Tie down for an insecure horse?

[SuzieQNutter]

@RockyMountainMare

I ended up with this horse in part because I was a bit of a bleeding heart and her last owner had pulled her from a bad situation, but couldn’t give her the right environment (backyard stall, no arena to work in, and a disability on top of it all that made her decide to let her go). I have been riding myself since I was young, and always considered myself intermediate. That being said though, I was always taking lessons, I didn’t own my own horse until recently (first horse was a rescue with kidney disease so I really didnt ride her so much as just give her proper end of life) and so I am very inexperienced when it comes to tack, general care, and training. If a horse has known vices, I’m comfortable dealing with them (old horse I use to ride would randomly bolt in the arena when he felt the urge, for no reason, and I’d just ride it out). But unknowns and a horse who comes with trauma and training gaps is new for me and definitely has lowered my confidence. My mare needs and experienced rider for sure, which I am not. I suppose I say all this because when I bought her, I tested her out first in a community arena and she did really well with me on her. I gave her opportunities to buck, dump me, try and unseat me, anything, and she didn’t. She spooked once or twice but it was superficial planting, and she tends not to spook as hard anyway when she’s “working” vs on the ground. I thought I could handle her issues as long as she was okay in the saddle. I saw how hard she was trying to please. The more I rode her and got to know her, the more I noticed her gaps and behavior. I think she was also unnerved by a boarding facility—much noisier and full of strangers.

I got a gaited specializes trainer who helped me learn a lot more about her needs and how to ride her but had to stop after she had colic surgery and was laid up for 4 months. Then of course covid hit and I couldn’t see my trainer at all. It’s made things harder for sure. We’ve been mostly focused on her groundwork training but it’s certainly depending on the day how she handles it. I absolutely attune my fall to being on me, we were gaiting up a little hill, she tripped real hard and I tensed when I should have moved with her and I tumbled off. Bruised ego, but now I gotta focus on having a better seat.

My friend is a damn good rider, but definitely is more risk taking and daring than I am and I think her riding background has her rely a lot on spurs, harsh bits, etc to get horses to do what she wants, and while I’m not saying that’s a bad idea in some cases, I think if I tried to spur my horse she’d leap out of her skin. The heavy hand hasn’t seemed to work with her in the past and only makes her anxiety worse. I want a bit for my horse that helps her confidence, but I don’t know a lot about them and so far I’ve gotten so many different recommendations I’m at a loss. I want to pick what’s best for her and I’ll just conform to learn it. I think what I’ve got to do is just get back in touch with my old trainer, and figure out what my mare needs together.

I think if I sold her off, she’d have to go through the process of adjusting to a new person all over again and I don’t know if she could deal with that. It took me months to get her to even like me, and a traumatic surgery before she even trusted me. I’ve promised to care for her and I’m committed to it.

Phew at least you have some experience and are not a beginner. Having a horse that you know you can handle when spooked is a big plus and good for your confidence.

Your learning curve has started and hopefully unlike your friend you will become a damm good rider who does not need spurs, harsh bits and a heavy hand to get a horse to do what you want.

I am on the other side of the world and we do not have gaited horses over here so I am no help to you there.

But even over here I have heard of the cruelty in the past used to get them to lift legs higher and what they did to their tails. Hopefully all that is in the past, but it will probably take more than one generation to get rid of traditions.

So choose your trainers wisely and refuse to put chains on her legs and onions,garlic, astrigents where they shouldn’t go, and other things that probably haven’t reached the other side of the World.

She sounds like she is lucky to have found you.

[Scribbler]

I would get rid of Ms Spur n Crank. You can get away with this on some QH (in western) and some WB (in dressage). But most horses it’s a disaster and especially sensitive ones.

Being a “rescue” is good to know but the label can quickly become a crutch. Not all horses that show anxious behaviour have been “abused.” It is just as likely that they didn’t get enough of any kind of handling when they were young. Horses are not born tame. Some are more curious and confident naturally, but those can also be more pushy and even aggressive until they learn some manners. Some are shyer and flightier and need to learn to trust humans.

Also in my experience even bold horses are much less confident when they are not feeling well, for instance lame with a hoof abscess.
”‹”‹”‹”‹”‹
Anyhow it’s fine to know that she came from a rough background but she still needs to learn how to be a good citizen on the ground and under saddle.
”‹”‹”‹”‹”‹”‹

[Rosewatt]

I can not agree with Scribbler and SuzieQnutter more! Their advice is golden! Run FAST away from your friend. I can tell you that she is not doing your horse any favors and no doubt you will end up with a horse with worse problems then you are currently dealing with. Personally, I think you should stop the riding for now and work with what you feel comfortable with be it groundwork or nothing at all, until you CAN have a good trainer down to help work with you.

I think by now you have realized that this horse is too much for you to deal with by yourself. Really, the only scenario I could see working is you working with a reputable trainer regularly with this horse, meaning the trainer themselves will handle the horse and also teach you how to work with this horse. That may be your old trainer, but I’d also recommend adding a good groundwork/ horsemanship trainer in as well, as not all trainers specialize in both areas.

As you are in the learning stages, I highly recommend you read and gather as much information as possible on training/ riding/ gadgets etc. There are several good articles on the internet and youtube videos out there. You won’t be able to put everything into practice, but having that information available before the trainer comes down will aid in your learning. There are several different methods out there (good and bad), so keep in mind that some may even contradict others, but a larger spectrum of knowledge available will help you start to differentiate between them. It’s good to ask questions in the process and try to clarify things you don’t understand along the way. For example, read up on the action of different kinds of bits, what they are used for - the action of martingales and what they are used for. Read up on both the bad effects of those tools and the possible benefits of using each tool.

[TheHunterKid90]

I didn’t read every post but wanted to throw in my two cents that I would not use an elevator…ever. An elevator is a gag bit, it draws the lips up wards while applying pressure to the poll. Couple all of this with the fact that most riders don’t use elevator or gag bits with a chin strap, you also have over rotation of the mouthpiece. It is confusing for the horse and painful. This isn’t picking on a rider, this is the physics of a gag bit. Any horse that rides well in a gag is doing so out of intimidation.
Add in a tie down or martingale and you’re just putting together a bunch of gadgets in an attempt to hide issues.
I would be searching for a second opinion on this horse since trainer thinks the gadget and gag bit Avenue is correct.
You mentioned a single joint Snaffle was not quite “enough” bit. You might try a very low solid port short shank bit. Some horses feel more secure with a solid mouthpiece and you will have a bit of leverage if needed. Of course, rig this bit with a properly fitting leather chin strap.

[Abbie.S]

Oh boy. Some good advice, OP, but I want to caution you on one thing:

If the horse is known to be highly spooky, anxious or a bolter, there is not a damn thing that you can put in their mouth that will be effective in fixing those issues.

Someone mentioned a snaffle because it can be used to facilitate a one rein stop, but even then a horse intent on bolting is extraordinarily hard to one rein stop (and it can even be dangerous to do so as you can throw the horse off balance and cause a fall) and depending on where a bolt/spook happens you may not have the room to safely stop the horse.

This is why any horse showing a propensity for any of these things should not be ridden outside a round corral or fenced arena until you are sure you have the appropriate tools to manage the situation.

Experience has taught me that horses that get nervous on a loose rein are ones that have been taught to use the bit for balance. They usually lean on the rider’s hands to some degree, which often leads the rider to believe exactly what you stated, that the horse desires some level of “contact”. Contact has nada to do with how much pressure you hold in your hands and everything to do with how the horse understands and relates to the bit they are carrying. When you drop the reins on a horse that relies on them for balance, you’ve pulled the rug out from underneath them and tossed them in the deep end as far as their balance is concerned. That can be QUITE nerve-wracking for a horse. They have to be taught how to maintain responsibility for their own balance at all times with appropriate correction from the rider as needed. You said this horse is gaited, which makes me think it’s all the more likely she’s used to leaning on her rider for balance.

So it sounds like you’re over-horsed and in need of an actual horseman or woman that knows what they’re doing and can advise beyond stronger bits and contraptions to mask the problem.

[Scribbler]

@Abbie.S

Oh boy. Some good advice, OP, but I want to caution you on one thing:

If the horse is known to be highly spooky, anxious or a bolter, there is not a damn thing that you can put in their mouth that will be effective in fixing those issues.

Someone mentioned a snaffle because it can be used to facilitate a one rein stop, but even then a horse intent on bolting is extraordinarily hard to one rein stop (and it can even be dangerous to do so as you can throw the horse off balance and cause a fall) and depending on where a bolt/spook happens you may not have the room to safely stop the horse.

This is why any horse showing a propensity for any of these things should be ridden outside a round corral or fenced arena until you are sure you have the appropriate tools to manage the situation.

Experience has taught me that horses that get nervous one a loose rein are ones that have been taught to use the bit for balance. They usually lean on the rider’s hands to some degree, which often leads the rider to believe exactly what you stated, that the horse desires some level of “contact”. Contact has nada to do with how much pressure you hold in your hands and everything to do with how the horse understands and relates to the bit they are carrying. When you drop the reins on a horse that relies on them for balance, you’ve pulled the rug out from underneath them and tossed them in the deep end as far as their balance is concerned. That can be QUITE nerve-wracking for a horse. They have to be taught ow to maintain responsibility for their own balance at all times with appropriate correction from the rider as needed. You said this horse is gaited, which makes me think it’s all the more likely she’s used to leaning on her rider for balance.

So it sounds like you’re over-horsed and in need of an actual horseman or woman that knows what they’re doing and can advise beyond stronger bits and contraptions to mask the problem.

Yes, very well put.

I am currently messing around with a mare that was sold some years ago as “bolts and throws rider, suitable only as broodmare.” She’s had nothing much done for 5 years ( pasture and foal). I’ve been working on the ground with her for 3 months now. It’s my Covid 19 project no need to rush.

I’ve been working through all her training holes systematically, including her go-to reaction of running backwards and sitting down and popping up in front if you try to pick up her hooves, put on a bridle, or swing a longe whip. She’s actually been making a lot of progress.

But before any of us sit in her, I want the following:

Voice command whoa in hand, on longe, and at liberty from walk trot canter (mostly there)

Canter transitions without scramble and bolt ( that’s ok now)

Full attention on me even in distracting or unfamiliar environments

Comfortable alone separated from herd in barn indoor arena or walking down the road in hand

Good with feet

No running backwards at minor things
Accepting of bridle (fruit wraps on bit help)

Understanding our dressage system of flexions and accepting the bit in hand

Lateral work in hand ( she’s naturally good at this)

When all this is in place we will start riding her in an arena . Short rides like you would with a baby

From what Ive seen I don’t think she is inherently s bolter ( her breeder was apparently an idiot,). But we sure aren’t going out on trails until we are totally ok w t c in the arena.

[SuzieQNutter]

So far this horse has not bolted and the one time the rider cane off due to a trip, the horse came back to her and did not run home.

[Scribbler]

@SuzieQNutter

So far this horse has not bolted and the one time the rider cane off due to a trip, the horse came back to her and did not run home.

This is true. However I thought horse came with a warning about bolting? Or is that just all coming from Ms Crankenspur the ammie friend “trainer” with the gag bit?

OP does say in first post she wouldn’t have enough control if horse wanted to bolt. I assumed this was a real possibility but it could have just been beginner rider anxiety. Most horses don’t bolt in the real scary sense.

Anyhow I provided my list of targets for my own Feral Meryl just as a useful example of what you might want to have in place on the ground for a horse that is troubled or anxious before you even think of riding.

[SuzieQNutter]

@Scribbler

This is true. However I thought horse came with a warning about bolting? Or is that just all coming from Ms Crankenspur the ammie friend “trainer” with the gag bit?

OP does say in first post she wouldn’t have enough control if horse wanted to bolt. I assumed this was a real possibility but it could have just been beginner rider anxiety. Most horses don’t bolt in the real scary sense.

Anyhow I provided my list of targets for my own Feral Meryl just as a useful example of what you might want to have in place on the ground for a horse that is troubled or anxious before you even think of riding.

OP Said she is worried about stopping if the horse bolted. Friend told her to put on an elevator bit as the horse bites through the bit.

I have no idea what that means but I am now presuming that friend got run away with by a horse in a snaffle once and now does not like snaffles and instead of training puts on harsher bits and a standing martingale and is putting her fear of being bolted on onto the OP of what could happen

[Xanthoria]

Last person I knew who tried to force a worried horse to calm down with a tie down and a big bit ended up underneath the mare who reared and flipped on her. Imagine if you were scared and someone put handcuffs and a gag on you: would it help calm you down or scare you rigid?

I’m with everyone who says standing martingales and tie downs should NOT be mandatory equipment - they are remedial tack for riders who don’t know any other way to address it.

[Scribbler]

@SuzieQNutter

OP Said she is worried about stopping if the horse bolted. Friend told her to put on an elevator bit as the horse bites through the bit.

I have no idea what that means but I am now presuming that friend got run away with by a horse in a snaffle once and now does not like snaffles and instead of training puts on harsher bits and a standing martingale and is putting her fear of being bolted on onto the OP of what could happen

This is quite likely.

[drifterlee]

Tie-downs, martingales, severe bits and so on do not teach a horse anything. They just make the horse more uncomfortable. Check the teeth. Use fly spray. Check her back and the saddle fit. Check her feet. Try a horse chiropractor. Have you wormed her lately? Re-train the horse in a mild bit in an enclosed area. Start all over. Desensitize her. Don’t believe anything the former owner told youi. They sold you the horse, right?

[RockyMountainMare]

@SuzieQNutter

OP Said she is worried about stopping if the horse bolted. Friend told her to put on an elevator bit as the horse bites through the bit.

I have no idea what that means but I am now presuming that friend got run away with by a horse in a snaffle once and now does not like snaffles and instead of training puts on harsher bits and a standing martingale and is putting her fear of being bolted on onto the OP of what could happen

All this is accurate, my mare has never bolted on me, one time when I first got her she did about 10 feet of a pacey gait and the moment I remembered to sit deep she stopped on a dime. I can’t super consider that a “bolt” since I’ve actually been bolted on full gallop by an elderly yet frisky Arabian who just wanted to relive the good ol days.

I honestly think my friends advice ended up psyching me out a bit, and I got insecure and just decided to agree and change bits because my working knowledge of training horses is limited. But if I accurately reflect on my time with this mare, she’s never bolted, she’s never bucked, kicked or reared, and all her spooks I’ve managed to ride through. The fall I took was my fault, and I think my tendency to tense and balance on my hands plus her trip made it all too easy for me to flop right out and that’s on me. And yes she just stood there waiting for me to get up.

The worst spook she had she went sideways and spun in a circle at a deer that popped out of tall grass but I sat the spook and got her to calm down for us to continue on.

[RockyMountainMare]

@Abbie.S

Oh boy. Some good advice, OP, but I want to caution you on one thing:

If the horse is known to be highly spooky, anxious or a bolter, there is not a damn thing that you can put in their mouth that will be effective in fixing those issues.

Someone mentioned a snaffle because it can be used to facilitate a one rein stop, but even then a horse intent on bolting is extraordinarily hard to one rein stop (and it can even be dangerous to do so as you can throw the horse off balance and cause a fall) and depending on where a bolt/spook happens you may not have the room to safely stop the horse.

This is why any horse showing a propensity for any of these things should not be ridden outside a round corral or fenced arena until you are sure you have the appropriate tools to manage the situation.

Experience has taught me that horses that get nervous on a loose rein are ones that have been taught to use the bit for balance. They usually lean on the rider’s hands to some degree, which often leads the rider to believe exactly what you stated, that the horse desires some level of “contact”. Contact has nada to do with how much pressure you hold in your hands and everything to do with how the horse understands and relates to the bit they are carrying. When you drop the reins on a horse that relies on them for balance, you’ve pulled the rug out from underneath them and tossed them in the deep end as far as their balance is concerned. That can be QUITE nerve-wracking for a horse. They have to be taught how to maintain responsibility for their own balance at all times with appropriate correction from the rider as needed. You said this horse is gaited, which makes me think it’s all the more likely she’s used to leaning on her rider for balance.

So it sounds like you’re over-horsed and in need of an actual horseman or woman that knows what they’re doing and can advise beyond stronger bits and contraptions to mask the problem.

You sound like my new trainer! (Which is a good thing, we’ve had a breakthrough!)

[RockyMountainMare]

A general update here for those interested:

so I reconnected with my old trainer who specializes in gaited horses, and I talked things out with her and told her my concerns, and she was very willing to help.

She brought a bunch of bits to test out, but she did really well in the 3 ring elevator snaffle bit, though we put her on the 2nd ring instead of the 3rd like before so the leverage was lighter. We didn’t use any martingale or tie down. My trainer explained to me that it’s a common bit for gaited horses, since the mouthpiece isn’t fixed on the cheek ring which allows for the classic gaited headbob movement and I noticed my mare willing to collect without the tension that the shank bit or imus bit caused. I could see her relax all the way through her neck and back, and she looked happier. My new trainer believes that any more bit than that is seriously stressing my mare out, who is trying very hard to please but just doesn’t know what to do.
What she believes is happening is not that my horse is out of control, as my friend believed, but more that my horse just doesn’t know what to do and needs time/training to give her confidence. Throwing away the reins is taking away her balance (and explains her tripping) and so without that bit contact she was losing her crutch essentially. She’s incredibly willing, and responsive to my trainers hands and usually figures it out quickly, and then needs some help maintaining it, as she’s still not fully conditioned to collect for a solid half hour straight. She improved more drastically in 2 lessons than I think I’ve ever seen her. So much, that, (and bear with me here, I was safe I promise) my trainer felt that I would be able to hop on and have no problems. So, in the arena I got on (after 30 minutes of my trainer riding her and getting her in the right consistent collection) and lord I missed riding my own horse. She did phenomenal! We are both still learning, but she was receptive and I could then learn to feel her movements, feel her neck arch and her relax her jaw so she could bump on the bit but not hang out on it like she used to. She was learning to balance herself! She didn’t trip the entire lesson, OR spook. My trainer noticed that when she is in “work mode” and isn’t allowed to mentally wander, she’s damn near bombproof. She passed by golf carts, people, a dog, and even squirrels running around at her feet without so much as a muscle twitch. Her mind was engaged and she felt great.
What we kind of came to conclude is that she’s undertrained definitely, but eager to please and enjoys working to the point that she feels confident when you’re asking her to do things, but the reward of releasing the reins was unnerving her (taking away her crutch). So we have to train her to soften in her jaw and hold herself correctly so when we entrust more rein to her she doesn’t panic. She doesnt care about environmental things when she’s got a job to do, and as we taught her to collect and balance herself, we could loosen the reins more and more and she wouldn’t get scared. She needs reminders, but she’s picking it up quickly. I’m also still learning, so any future lesson may begin with my trainer working her first and getting her to the right position so that way I’m not confusing her while I’m trying to figure it out. I can feel where she’s supposed to be, and then practice getting her there. I’m definitely not taking her outside the arena for awhile.

Shes also improved greatly on the ground. She hasn’t spooked at anything in days! I think the increase in work and training her to rely on herself is actually helping her gain confidence. I hung her lead rope over her neck and walked without touching it and she just followed me around the ranch, stopped when I stopped, backed up with me, she was just very calm and tuned in. A lot of her typically-spooky triggers haven’t phased her. I know this could just be temporary, so I’m keeping up all daily groundwork training but it’s nice that she’s not as far gone as I thought she was. I’ll likely only ride her with my trainers supervision for now, as I don’t want to confuse my mare if I get something wrong but… it’s giving me some hope. Getting a proper trainer to evaluate her and really see where her training gaps are really helped.

[Bluey]

@RockyMountainMare

A general update here for those interested:

so I reconnected with my old trainer who specializes in gaited horses, and I talked things out with her and told her my concerns, and she was very willing to help.

She brought a bunch of bits to test out, but she did really well in the 3 ring elevator snaffle bit, though we put her on the 2nd ring instead of the 3rd like before so the leverage was lighter. We didn’t use any martingale or tie down. My trainer explained to me that it’s a common bit for gaited horses, since the mouthpiece isn’t fixed on the cheek ring which allows for the classic gaited headbob movement and I noticed my mare willing to collect without the tension that the shank bit or imus bit caused. I could see her relax all the way through her neck and back, and she looked happier. My new trainer believes that any more bit than that is seriously stressing my mare out, who is trying very hard to please but just doesn’t know what to do.
What she believes is happening is not that my horse is out of control, as my friend believed, but more that my horse just doesn’t know what to do and needs time/training to give her confidence. Throwing away the reins is taking away her balance (and explains her tripping) and so without that bit contact she was losing her crutch essentially. She’s incredibly willing, and responsive to my trainers hands and usually figures it out quickly, and then needs some help maintaining it, as she’s still not fully conditioned to collect for a solid half hour straight. She improved more drastically in 2 lessons than I think I’ve ever seen her. So much, that, (and bear with me here, I was safe I promise) my trainer felt that I would be able to hop on and have no problems. So, in the arena I got on (after 30 minutes of my trainer riding her and getting her in the right consistent collection) and lord I missed riding my own horse. She did phenomenal! We are both still learning, but she was receptive and I could then learn to feel her movements, feel her neck arch and her relax her jaw so she could bump on the bit but not hang out on it like she used to. She was learning to balance herself! She didn’t trip the entire lesson, OR spook. My trainer noticed that when she is in “work mode” and isn’t allowed to mentally wander, she’s damn near bombproof. She passed by golf carts, people, a dog, and even squirrels running around at her feet without so much as a muscle twitch. Her mind was engaged and she felt great.
What we kind of came to conclude is that she’s undertrained definitely, but eager to please and enjoys working to the point that she feels confident when you’re asking her to do things, but the reward of releasing the reins was unnerving her (taking away her crutch). So we have to train her to soften in her jaw and hold herself correctly so when we entrust more rein to her she doesn’t panic. She doesnt care about environmental things when she’s got a job to do, and as we taught her to collect and balance herself, we could loosen the reins more and more and she wouldn’t get scared. She needs reminders, but she’s picking it up quickly. I’m also still learning, so any future lesson may begin with my trainer working her first and getting her to the right position so that way I’m not confusing her while I’m trying to figure it out. I can feel where she’s supposed to be, and then practice getting her there. I’m definitely not taking her outside the arena for awhile.

Shes also improved greatly on the ground. She hasn’t spooked at anything in days! I think the increase in work and training her to rely on herself is actually helping her gain confidence. I hung her lead rope over her neck and walked without touching it and she just followed me around the ranch, stopped when I stopped, backed up with me, she was just very calm and tuned in. A lot of her typically-spooky triggers haven’t phased her. I know this could just be temporary, so I’m keeping up all daily groundwork training but it’s nice that she’s not as far gone as I thought she was. I’ll likely only ride her with my trainers supervision for now, as I don’t want to confuse my mare if I get something wrong but… it’s giving me some hope. Getting a proper trainer to evaluate her and really see where her training gaps are really helped.

What a good report, sounds like your trainer figured your horse out and is helping you and horse get along.
Gaited horses have their own ways.
Is good to cater to those for them to go well and it seems your trainer will teach you what to do.

Once a local trainer was looking for a quiet horse for a client to trail ride.
I had seen an ad for a real nice paint mare, sent it to the trainer.
The trainer told me that horse was crippled!
I asked where, trainer said all over, it sure walked funny, something was wrong.
It was a gaited horse, trainer had never seen one.

To give a break to those that tried to help you, your friend and others, some gaited horses can be a different kind of horse, why they were not able to really help you.
It took a gaited horse person to know what to look for and how to proceed.

Bet you will be the one that can later help others that find themselves where you were.

[TheHunterKid90]

@RockyMountainMare

A general update here for those interested:

so I reconnected with my old trainer who specializes in gaited horses, and I talked things out with her and told her my concerns, and she was very willing to help.

She brought a bunch of bits to test out, but she did really well in the 3 ring elevator snaffle bit, though we put her on the 2nd ring instead of the 3rd like before so the leverage was lighter. We didn’t use any martingale or tie down. My trainer explained to me that it’s a common bit for gaited horses, since the mouthpiece isn’t fixed on the cheek ring which allows for the classic gaited headbob movement and I noticed my mare willing to collect without the tension that the shank bit or imus bit caused. I could see her relax all the way through her neck and back, and she looked happier. My new trainer believes that any more bit than that is seriously stressing my mare out, who is trying very hard to please but just doesn’t know what to do.
What she believes is happening is not that my horse is out of control, as my friend believed, but more that my horse just doesn’t know what to do and needs time/training to give her confidence. Throwing away the reins is taking away her balance (and explains her tripping) and so without that bit contact she was losing her crutch essentially. She’s incredibly willing, and responsive to my trainers hands and usually figures it out quickly, and then needs some help maintaining it, as she’s still not fully conditioned to collect for a solid half hour straight. She improved more drastically in 2 lessons than I think I’ve ever seen her. So much, that, (and bear with me here, I was safe I promise) my trainer felt that I would be able to hop on and have no problems. So, in the arena I got on (after 30 minutes of my trainer riding her and getting her in the right consistent collection) and lord I missed riding my own horse. She did phenomenal! We are both still learning, but she was receptive and I could then learn to feel her movements, feel her neck arch and her relax her jaw so she could bump on the bit but not hang out on it like she used to. She was learning to balance herself! She didn’t trip the entire lesson, OR spook. My trainer noticed that when she is in “work mode” and isn’t allowed to mentally wander, she’s damn near bombproof. She passed by golf carts, people, a dog, and even squirrels running around at her feet without so much as a muscle twitch. Her mind was engaged and she felt great.
What we kind of came to conclude is that she’s undertrained definitely, but eager to please and enjoys working to the point that she feels confident when you’re asking her to do things, but the reward of releasing the reins was unnerving her (taking away her crutch). So we have to train her to soften in her jaw and hold herself correctly so when we entrust more rein to her she doesn’t panic. She doesnt care about environmental things when she’s got a job to do, and as we taught her to collect and balance herself, we could loosen the reins more and more and she wouldn’t get scared. She needs reminders, but she’s picking it up quickly. I’m also still learning, so any future lesson may begin with my trainer working her first and getting her to the right position so that way I’m not confusing her while I’m trying to figure it out. I can feel where she’s supposed to be, and then practice getting her there. I’m definitely not taking her outside the arena for awhile.

Shes also improved greatly on the ground. She hasn’t spooked at anything in days! I think the increase in work and training her to rely on herself is actually helping her gain confidence. I hung her lead rope over her neck and walked without touching it and she just followed me around the ranch, stopped when I stopped, backed up with me, she was just very calm and tuned in. A lot of her typically-spooky triggers haven’t phased her. I know this could just be temporary, so I’m keeping up all daily groundwork training but it’s nice that she’s not as far gone as I thought she was. I’ll likely only ride her with my trainers supervision for now, as I don’t want to confuse my mare if I get something wrong but… it’s giving me some hope. Getting a proper trainer to evaluate her and really see where her training gaps are really helped.

I hope you are headed in the right direction I just wanted to comment that an elevator is a gag bit and there is nothing soft or kind about them because of the gag action. It sends mixed signals to your horse but pulling up on the lips, collapsing at the bars and then applying poll pressure when the mouth piece rides the ring to the top.
This information probably won’t change your mind on the bit so if you do continue to use it, please at the very minimum use it with a properly adjusted leather chin strap. This will prevent over rotation of the bit.

[RockyMountainMare]

@TheHunterKid90

I hope you are headed in the right direction I just wanted to comment that an elevator is a gag bit and there is nothing soft or kind about them because of the gag action. It sends mixed signals to your horse but pulling up on the lips, collapsing at the bars and then applying poll pressure when the mouth piece rides the ring to the top.
This information probably won’t change your mind on the bit so if you do continue to use it, please at the very minimum use it with a properly adjusted leather chin strap. This will prevent over rotation of the bit.

This is a good tip, my trainer specifically said to buy a noseband, and a curb chain for my western bridle. While I’m waiting for the pieces to arrive, I’m using an English bridle with a noseband and curb chain and my trainer has made a point to tell me not to ride without them with this bit. She also is stressing that I learn to move my horse with my seat and leg rather than rely on the bit, and only use the bit to help my mare find her balance initially and ask for the collect, and the occasional half halt when she thinks she can speed around corners. My mare is very responsive to seat movement thankfully so I got to watch my trainer move her with hardly any rein at all and hopefully I will learn to do the same.

[RockyMountainMare]

@Bluey

What a good report, sounds like your trainer figured your horse out and is helping you and horse get along.
Gaited horses have their own ways.
Is good to cater to those for them to go well and it seems your trainer will teach you what to do.

Once a local trainer was looking for a quiet horse for a client to trail ride.
I had seen an ad for a real nice paint mare, sent it to the trainer.
The trainer told me that horse was crippled!
I asked where, trainer said all over, it sure walked funny, something was wrong.
It was a gaited horse, trainer had never seen one.

To give a break to those that tried to help you, your friend and others, some gaited horses can be a different kind of horse, why they were not able to really help you.
It took a gaited horse person to know what to look for and how to proceed.

Bet you will be the one that can later help others that find themselves where you were.

Now that I’ve learned even a little more about gaited horses I absolutely cannot blame my friend for her well meaning advice, even if it wasn’t right for us. Not to mention all horses are different, and what my horse needs is different than some of my trainers other gaited horses, as she’s still learning.

I also try to remind myself that there’s a wealth of horse advice and methods out there, and everyone will tell you something different. Doesn’t mean they’re wrong, but that everyone has their own way. I can’t doubt myself so much when I have a gut feeling about my horse, and the best thing to do is to consult with someone who really knows their stuff, and in my case, someone who has a history with gaited horses! Im excited to learn more, and develop that partnership with my horse.

[SuzieQNutter]

If the elevator bit has a curb chain or space for a curb chain it is NOT a snaffle bit. It is a curb bit.

With curb bits the shorter the shank the less leverage.

Snaffle bits have no curb chain.

All bits are only as severe as the hands on the other end of the reins.

She will learn fast. In fact she will learn a lot faster than you. That is how smart and great horses are.

So continue with your trainer and it is great that your trainer will ride as well.

A fantastic update from you.