just wondering as the ammonia is created when the urea in urine is broken down… which I guess “fresh” bedding could conceal… but it is there
There is no smell until you go to dig it out. You literally have to dig down past several inches of clean bedding to get to the wet pack. There should be no sign of wet bedding on top at all. Zero. Zilch. Nothing.
Once you dig it out, you reapply your anti-stink product of choice to the floor or mats, add less beautiful bedding on top, another layer of anti-stink, and then beautiful leftover bedding, then fresh bedding on top.
Most people see the management of it as time consuming and difficult. If it’s done right it doesn’t have to be. And the one horse in the barn who never has pee stains or a winter blanket that smells like pee? Mine. Because there is NO urine on top where she sleeps. Is it as pretty as a freshly made bed of minimal bedding? Nope. But it’s a whole lot more pleasant and comfortable.
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Exactly… put your face to the floor where your horse is most likely eating its hay from. Stalls can be full to the brim in fresh bedding but you can still smell the urine. If you can’t… your nose is conditioned to it just like those people whose homes you go into and you can smell the cat litter box that they can’t smell because they are around it all the time.
This ‘deep litter’ is what cow people do. My horses don’t get treated like cows.
Well, no, if it’s done right, you’re totally wrong.
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My horse eats out of a giant Tupperware (Hay Saver) because she’s a giant stall pig with hay on the floor.
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I can absolutely 100% smell other people’s stalls who use the BS minimal bedding method that leaves their horse’s standing on bare mats which is not healthy. UNLESS they are the type to strip the stall completely, sweep it out, sprinkle anti-aging product of choice and re-bed with fresh bedding every day. But, those animals are still standing in insufficiently bedded stalls no matter how pretty they look.
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I can smell other people’s horse’s blankets and they are disgusting from where they lie down. My horse’s blankets do not get that disgusting urine smell. Do they smell like horse at the end of blanket season? Yes, but they absolutely do not smell like urine or ammonia.
I about lost my mind the other week when I did my weekly dig out because I could smell something nasty. I double checked my work. I moved bedding and sprinkled extra baking soda thinking I’d missed a spot. Nope, it was her neighbour’s blanket hung near my horse’s stall door. So disgusting.
In reference to cows, do you know why they are deep bedded? Because research has actually been done that shows they stay sounder on deep litter than on minimal litter bedding. Flooring doesn’t matter. You can have them standing on the most beautiful water beds or mattresses, all manner of mats or concrete, and if they have sufficient deep bedding they will stay sound. The reverse is also true. No matter how lovely the mattress is, if there is insufficient deep bedding the cows will go lame.
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I’m not comparing to someone who doesn’t use enough bedding, that’s disgusting too.
I’m comparing to a clean stall free of all urine, and bedded deeply. I have one horse that rolls a lot and I never see urine or mats, because I use enough bedding. It’s more work, but worth it…
What is the benefit of leaving the urine in the stall? I can’t think of any that would make me change what I am doing.
I’m not asking you to change.
The benefits (previously listed above in this thread) compared to a similarly deep bed that is dug out every day are that it is cheaper, less wasteful (for those of us actually giving a crap about that sort of thing), less day to day work, makes a warmer bed in winter, makes straw a useful bedding if you care to use straw, and packs so that active horses tend not to dig down and end up with a dry pack which is an extra layer of firm cushion under the loose cushion on top.
P.S. if you have a horse who rolls a lot in its stall, check its health. Ulcers and allergies come to mind.
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I guess by rolls a lot I meant when he goes back into his stall after it’s been cleaned he’s a very active ‘roller’.
I’m not trying to offend anyone but I honestly just don’t get it. Urine is horrible to breath in so why not remove it. As far as less waste, the wet bedding is already waste, it’s not soaking anything up so it’s useless… and it would take more bedding to cover the smell than if you took it out and didn’t have a smell to cover up.
There are a lot of roads to Rome, iJump. Just because someone isn’t taking yours doesn’t mean they’re wrong.
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I don’t understand why it is so hard to understand that when done properly, there is no smell.
As Simkie says, there are many roads to Rome. After 40 years shovelling shit, I have chosen my road after much experimentation, wasted money and excess effort.
- breathe, not breath.
- nobody is breathing in urine.
- deep pack where the urine soaks down to the bottom allows the bedding to soak up more wet material. There is no waste of bedding that maybe could have soaked up more, but it’s damp so you remove it anyway.
- it takes LESS bedding to do deep litter because you allowing the bedding material to soak up the maximum wet that it can
- the bedding is deep enough that the urine sinks down to the bottom and is not at the surface. There is no using more bedding to cover up the smell because the urine all sinks down to the bottom.
I don’t care how you bed your horse, how you clean your stalls, etc. It does irk me to be told my bedding method is wrong because you can’t imagine it working. That’s the difference between imagination and many years of experience. Experience tells the true tale.
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** Breathe, my browser is handy at changing words and spelling on me.
I’m not bashing your 40 years of horse shit management. I’m curious, because from experience… I have been in barns like this, stabled near barns like this at shows and they all smell rancid. And when you looked into their stalls they were pristine, those people couldn’t smell it because they were around it everyday, for who knows how long. Maybe it was something they were feeding their horses that was causing the urine to be more potent.
And yes, there are many paths to Rome… especially when it comes to horse management.
Apologies to the OP for rerouting your topic. If my horse didn’t have sufficient bedding, I would pay enough for my horse to get enough bedding. If your stall floors don’t have mats already, are they wood? Hopefully not just concrete or crusher.
Lots of barns at shows have dirt floors. Lots of people at shows skimp on bedding even with (or especially with) mats. All that can contribute to urine soaking into the dirt, and if something like Sweet PDZ isn’t used regularly, it adds up. Those aren’t deep litter bedding systems, especially at shows. It’s not just about lots of bedding at once.
And also, yes, if horses are eating lots of alfalfa, they are drinking more water and producing more urine with a lot more ammonia waste in it
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