yes! at my house (i keep her at home) there is a big field behind the barns that i will sometimes hack out in. she will spook at NOTHING. the second most recent time i rode her out there, i did not see a single spooky thing. my mare decided there was and she jumped sideways then spun and i fell off. i never even found what she had spooked at, because there was nothing out of the ordinary. she is always spooky and runs out there, im not sure if its just because its not fenced in or what, but she always fights and pulls because she wants to keep going faster and faster.
There was also a double bridle involved but, mercifully, no top hat.
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Good to know, though I wonder if my ancient brain is remembering something from the 60’s or 70’s.
In the past two years I have had 6 trainers, 4 of them at the same barn, 2 at the second, and then my current trainer moved away from the second barn to start her own program. I paid to take lessons from them and also have extra pro rides. She mostly does the same thing when pros ride her, she has a really spooky demeanor even at home. We currently compete in the 3’ and USHJA National Derbies. We do pretty good, we got 10th out of 47 at Pin Oak this year in the Jr/Am National Derby but before moving up I want to rid of the problem. I explained in another reply about her whole history, it was pretty recent. I have tried to accumulate her to new things but it seems like she never really gets over being scared of them.
In the summer of 2022 she colicked really bad and had to go into emergency surgery after we moved her to a new climate. The barn was really secluded, they had her outside almost all day in the 110 degree weather when she was used to 80-90 degrees and never told us (we moved away from that barn). She had super bad impaction in her intestines, but she made a full recovery. She is now on two 1/2 scoops of ADR Powder everyday to help her stomach, without it she starts to have weird manure and isn’t right. She also gets electrolytes everyday. She hasn’t really been checked much for ulcers but we haven’t dove into it much because it hasn’t seemed like a problem, at her next vet check I will for sure ask about it.
If you want to show your mare in November I suggest you check into ulcers now and not put it off until the next visit. 
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Has anybody ever had her vision checked?
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If draws didn’t help much, I’m back to “it’s pain” or “it’s vision” related, because if it isn’t those two you have a horse with a screw loose. Unfortunate, but they’re out there.
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Popping back in - OP, grab some tubes of ulcergard and do 1 a day for a couple weeks. If that’s prohibitively expensive, do the Abler or Nexium. A scope is best and a short trial is just to see if anything changes (it isn’t enough to treat/heal them, and there are kinds of ulcers that omeprazole won’t touch), but IIWM I’d start there.
Have her vision thoroughly checked at the next vet appointment, as a second step. Check her diet (running it through feedxl can give you a ballpark idea if you’re missing something crucial). Triple check her tack fit. Then send her to the trainer’s and see what happens.
I have a feeling you have a hot and sensitive horse that requires specific management and may always be a pro ride, or at least needs a “program” of pro rides and lessons for you. She may simply not be suited to life at home and sporadic lessons if you want to horse show and do the H/J thing.
I don’t think you’re going to find a magic bullet that puts y’all successfully at the 3’6” this fall. Bending to the outside and being this spooky does not a Hunter make - that’s not to say that this cannot be fixed, but it won’t be easy. What kind of a timeline are you on? Are you trying to do competitive things before aging out, going to school, or some other deadline? Do you want to show competitively with a horse you keep at home? Because I do not think this mare will do either of those things without monumental effort, time, and money. That’s fine, if the goal is to work with THIS horse, but make sure you’re not trying to fit a square peg into a round hole here, either.
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I have a lovely horse with a giant stride and an ADHD brain. He is a sweet heart but if I don’t keep his focus 100% on me, he will start spooking at everything, at home and at shows. He was started by a kid who (I think) was totally overwhelmed by him and let him get in to a spooking and stopping habit. Then he was with a male trainer who could muscle him around. I do not have the physical strength to do that and I don’t think it’s a great long term solution!
What I have found to work best is to keep him completely packaged and manage every step. If I have done my homework and ridden a lot of really good flatwork, I can let him out a touch but as soon as he tries to take over, I have to reiterate the “I’m in charge” lesson. It’s gotten much better over the two years I’ve had him but there are times when I backslide, get careless, and it all falls apart. We go back to “This is my canter, I make the decisions” for a few weeks and he seems much happier in his skin and his brain! Fortunately, I’m in a program where my trainer has been able to figure him out (with the input of several other trainers) and the arc of our training is bent towards progress.
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Wait a sec.
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If she will jump anything, she is brave. What she is doing is being brave but also a vigilant prey animal. This combination doesn’t surprise me, especially in a mare.
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The pros who said “meh, just bend her more” are right, to a point. But I would say that they have left out a couple of things.
Those things are:
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You need to get her more “broke.” What that actually means is that she remains more rideable on the flat, but also lighter to the aids and also responsive too them on a no-matter-what basis.
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You need to get her more “listening” because that actually provides her security. If you let her know that staying underneath you, and tuning into you will keep her safe, she won’t need to be so focused on things that might attack her as she is galloping along and looking for the next fence.
All this is easier said than done, especially with a WB mare. But it can be done with time, consistency and good training.
Been there, done that… and now my hot, might-bolt-and-kill-someone-in-the-schooling-ring mare is a reliable soldier. Her focus and try are amazing! Your brave, game mare has the ingredients for that. You just need to become a leader that she feels has the credibility to take her attention away from all of that extraneous stuff.
Again, if listening to your aids is always required and the release of them always brings her peace, she will look more to your ride than to those spooky things she’s trying to protect herself from in the outside world.
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Interesting!
I think it has to do with the way dressage horses are taught that they should (try) to ignore the outside world to and focus exclusively on their rider’s aids. The hunter, on the other hand, has to negotiate with the outside world (after all, he has to find the jumps and get his body safely over them). Plus, hunters are taught that relaxation will be a part of their ride and “available to them” at any moment that they respond to an aid. In dressage, I think folks tolerate a whole lot more tension in their horses, even when the horse is doing it right. From the horse’s point of view, then, the threats posed by a choatic, outside world and their rider’s relationship to those as a source of security or not are quite different.
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Yeah I mean H/J rings are pretty chaotic sometimes, too, versus the quiet enforced by sniper during dressage tests (I’m kidding… mostly). It’s nothing like some breed shows, don’t get me wrong!
Regardless, good flatwork creates a dialogue between horse and rider and can create confidence in a horse. Responses to the aids that are so ingrained they don’t require full attention from the horse can help too - by golly you’ll get off my inside leg even if there ARE tigers in the bushes!
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Echo the votes for putting her in a program.
Every “nervous” type that I have had has benefitted from knowing exactly what is expected of them every day of the week.
In my experience, much easier to accomplish in a professional program than at home/self-managed.
And, as previously mentioned, judiciously-used draw reins. Teach her and train her the way you want her to go. Help her build the correct muscles and muscle memory.
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I would definitely check for ulcers. If she has them, treat them. If not, then you’ve ruled that out, and I’d do a basic lameness exam to check for any other obvious pain issues. Pain can make them hypervigilant and spooky, and no amount of training will unravel it all unless you address the pain.
Next, are you using ear plugs? I think they can really help with focus for these types. Easy and harmless enough to try.
And finally, this is not an at the show problem. You can’t possibly fix this at shows until you fix it at home. Are there any other horses at home? Anyone else ride with you? Maybe some company from a relaxed steady eddie type will help her not always be on the lookout for stuff to spook at. After all of that, then you have to work on general rideability. This might take stronger tools than you are using now, because blowing through the aids is not acceptable. You need whatever it takes to get at least SOME response in the right direction that you can reward her for. But whatever it is, it can’t be too harsh in that it makes her anxious. Without jumping, she needs to be able to hack around the ring relaxed and focused and not about to spin you off at any moment. She needs to be able to connect with you on the ground and in the saddle. She has some baggage apparently from a previous owner and does not trust her rider.
There are various methods for teaching relaxation, but she also sounds like a candidate for a period of full training from someone who can fix the basic rideability part. Apart from that, doing obstacles and some controlled desensitization work may help with your communication and connection. Because if she is brave to the jumps, she can be brave to other weird objects in the ring as a starting point. It’s not that unusual for these WBs to be looky outside the ring but fine with all the jumps and filler and whatnot in the ring, but it’s a focus and connection problem more than a real fear problem. It’s dis-associative type behavior that’s a manifestation of underlying stress and anxiety (which is why you check for pain as the first step).
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OP, based on your updated information:
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Get a thorough vet exam including eyes. although I suspect ulcers. You can either scope for ulcers or just start treating w/Omeprozol.
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Check saddle fit
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Get into a program with regular pro rides at home and at shows. If it was my horse and I wanted to move up, I’d have a pro ride weekly as well as riding/showing at every show until this is done.
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Consider adding in dressage lessons to help improve rideability.
Good luck, I hope you find a solution that works for both of you!
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I would run titers for EPM and Lyme also
Both of those things can make a horse seem nutty, and not necessarily classically ataxic, or lame
Ulcergard is great. So is Equicalm. It has bismuth in it for the gut. It was the difference maker for a horse we had a few years ago; either bucked the kid off without it, or was a winner in big classes
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OP, I feel your pain!
My WB mare “gawked” and spooked at EVERYTHING.
What worked for me:
- I did a round of ulcerguard: I saw results in 3-4 days.
- Hormone implants: Synovex. My vet recommended them. They have made a world of difference. Did not completely eliminate heat cycles, but boy did it help get rid of most of them. $100, every 6 months.
- Lots of Warwick Schiller training. It’s an eye-opener for a long-time rider like me. My mare is lots more confident about herself and about me being a good steward of her.
- And still, there are a lot of “gawk” moments! I’ve learned that I need to just keep riding, and hope that she is learning that she can look, but needs to keep going forward. Can’t stop and check everything out! It’s amusing to see what she gawks at and what she does not: it’s like “Mom, that?That’s no big deal.”
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I haven’t read through all of the comments, but of course assuming there is no pain causing this behavior…will she jump jumper jumps?
I’d try some little (.80) jumpers. My hot and somewhat spooky mare thrives on a soundproof bonnet at shows. Of course I also do the ulcergard routine prior to and during every show.
That way, it’s not stressful for you to make it perfect, and you can go as slow as you want, really take your time, and still practice in a show ring setting.
Best of luck!
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