Veterinarian Proudly Shows Off Cat She Killed

[Chall]

[QUOTE=Scaramouch;8113928]
Riiiight. Because raping a human woman and disposing of a random cat that was caught in a trap in your yard are completely analogous. If it had been a raccoon, NO ONE would care. The picture she posted is only considered “sick” because we have a rather arbitrary affection for cats as a species.

It’s very unfortunate if indeed the cat was someone’s beloved pet - has the cat’s identity actually been confirmed? - and Lindsey’s attitude about the whole thing is deeply off-putting, but I’m not sure how anyone, based on the facts available, can be so sure she’ll be convicted of a crime. Was the trap illegal in the first place? If the cat had been hit by a car but not fatally, do you really think she’d have been charged for euthing it without the owner’s consent?[/QUOTE]

Nope, an animal removal service in NYC was prosecuted for animal cruelty for leaving a trapped raccoon on a roof to succumb to heat exhaustion.
That was a business that specialized in wild animal disposal.

Shooting with a gun is acceptable when done the prescribed way. An arrow is not.
Edited: this is not the quote I meant to post, it was the quote that no one would care if it were a raccoon. .

[Casey09]

[QUOTE=Chall;8115047]
Nope, an animal removal service in NYC was prosecuted for animal cruelty for leaving a trapped raccoon on a roof to succumb to heat exhaustion.
That was a business that specialized in wild animal disposal.

Shooting with a gun is acceptable when done the prescribed way. An arrow is not.[/QUOTE]

I agree. I have not heard of anyone using a leg hold trap and then dispatching an animal with a bow and arrow. I’ve heard of bow hunting, and I’ve heard of trapping raccoons in humane traps and then shooting them.
If people are against feral cats, they mostly still catch them in a humane trap and then take them to an animal shelter, where they could be euthanized after being held for a prescribed number of days. Why she wouldn’t use a humane trap and then take the cat somewhere so that its owners could potentially claim him is beyond me. Just because a cat is feral does not mean that it should be treated cruelly. I’ve taken several feral cats in to have their shots updated and to have them altered if needed. I’ve never needed more than a Have-A-Heart trap and a can of cat food to do that successfully.
As far as it being a first world problem . . . it sure wasn’t for the cat. I sympathize a lot with the owners. As attached as people are to their pets, it must be very difficult. I experience significant grief when I lose a pet, and it would be much worse if a person cruelly dispatched a pet that didn’t require it.
I think any anger should be directed at the clinic, though. Sometimes we don’t know people we think we know. They’ve done all they can do by letting her go. I think this is very atypical behavior for vets. I’ve had vets that hunted for sport, but none that would have supported anything like this.

[Paks]

Interesting that the sitter had left food out for Tiger when he went missing in the hopes he would come back. That food was never touched. Doesn’t sound like they had much of a feral cat problem around there.

Meanwhile reading the comments on the AVMA site facebook site
https://www.facebook.com/avmavets/posts/10152867842183990

and the CSU site

https://www.facebook.com/CSUVetHospital/posts/10152688033416968

Have been interesting. This exchange especially so.

Jennifer Carne As a recent graduate (May 2014) I am appalled, but sadly not surprised. The amount of feline animosity I found among my vet school classmates was horrifying. I heard recently that only 20% of veterinarians actually like cats. This makes me ask, should admission committees be seeking to find applicants who actually want to work with cats? Our field is so canine-dominant and even with all the campaigns out there to further feline health, why do we think anything will change if the majority of veterinarians don’t even like cats. Case in point right here.
Like · Reply · 13 · Yesterday at 7:57pm
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American Veterinary Medical Association (AVMA) Jennifer, could you please share the source for your statement about veterinarians and cats? We’ve not seen any evidence to support that, would appreciate knowing the source so we can assess its validity.
Like · 3 · 2 hrs

Jennifer Carne It was presented to me in a presentation at the AAHA conference in Tampa this year. I’ll consult my notes and try and get in touch with the presenter for the source.
Like · 3 · 2 hrs

Lauren Esposito I found that the majority of veterinary students or supporting staff were not “cat haters”, just uneasy around uncooperative feline patients. Reading their body language is an art form all on it’s own, and I think your prospective will be a bit differe…See More
Like · 3 · 2 hrs

Amber Dowdy The veterinarian I work for doesn’t like cats and it serious sly makes me second guess my place of employment.
Like · 25 mins

Amber Dowdy Unfortunately the only source I have to back up my statement is my own eyes. I’ve seen things that I would never expect in a vet clinic. But it’s a “he say she say” circumstance.
Like · 23 mins

Jennifer Carne In my notes it says “only 17% of veterinarians really like cats” so perhaps I phrased myself incorrectly, since I’m sure there are a lot of people in the “like them okay” or “indifferent” middle grounds. I still think that’s a pretty telling statistic and will reach out to the presenter of the talk for the source. I appreciate that others have had more positive experiences with those in our field and felines. I myself am in a wonderful practice which recently became feline friendly. But that said, I did have classmates who would joke about shooting cats and even instructors would occasionally say something disparaging about kitties. Thus, I don’t think my original comment is far off.

Perhaps we are just now seeing the tip of the iceberg.

[Alagirl]

[QUOTE=Paks;8115181]
Interesting that the sitter had left food out for Tiger when he went missing in the hopes he would come back. That food was never touched. Doesn’t sound like they had much of a feral cat problem around there.

Meanwhile reading the comments on the AVMA site facebook site
https://www.facebook.com/avmavets/posts/10152867842183990

and the CSU site

https://www.facebook.com/CSUVetHospital/posts/10152688033416968

Have been interesting. This exchange especially so.

Perhaps we are just now seeing the tip of the iceberg.[/QUOTE]

That is interesting.

I also think that people kid themselves when they assume that veterinarians love animals so much that they get horribly upset when on dies.
I guess it is no different than humane doctors, who have to learn to compartmentalize, otherwise they wouldn’t make it through anatomy class.
Med students are some of the coldest dogs around (I heard that from many sources in the healthcare field)

[Coyoteco]

[QUOTE=Paks;8115181]
Interesting that the sitter had left food out for Tiger when he went missing in the hopes he would come back. That food was never touched. Doesn’t sound like they had much of a feral cat problem around there.

Meanwhile reading the comments on the AVMA site facebook site
https://www.facebook.com/avmavets/posts/10152867842183990

and the CSU site

https://www.facebook.com/CSUVetHospital/posts/10152688033416968

Have been interesting. This exchange especially so.

Perhaps we are just now seeing the tip of the iceberg.[/QUOTE]

This is such an interesting post. I really am scared that you are right. Though, I didn’t know this still existed in the vet community, I know that it did at one time. For so many years, there was little to no progress in vet med relating to cats and that was related to their status with vets. But, that changed I thought.

My long time vet had a lot of dogs in her practice, but she genuinely liked cats. I have used cats specialists, too. That actually may be a question to ask all prospective vets and staff - just feel around with that issue.

I have thought for many years that CSU is ethically challenged. An examination of my dislike for that institution leads me back to the treatment and death of two cats, at separate times.

Do we all know people either irl or online who enjoy shooting cats? Around the news media, she has a lot of support, too, which I found shocking.

Thank you for posting this information, though it is very disturbing.

[Coyoteco]

[QUOTE=inca;8112751]
The situation is bad enough without making huge, unfounded leaps. She treated my horses on several occasions and was nothing less than professional. I am confident there was no abuse of patients at the clinic. The way the clinic works, the small animal vet’s and large animal vets are separate. I believe I am the only one on the thread with direct knowledge and experience with the clinic and this vet. Stop making unfounded accusations. /end of rant

I am glad she got fired. She deserves whatever is coming her way. But the clinic doesn’t deserve to be attacked because of her actions outside of work. I have been a client for 7 years and Dr. Buenger runs a great clinic. I’ve never had a bad experience at the clinic and have not heard any local people say a bad word about them. The local animal rescue is supporting the clinic and will continue to utilize their services.[/QUOTE]

On the CSU website, a some say that the clinic was aware of this and didn’t act until it became highly public and people expressed their opinions about it. A couple of people there say that one of the remaining clinic vets, Kerri Camp, laughed about the torture killing. If that is true, she, too, should be fired.

Correction: Apparently there is a post in this thread that identifies Kerri Camp as a vet in Mississippi and not with the Texas clinic.

[CaitlinandTheBay]

[QUOTE=Coyoteco;8115264]
On the CSU website, a some say that the clinic was aware of this and didn’t act until it became highly public and people expressed their opinions about it. A couple of people there say that one of the remaining clinic vets, Kerri Camp, laughed about the torture killing. If that is true, she, too, should be fired.[/QUOTE]

Kerri Camp, according to a post in this thread further back, is a vet in Mississippi. She should probably be disciplined, but this clinic has power to do so.

Re: Ghazzu’s post about dispatching raccoons. In high school I worked at a vet clinic that was on the lower end of the economic spectrum. Fantastic vets, just catered to budget conscious owners. Out of all the euths we did (and I can’t remember a day that didn’t involve at least one), the only time I can remember any of the vets being anything close to “happy” was when we put Oreo down. He was about 13, had been fighting leukemia for about 3 years, had no teeth, could barely walk, and was owned by a (sweet, caring) hoarder. That cat suffered for so long and she refused to put him down. Finally the doc talked her into it and when we did it (basically the second she left), you could just see the relief on the vet’s face (and all of ours). I can still remember the smell of him. He just reeked of death. It was so good to be able to give him peace.

That said, we used euthasol not an arrow. And Oreo, if not for extreme medical intervention, would have died on his own. I do not believe this is true for Tiger.

[CaitlinandTheBay]

[QUOTE=Coyoteco;8115264]
On the CSU website, a some say that the clinic was aware of this and didn’t act until it became highly public and people expressed their opinions about it. A couple of people there say that one of the remaining clinic vets, Kerri Camp, laughed about the torture killing. If that is true, she, too, should be fired.[/QUOTE]

Kerri Camp, according to a post in this thread further back, is a vet in Mississippi. She should probably be disciplined, but this clinic has power to do so.

Re: Ghazzu’s post about dispatching raccoons. In high school I worked at a vet clinic that was on the lower end of the economic spectrum. Fantastic vets, just catered to budget conscious owners. Out of all the euths we did (and I can’t remember a day that didn’t involve at least one), the only time I can remember any of the vets being anything close to “happy” was when we put Oreo down. He was about 13, had been fighting leukemia for about 3 years, had no teeth, could barely walk, and was owned by a (sweet, caring) hoarder. That cat suffered for so long and she refused to put him down. Finally the doc talked her into it and when we did it (basically the second she left), you could just see the relief on the vet’s face (and all of ours). I can still remember the smell of him. He just reeked of death. It was so good to be able to give him peace.

That said, we used euthasol not an arrow. And Oreo, if not for extreme medical intervention, would have died on his own. I do not believe this is true for Tiger.

[Coyoteco]

[QUOTE=CaitlinandTheBay;8115281]
Kerri Camp, according to a post in this thread further back, is a vet in Mississippi. She should probably be disciplined, but this clinic has power to do so.

.[/QUOTE]

Thank you, I put an edit on my post. I missed it in this thread and will go look for it. eta And, I read you post as saying that this clinic has no power to discipline Kerri Camp.

[Paks]

In my rather OCD like research I stumbled across the American Association of Feline Practitioners which has a cat friendly certification for veterinary clinics. Washington Animal clinic has does not have either of the two rating the AAFP awards nor does it even have an AAFP member on staff. The closest clinic to Brenham TX that has an AAFP member on staff is over 23 miles away. http://www.catvets.com/cat-owners/find-vets-and-practices

I would suggest that if Washington Animal Clinic wishes to fix the black eye they’ve received over this they start working on one getting one of there staff to join the AAFP, two work on the silver Cat Friendly designation and three get the gold certification.

Given what I have read on the AVMA Facebook page in the future my cat will only be going to clinics with a cat friendly designation. I want a vet working on my cats who actually cares about them, not one who considers dealing with them the price they have to pay for being a vet.

[Jeito]

[QUOTE=Ghazzu;8115045]
I’ve had to dispatch rabid coons and skunks.
I take no particular pleasure in doing so, nor do I have the slightest urge to post photos illustrating my prowess to the interwebz.[/QUOTE]

This ^^ And the number of people right here who seem to be missing the LEVELS of wrong of what this vet did gives me cause for concern Professionals do things that are difficult and unpleasant, but they don’t feel glee and boast about it.

I have go back to what inca said about not spreading rumors about the clinic and/or vets in general as in some of the (already debunked) posts above. Anyone can post anything on a website. There are all types of crazy, lonely, attention-seeking people on the internet, and some who just don’t have filters. It never occurred to me to wonder whether my vets liked or disliked cats. I come from a family of “dog people” who dislike cats, and my cat Moxie that I rescued in law school was my first cat. The vet who treated her at the end of her life (at Matthew Ryan Hospital at the University of Pennsylvania) not only loved cats but had 2 rescue cats.

But, again, acting in a humane and SANE way does not require that you actually like cats.

[Paks]

[QUOTE=Jeito;8115383]
This ^^ And the number of people right here who seem to be missing the LEVELS of wrong of what this vet did gives me cause for concern Professionals do things that are difficult and unpleasant, but they don’t feel glee and boast about it.

I have go back to what inca said about not spreading rumors about the clinic and/or vets in general as in some of the (already debunked) posts above. Anyone can post anything on a website. There are all types of crazy, lonely, attention-seeking people on the internet, and some who just don’t have filters. It never occurred to me to wonder whether my vets liked or disliked cats. I come from a family of “dog people” who dislike cats, and my cat Moxie that I rescued in law school was my first cat. The vet who treated her at the end of her life (at Matthew Ryan Hospital at the University of Pennsylvania) not only loved cats but had 2 rescue cats.

But, again, acting in a humane and SANE way does not require that you actually like cats.[/QUOTE]

I just hope given the exchange I posted above from a veterinarian and recent graduate on what her experiences were at her school and what one person posted about the clinic they worked at the AVMA starts to look into the anti cat sentiment apparently tolerated at some vet schools.

I know I can do a good job in work that I don’t like even an above average job but I really to a great job on things I do like and enjoy. I realize now that I was naive in thinking that all vets liked cats. But then I also used to think that all vets had contact with animals when they were growing up until my local equine clinic hired a vet who didn’t any kind of pet or animal experience until he entered vet school. The book learning was obviously good but he had no feel and as a result his diagnostics were a bit off.

When my gynecologist made a rather misogynistic comment comment about women taking jobs that belong to men when I mentioned my daughter had gotten a job at a local car dealer, I dropped him like a hot potato. I guess he forgot he had a retired Naval Officer and current Electronic Engineer on his table.

I guess I shouldn’t be surprised that it was later found I had endometrial cancer. Cancer whose symptoms I had and had reported to him for three years before I left his care. I suspect if he actually liked women instead of seeing them as a means to a paycheck he might have been a little more aggressive in finding the source of my problems instead of patting me on the knee and telling me menopause would take care of it.

So given that experience I would prefer my cats see a vet who has taken the effort to join the AAFP and get their clinic certified. And when I am reading their bio I’m going to look and see if they have any cats for pets. I figure that’s the best I can do to make sure they actually like cats.

[Jeito]

None of my vets show up on that cat vet website, and I know they are excellent vets. Some of the practices that show up are places I would never take my cats.

[rcloisonne]

To me the leg hold trap is far more inhuman than an arrow to the head. I was unaware leg hold traps were still legal in the US. Is there anything more cruel than a leg hold trap? Ever see an animal chew its leg off trying to escape?

I have been aware there are vets who don’t like animals ever since I had one toss an injured budgie in a box stating, You don’t want to try to save this “thing” do you? You can get another one for ten bucks". This attitude has always baffled me. Why would someone choose veterinary medicine as a career when it is easier to get into a human med school as well as having less earning potential if one didn’t love and want to help animals?

This vet sounds like she’s in the manic phase of a bipolar condition. Whatever her thing is I hope she looks into another career.

[trubandloki]

I am confused why every vet that goes thru vet school has to love cats or there is going to be a cat apocalypse because some less than brilliant vet killed one with an arrow?

There are lots of people who do not like cats, but will very much tolerate them.

Did we miss the point that the person who did this was a large animal vet (equine I believe from what was posted here) so treating cats was not part of her job.

You are allowed to totally love one type of animal and not really like another type of animal and still be a really darn good vet.

Are we going to hate on the vets that start a cat only practice because they are not treating dogs?

The person who posted that photo with those captions is an idiot. Period. It does not mean we have to jump to extremes and decide every vet that does not scream love about cats is going to go around killing them on purpose.

[hastyreply]

It is a huge misconception that people become vets because they love animals. It is most definitely not a requirement for vet school. I worked for several vets over the years and none of them loved all animals. Some had a preference for one species or another. When I left the field and entered human medicine I was asked to recommend a vet in the town I lived in. I told them I can’t recommend any of them. I could tell you stories about each one. The ones I knew where attracted to the lifestyle and image attached to veterinary medicine. If this vet loses her license then there are a lot of vets out there who should be shaking in their boots.

[inca]

[QUOTE=Coyoteco;8115264]
On the CSU website, a some say that the clinic was aware of this and didn’t act until it became highly public and people expressed their opinions about it. A couple of people there say that one of the remaining clinic vets, Kerri Camp, laughed about the torture killing. If that is true, she, too, should be fired.

Correction: Apparently there is a post in this thread that identifies Kerri Camp as a vet in Mississippi and not with the Texas clinic.[/QUOTE]

“Some say” = people are posting an unfounded internet rumor as fact. The whole Keri Camp issue is just one example of misinformation being posted and reposted and taken as fact by people who read it. Neither Keri Camp nor the other person that is being mentioned “laughed at” the killing. This is like a game of telephone that we played as kids but with much more serious consequences. Once the owners of the clinic found out, they terminated Dr. Lindsey. Period. Random people on the internet can speculate and post incorrect information all they want but that is the fact.

[Coyoteco]

[QUOTE=Jeito;8115383]

But, again, acting in a humane and SANE way does not require that you actually like cats.[/QUOTE]

Well, there is sane and there is competent. Acting in a sane way may not necessarily require that you like cats, but being their doctor such that you are competent in their care does usually require that you like them. Perhaps this phrase of “like cats” should be explored a bit.

There is a lot of absolute hatred of cats out there. For decades it prevented the advancement of feline medicine. Read the comments about this case around the net and see the absolute hatred of cats. It’s not about “liking” and animal. It’s about the irrational hatred in the veterinary field and among lay people that is expressed against cats. On horse boards, it is all over the place. From the people who express their ultra compassionate personalities while not taking care of their cats, and laughing about their kittens whose ears have frost bite, or the otherwise sane and seemingly good person who brags about shooting 20 cats, and over and over.

I look back at even relatively recent experiences with vets and see the difference with some - not my vets. There are some cat specialist vets out there and that’s a good choice.

Many people literally hate cats and as it isn’t quite as socially acceptable to say that today as it was 20 years ago, it is still a societal prejudice that needs to be addressed. This tragic crime may afford the opportunity to do just that.

[Coyoteco]

[QUOTE=inca;8115572]
“Some say” = people are posting an unfounded internet rumor as fact. The whole Keri Camp issue is just one example of misinformation being posted and reposted and taken as fact by people who read it. Neither Keri Camp nor the other person that is being mentioned “laughed at” the killing. This is like a game of telephone that we played as kids but with much more serious consequences. Once the owners of the clinic found out, they terminated Dr. Lindsey. Period. Random people on the internet can speculate and post incorrect information all they want but that is the fact.[/QUOTE]

It is pretty clear that I edited that post within ten minutes of posting. If you knew that was a rumor out there about Kerri Camp, perhaps your addressing it in advance would have been helpful.

“Some say” = unsubstantiated statement worth investigating. It seemed that here was a good place to investigate that. Anyone who thinks that “some say” equals a statement of fact is not operating on an adult level.
eta and I specifically addressed the post about Kerri Camp to you, a person who professes to have all the facts about the case so even that criticism of my post is unfounded. No one can ask you a question about this now without being accuse of lying? Seriously?

I am now left with who is Kerri Camp and who is the “other person”?

[inca]

So it is my responsibility to address every internet rumor out there so people don’t repeat completely false information?

And go read my post #84. I clearly state that people are harassing the clinic via their Facebook page (which they have sadly had to take down) to fire Keri Camp but the problem is that Keri Camp works at a clinic in Mississippi.