Updated with more questions. Hoof progress or not? Another hoof thread

Okay I’m back with more hoof X-rays and deliberation. For background, my 11YO TB gelding is on rehab for a front suspensory, which has been attributed to a series of poor farriers and his own poor choices in turnout. I’ve found a farrier with similar thoughts on hoof care as myself (he’s done my horse once so far). We have been working to correct some gnarly NPA with vet prescribed pads and temporary wedges.

I’m just wondering if we are making any visible progress or if I’m just throwing money around. I don’t know a ton about reading balance films so I thought I’d post them here to see if anyone has input on what we could do better or encouragement that we are going the right way :sweat_smile:

All of these sets were taken 3-6 months apart, depending. And I’ve switched farriers in the middle due to moving him to a rehab barn.

Left fore

Right fore

Left hind

Right hind

Do the rads go from 1 being oldest to 3/4 being newest? Were they all taken at the same time in the cycle? I’m not seeing much in the way of positive change in these rads. The RH almost looks worse, and all four feet still have significantly broken back HPA. The toes have gotten shorter, which is good, but IMO there is still room to take toe on both fronts. Left hind/right fore seem to be in okay-ish shape but I would not be happy at all with LF/RH. What does the vet think?

2 Likes

Yes 1 is oldest, around March 2022, and 3 or 4 is newest in January 2023. We missed a set of hind X-rays in October 2022 which is why there’s only 3 of those.

These were taken about a week or so into a cycle for the most part.

The vet hasn’t seen them all laid out this way, or at least I don’t think so. The last two sets are theirs, and they are mildly happy with the difference the wedges made in front.

I also feel as if we’ve not made a huge difference, but like I said the current farrier has only done him once. I see more sole depth, but that’s about it.

If the current farrier has only done him once, then start taking external pics after every reset, and get new rads in another 2-3 resets. I’m not sure if the increased sole depth is a good thing, or just retained false sole.

The hinds are worse, with more bullnosing, unless that’s an artifcat of the toe being dubbed.

The wedges have improved the alignment of the fronts, though I’m not all that happy with the toes hanging over the front of the shoes a bit. It’s not by much, but as the cycle goes on it will increase.

Hopefully the current farrier will make a difference

2 Likes

Thank you for being so detailed. It helps me to have words to discuss with the farrier. I’m not about to tell him how to do his job, but it’s hard for me to express my concerns besides “I thought they’d look more different”!

Well… I didn’t get hoof pics after the farrier yesterday. Extenuating circumstances. I will try this week.

In the meantime I’m trying to decide what is me not communicating well, what is just different from my expectations, and what is simply not working. I am not a farrier, I couldn’t do their job, but do I think I have a fundamental understanding of hoof anatomy and also geometry in general.

The hooves are still quite far over the front of the shoes on a fresh reset. However, the front wedge pad shoes are set tight on the heels, with heel bulb hanging over the end of the shoe slightly. In the past, my old farrier always left shoe sticking out a bit so his heels had support? I think? Horse only pulled shoes off himself when it was spectacularly muddy and he got wild in turnout, but now he’s on stall rest and wears bell boots 24/7.
The hind shoes have trailers, and those look more normal to me, though his toes are still over the front of the shoe. My old farrier (who is 2 hours away and I’d have to haul to, otherwise I’d be there), also took WAY more toe off from all 4. Which I asked for yesterday. The toes still look super long to me, though I don’t know if there’s a reason we couldn’t take more off.

This farrier also uses a power sander to take the entire outside layer of dirt and horn from the hoof, and sands the toes down after the shoes are on? Is there a reason for this? The toes are still over the front of the shoe, but maybe they’re rolling them? The shoe itself isn’t rockered or rolled from what I can tell so I’m confused.

I would ask the farrier, and I did try, but the assistant (who does all the shoe pulling, the trim, and the sanding), has a terrible habit of just talking over everyone with their opinions on feed, treats, management, etc., even when directly and firmly told “thanks but no thanks, I feed my boarded horses the way their owners tell me”. The farrier is, I suspect, somewhat hard of hearing which doesn’t help. So, I attempted to ask good questions but was either misunderstood or talked right over by the peanut gallery.

If anyone has insight on what could be the thought process here? Or questions to ask if I can corral the farrier to ask them?

(FWIW the boarded horses are fed true free choice quality T/O hay, live outside 24/7 in balanced groups, and eat low NSC grain or RBs with quality supps to fill in any gaps - E, MSM, CU/ZN, salt, etc. These guys aren’t on sweet feed and 3 flakes of fescue.)

Here’s not great angle pics of the fronts from the last set on Jan 1, the day they were done. Just to try to see what I’m seeing, though I think the toes are more over the front this round. Especially on the back feet.

Agree. Without seeing what the feet looked like externally before, I’m inclined to say I think this farrier is going in the right direction and would give him at least a couple cycles before you judge progress. The shoe being set back under the toe doesn’t bother me in the least, especially given that the horse is recovering from a front suspensory injury.

3 Likes

it’s hard to tell too much from the angles of these pics, but I see shoes with room for feet to expand, and I see at least the LF with the toe rasped back so it’s not hanging over the shoe.

Good Hoof Photos - How to take Good Hoof Photos

This is a good guide on how to take pics that can be more properly evaluated :slight_smile:

1 Like

I’ll go ahead and caveat what I’m about to say with I am not a professional farrier but I am a huge hoof nerd and have consulted with a number of reputable farriers who have helped me learn through the years.

Based on his rads, the shoe is set too far forward and the toe is left too high. If you were to draw a straight line down the front of the coffin bone to the sole of the foot, that’s the breakover point and where the shoe should be. The most recent set on the RF and LF look pretty good, maybe set too forward by a few milimeters, but the hinds are not.

What training does your farrier have? There are so many different schools of training that it’s only part of the puzzle but a big one. He may be doing it the way he was taught, but if things continue the way they are and you’re not happy with them, then you may wish to seek another opinion from a different line of training.

1 Like