say, the foal had the pedigree, conformation, and talent I was looking for? I donāt disagree with a 10k price tag per say, IF the horse is worth it. Period. If somebody is spending 8k to breed a horse that is only worth 4k and then trying to market it as 10k to recoup the costs to feed it, and thinks that this makes sense??? Really??
Maybe it costs that much or more to breed that foal, but for the buyers out there, that foal sure as heck better be worth it in lineage, conformation, etc. to make the purchase appeal to them.
And if people are asking 10k JUST based on ābreeding costsā they really need to rethink their job. JMHO.
Now, Iām not saying anyone here falls into that catagory, but by arguing that YOU buyer MUST pay ME seller 10k for this foal b/c it cost ME 10k to breed it, you just lose some credibility as a seller. Just what are you marketing? A quality foal, or basic food and shelter you gave it?[/QUOTE]
I donāt think too many of us here do that as in a previous post it was asked āhow many of you make money breeding horsesā and most of us voted we did not. FWIW my 5 figure foal that I bought had been mostly field boarded for the previous year.
And if people are asking 10k JUST based on ābreeding costsā they really need to rethink their job. JMHO.
Now, Iām not saying anyone here falls into that catagory, but by arguing that YOU buyer MUST pay ME seller 10k for this foal b/c it cost ME 10k to breed it, you just lose some credibility as a seller. Just what are you marketing? A quality foal, or basic food and shelter you gave it?
I was addressing the thread that was started earlier in the week where breeders were trying to explain why foals cost so much. Dont dwell on the 10K about, its just a number thrown out there for explination purpose. Go read the other thread and you will understand.
Foals cost exactly what someone is willing to pay for them regardless of what breed they are or how much it cost someone to put it on the ground. If a breeder knows going in that they canāt sell for their expenses why would they complain if a buyer wonāt pay what they want? Theres really no mystery in any of this.
Country, in the bloodlines some of us look for, quality and bloodlines are very important. As I stated in a another thread, two yrs ago I was looking for a young filly with top of the line blood on the sire and dam side and most were already sold or in the 12-15K price range. I only had 10K to spend that year. Quality does sell, isnt that what your signautre line even says?
STF I agree with you 100% I spent 4 years looking for exactly what I wanted when I bought one of my stallions. But I donāt see what your point is?
this is the difference in a hobbist and a business...I have not deducted expense one my horses in about 10 years...maybe 8....there is no need to...hay farming is my business and horses are my hobby....:winkgrin:
as to folks keeping mares out...my vets dad is big into cattle horses....2 years back he dropped $75K on a embryo transplant mare....when asked where she was he said...."in that field with the rest of them...if she can't live like a horse, she needs to live somewheres else" she's just peachy making him money today...
Tamara in TNTo me it works like this: if the foal does not sell as a baby it MAY not be a pricing issue. There really is a limited market for folks that have the farm/desire to raise and train a baby. If you can sell a baby great, though. If the horses are still collecting once they get to riding age (3 and up) and you have a lot bigger market of potential buyers (the boarding stable contingent) you probably have a marketing/pricing issue if no one is at least making inquiries.
My point is good quality sells for what its worth and 10K is really a low price for really good quality in the top line sporthorses breeders world.
Thats always been the way we raise horses here the one I paid $25,000 for is treated, housed, and fed exactly like the one I paid $100 for. I donāt regard one animal as more important or better then another when it comes to their health and well being.
EXACTLY!!! My feelings too!
Everything I breed now, I have a āBā plan to keep till they are 3 and start. I make sure I have the room and time, etc. If the āAā plan happens and they sell before then, then super, if not - Im ok with it too. The day I cant start babies and such, Im done with it thou.
Where did that come from???
We were talking about cost/market of foals, not overall care?
STF Iāve never in any way said your foals or any foal should not sell for $10K. Iām saying what a horse is worth to one may not be to another and theres no reason it should be. And if you sell for $10K and lose money or $2000 and make money which is better? If Iām doing it as a business I want to sell a truck load of those $2000 foals and not even one of those $10K foals. If its a hobby I really donāt care but I sure wouldnāt get upset over it.
STF I was referring to Tamaras post about care
Im not upset! LOL I dont get upset over internet discussions! 
Turst me, I laugh alot.
Opps, my bad!
[QUOTE=okggo;2607152]
Why does a BUYER purchase said 10,000 foal? Do you know anyone who would say they purchased a horse for 10k b/c the breeder fed it alfalfa, kept it in a box stall with shavings, etc. OR would they say, the foal had the pedigree, conformation, and talent I was looking for? [/QUOTE]
I totally agree. My foals are priced over $10K, but they have all been First Premium and often āTop Tenā in North America. The mares are predicated and proven producers. The older offspring have gone on to compete successfully in sport. And yes, my prices are met. Having been to Europe and seen whatās on the ground there, I have no doubt my guys would sell for considerably more if they were there.
Oh, and I paid more than 10k for my 12 year-old foundation mare as a 2 year-old who was (shudder) out of an āApprovedā thoroughbred dam (when they were still being inspected by the NA/WPN). She is an import - from the US. Buying that mare was one of the smartest moves I ever made. Sheās now keur preferent with seven outstanding offspring to date.
I do to especially when I read what people think they have to spend on raising horses.
