Over 10k for a BN horse? I’d lease for a year or so - and oldie but goodie type…then maybe import if needed? No wonder why people are importing more horses - for the mileage they have, it pays. I’d think outside the box; PC, h/j land where bargains can be had for a hony or ‘off-breed’ who may have an owners whose dabbled in various disciplines. Maybe at 10k you have a horse that’s done a lot of XC schooling or schooling HTs but an owner who hasn’t done the rated stuff - at BN in that Area - why bother? Anyways just some ideas…
[QUOTE=AwesomeDiscover09;7499333]
I have a horse that is a training level packer! He has one stop at BN but it was because I went by my fence and had to go back to it. And a stop at Prelim because he slid into it and that was it. But it shows up as stops. If you find a horse you like you should contact the owner and see what happened at those events. It might not be what you think. And as for price I got an amazing OTTB for 2,500. And never had a stop. And still has a clean record. I won 3 out of 4 events with him last year. So they are out there. Just have to keep looking.[/QUOTE]
That is what you paid for him BEFORE he was a packer. But I bet you would not have sold him for that once he ad shown he WAS a BN packer.
[QUOTE=Janet;7499678]
That is what you paid for him BEFORE he was a packer. But I bet you would not have sold him for that once he ad shown he WAS a BN packer.[/QUOTE]
I bought this OTTB for 2,500 2 years ago. And he was a novice packer! I bought him to teach my husband to event. I kept him at that BN,N level. As for the Training level packer. He is a warmblood that I bought when he was 2 and trained up the levels.
[QUOTE=secretariat;7496703]
You’re quoting some big names in your list. Those folks aren’t going to deal in a horse less than 10K no matter what the record. Most pros even without a big name won’t either, especially if you restrict your search to the stated area. For <10K in that area, you need a backyard/pure ammie horse. They’re out there, but they’ll be hard to find.
Just out of curiosity, why would you not want to save $5 - 10K and come to Kentucky?[/QUOTE]
Secretariat is the father of Megan Moore from Team CEO. I’ve gotten several horses off of Megan and they’ve been honestly represented and honestly priced. If she says she has something that matches your criteria (and your criteria is honestly presented) it’s worth the trip.
I agree - try to take the BNTs off your list. Look at local pros - their prices are bound to be more reasonable.
If you are so gunshy about a horse with a few stops on his record, why don’t you shop with your trainer or a pro you trust?
Around here, plenty of BN packers (not the fancy types - think QHs, some TBs, mostly draft-xs) for $10k or less. You just have to look in the right places - which are usually PC homes, “backyard barns” and lesser known trainers.
I have the answer.
volunteer as a jump judge.
You will see, in person, every horse you are looking at buying and will know the real reason for the penalties!
And volunteer more than once as a jump judge, perhaps at different events! Now that’s dedication but what a way to do your proper research on horses that are for sale. Go and watch them compete. Like to Fair Hill or Loch Moy or Waredaca (400+ entries), might be enough horses to see.
I’ve come across the same thing and it’s making me depressed. Somehow I lucked out on our very first event horse I bought for my daughter for $3500. I’m not kidding when I say his USEA record had dressage scores in the 20s, not a XC or stadium penalty to be found, and he had won just about every BN event in Area 8. Literally. First places all over the record. He also had a video of his 10th at AECs and he was perfect in every way aside from his age (16). He wasn’t a TOTAL packer because if you did something wrong, he’d let you know but he taught my daughter the sport. Now he’s 20 and we are trying to replace him (not sell him though - never!) and it’s nuts. Anything under $10K either has NO USEA record or a dismal one. Dressage scores in the 50s, rails flying in stadium, penalties, RFs, Es and TEs in cross country and still described as “packers.” eesh. I fee like saying “I KNOW a packer, and your horse, sir, is NO packer!” haha Anyway, since I’m not rich, I will probably end up buying her a project which she can train herself. And it will be a nice learning experience. That’s the way of the world.
[QUOTE=AwesomeDiscover09;7499719]
I bought this OTTB for 2,500 2 years ago. And he was a novice packer! I bought him to teach my husband to event. I kept him at that BN,N level. As for the Training level packer. He is a warmblood that I bought when he was 2 and trained up the levels.[/QUOTE]
OK, I misunderstood your post.
But the question is still-
Would YOU sell him for $2500?
horses under 10K are typically not found or advertised in big name’s barns. I agree to look at local trainers and PC homes… even places like Facebook. There is a great selection of reasonably priced horses in area 2, just don’t expect to find them at BNT barns. I had a perfect ottb sold last fall that really was a “packer” xc… still green but would jump anything in front of him… sold to a junior for 9K. Had one stop on XC at a rec. novice where the rider in front of me was RIGHT IN FRONT OF MY JUMP. My horse was really surprised and stopped… so not really his fault! Had another one that just sold, solid BN for 8k. So you can find good quality horses… just need to look in the right places!
Which brings us to another point - can always buy the 5k horse who is good by lacking the show record, and put a couple months of pro training & showing under his belt, and have your packer. But hmm, I’d even travel up to Area 1 - there’s one on the FB website who looks great. Eventing Nation seems to have some worth researching…could be your timing right now, too.
So is it “allowed” for any of you folks to PM me with links to horses you are speaking of in other areas (I would think it would be ok if you don’t own them?)
Also, I hear many of you on the buy one and send it to a trainer, been there, done that twice with horses that ended up not wanting to event. OTTB and a Paint. Really at least want some type of “proof” that they will do xc happily (even a schooling video).
I’m not depressed yet, but it is a little upsetting when you read ads and think oh that is the perfect one, then talk to the owner and find out all kinds of holes. Oh well, such is the life of horse shopping.
[QUOTE=goodmorning;7499483]
Over 10k for a BN horse? I’d lease for a year or so - and oldie but goodie type…then maybe import if needed? No wonder why people are importing more horses - for the mileage they have, it pays. I’d think outside the box; PC, h/j land where bargains can be had for a hony or ‘off-breed’ who may have an owners whose dabbled in various disciplines. Maybe at 10k you have a horse that’s done a lot of XC schooling or schooling HTs but an owner who hasn’t done the rated stuff - at BN in that Area - why bother? Anyways just some ideas…[/QUOTE]
Agree, would love to lease, but those oldies but goodies are hard to hear about!!
[QUOTE=Winding Down;7499398]
Interesting, given that people fly in here regularly to shop for horses![/QUOTE]
Perhaps you missed the qualifications in the earlier part of this discussion about looking for less expensive lower level horses? People flying to area ii looking for affordable horses is oxymoronic.
Hey, leave me out of it. 
[QUOTE=Janet;7499923]
OK, I misunderstood your post.
But the question is still-
Would YOU sell him for $2500?[/QUOTE]
Yes, I would still sell him for that price. Someone gave me that chance to ride an amazing horse. So I would do the same. If he was for sale. And I knew he was going to a great home.
Thanks, Lee Anne. Has all the snow mellowed you? (JK)
One caution - the market is hotter than mexican enchiladas right now and has been for 6-12 months. We sold 3 last month.
The market is incredibly hot right now and I have people inquiring about horses that are even for sale yet!
I have typically paid very little for horses and I never shop outside of Area II. I really think we have both a larger number to look at as well as great quality. I would not recommend leaving this area to shop… I don’t think you have to.
BNT will charge more. I would settle for something that does not have a big USEA record but instead go for something that has done Pony Club, local events, and fox hunting. There is an abundance of these horses around here. And if you can give up on insisting on a USEA record, make a point of having the seller trailer the horse to a xc course for you to try out there. I have done this for countless times for people.
In terms of record vs price- I don’t think you can expect many horses under 10k to have an extensive USEA record. Lots of experience at unrecognized horse trials, pony club events, and foxhunting, sure. But you’re getting into a different market with USEA horses, especially in BNT barns.
It takes $$$ to campaign a horse at the recognized level. If you are looking at BNT barns, you’re not going to find a cheaper LL horse priced in the low 4 figures with any sort of record. Horses under 10k are going to be green, and they are going to be priced for the potential they have, not their experience. Few BNTs are going to compete these types of horses at recognized events until they are ready to go training or so- it just doesn’t make sense financially.
For a safe, experienced packer type in the $10k and under range, I would be looking at large ponies/small horses, older horses, or off breeds (QH and pony crosses, etc). Nothing wrong with them, just harder to market than young warmbloods and TBs, especially if they max out around Novice- this will limit their price significantly. Don’t be too hung up on them having a long USEA record; as long as they know how to cruise around over xc jumps on autopilot, they will be fine.
In terms of the packer discussion, I will say this- I can think of several horses off the top of my head that I would describe as “packers” that do not have clean records. Why? Because they are horses, not machines, and have received some spectacularly bad rides that have resulted in penalties. The safest horses are those that have a sense of self-preservation, and this includes knowing when to stop rather than take an unsafe jump (this can happen even at BN- there are some scary riders out there that ask their horses to do very unsafe things). These horses forgive mistakes and would jump around clean for days under a “passenger type” beginner, but they will have the occasional stop or runout with a constant, badly interfering rider. Even the most saintly horses can only do so much to make up for their riders.
[QUOTE=Winding Down;7500828]
The market is incredibly hot right now and I have people inquiring about horses that are even for sale yet!
I have typically paid very little for horses and I never shop outside of Area II. I really think we have both a larger number to look at as well as great quality. I would not recommend leaving this area to shop… I don’t think you have to.
…[/QUOTE]
Absolutely 100 percent agree. Large numbers to look at, and great quality. Also I completely trust riders like Winding Down to produce great young or experienced horses.
If all you do is look on the internet you are going to miss really nice horses. Not everything is on the internet, and some nice horses are not listed or listed badly – with a poor photo or bad video or description. Not all riders are writers. Some are great sales people and some aren’t. Don’t be a person who has to be sold on a horse. Be a person who is sure of what they want.
If you ever read Modern Eventing by Phillip Dutton, don’t miss the chapter on looking at a horse to buy. It’s excellent, thorough, and detailed – and if more people followed his outline, there certainly would be less angst among both buyers and sellers.
Knowing what you want is key. When people say they can’t find a horse, to me, that means they don’t really know what kind of horse they are looking for, and are waiting to see a horse that excites them. In my experience, those types of horses are VERY EXPENSIVE because someone made them “exciting” (i.e., talented, smart, trained, scopey, etc.).
[QUOTE=retreadeventer;7501869]
…
Knowing what you want is key. When people say they can’t find a horse, to me, that means they don’t really know what kind of horse they are looking for, and are waiting to see a horse that excites them. In my experience, those types of horses are VERY EXPENSIVE because someone made them “exciting” (i.e., talented, smart, trained, scopey, etc.).[/QUOTE]
The flip side is that those horses are insanely cheap but you have to put all the work in on them and there is usually blood involved too. I’m the kind of buyer who waits for “exciting.”
