It used to be not that hard to cover your show office bill by getting some good results in rated hunter classes. Then you had braider and trainer expenses, which could vary a lot based on your program, grooming service, and whether it was a Thurs or Fri-Sun show or a Tues-Sun show. Two tricolors, even on different horses, and the office might be writing you a check that would have covered your pre-paid stalls. I found an old show receipt from the early 00s from a show where I didn’t even do all that well, and it was $57 for the week (stall was I think $150 or so and prepaid). The two weeks before when the horse was grand champion in my division, the office wrote me a check. And I got it right away, none of this wait months and harass the management company and hope they pay you your prize money that they wouldn’t even let you credit off of your initial bill much less pay you any excess on the spot.
Are you saying this is a show management issue and that a show should run fewer rings so your trainer doesn’t have to hold up the rings while he’s running back and forth warming people up?
I get that, but I’ve also been on the other side where my poor horse had been waiting at the ring so long for my trainer being held up by another ring that I just wanted to walk in by myself and get it done regardless of what I was paying. It’s sad the horses are the ones who really suffer in all of this greed.
Here’s a 2023 bill from Thunderbird. Granted these are CAD and I pay in USD. Please note I do 3 total jumper classes, plus a “clear round” (schooling round).
This show I did pay splits because I needed grooming. So, this is just my show bill. Add another $800 for grooming, $700 for training, and trainer splits (separate from show splits). Per week.
Interestingly, Kathy Serio just made a post on FB about how conformation classes don’t fill/no one braids anymore/the low unrecognized levels are siphoning from 3’6"+ classes. Very interesting responses, mostly from trainers. It feels like trainers and amateurs are at an impasse and I don’t know what will fix it. I just want to reply with “we can barely afford to enjoy the horses we pay for ourselves, we no longer can afford to pay for you to enjoy them too” but I don’t want to get flamed 
Here is my bill from (based on dates) the same show this year. Interesting to see some of the price increases and what a difference trainer splits make.
This is entirely valid, but when the rider has spent half the morning looking at their phone, chatting with friends, and not going anywhere near the ring to look at the course until they walk up there with the trainer after warming up, it’s not saying “show nerves” to me. This happens all the time. Also, it seems to me that if the rider’s show nerves are so bad they cannot flat the horse without their trainer holding their hand I think maybe going in and jumping around 1.10m or even higher isn’t the best idea!
Someone coming over from another ring is obviously different. I show both of mine in the same division so I am sympathetic to time issues. But if someone is just waiting for their trainer, whether or not the trainer is there yet should not have any bearing on them being able to learn the course ahead of time. It’s ridiculous.
I’d like to thank this thread and specifically your enabling for me going to Portugal next month for a few nights of dressage riding and a few nights of exploring Lisbon - indeed, with flights, cheaper than a week at a show.
You are free to judge others however you want to.
I saw that and totally agree. The whole thing is literally falling apart in front of our eyes - professional divisions and anything above the 2’9 hunters. It’s pathetic.
Thanks!
I am. If you only have 150-200 horses on the property, and say you only have maybe 8-10 trainers with “big” groups of horses, you WILL have ring conflicts. Look at somewhere like WEC or WEF, they have the entries and the amount of horses to justify running several rings. Most shows think if they run more than 2 rings, their days will be shorter, when they simply will not. I show 2-3 times a month, and the only shows we ever have conflicts are, are the smaller ones that are running 3-4 rings.
And so have I. I rarely find a trainer that’s sitting and eating lunch, and holding a ring up. It’s usually because of other ring conflicts. Now 2 winters ago someone did opt to eat their lunch and not school the last 2 ponies in the mediums, that were theirs, and again managment allowed it 
so, a managment issue.
We discussed this on the class limits thread. I knew people did some day-of scratching in the hunters but many people there thought it was completely normal and acceptable to enter multiple divisions and then scratch from all but one the day of the show and that it didn’t impact anyone at all. This is one reason why that’s not ok in the larger picture.
As to why the higher divisions don’t fill- maybe it’s the decades of telling everyone they need a $250k horse and 10 years of full training to jump 1.1m and that it’s a privilege they need to earn by paying for it? Or the fact that half the pros have never shown at that level and certainly can’t make a horse up to it? Or the fact people can’t afford to pay to have a pro show a horse for them? That last is only going to get much worse in the next couple years as people slash spending.
Can’t speak to H/J but I for sure wanted my trainer there in my dressage warm ups, eyes on the ground and all that. Could get comfortable with the trainer fee we all paid, but if there was more than one ring running, I would often get passed because I was halfway competent, and others might need her more.
This is more a trainer coordination issue than a management one. Experienced and organized trainers know the ring schedules and work with the stewards to avoid delays or empty ring time. When that doesn’t happen, it’s usually a reflection of poor planning—not a failure on the part of show management.
You give strong ‘rules don’t apply to me’ energy.
You make it sound like the show should revolve around your trainer’s lunch break or whatever nonsense is keeping them from being organized. My trainer had 10 horses going at WEC Ocala last week, with divisions running in parallel and he showed in FEI classes. He was able to make it work without holding up a ring, as did many trainers running back and forth. Rarely is it that hard.
I’m so done with the hunters in the A show world. It’s all driven by trainer wants. They want clients to pay for horses for them to show. Horse owners need to go to little local events. See how much fun it is to have a horse you can DYI. Or the eventers. They have the right idea. Get a horse YOU can ride with all the prep for the prep for the prep.
We have local shows iwth the right idea. They start with crossrails in the whole ring and go up by 3" per division. You can go canter around xrails. When you have that down with a relaxed horse, go up 3". No pressure, lots of fun, and your horse actually has fun too.
Completely agree. Characterizing and disparaging the lower level divisions as money makers that should be relegated to less prestigious shows also seems like a bad strategy, as the revenue from those divisions is subsidizing the much smaller classes at the higher levels (and the prize money those classes may offer!).
If the people who want to and are able to ride in 3’9 or 4’ hunter divisions can’t pay for the horses that do those divisions, who do they think should be paying to purchase, develop, and compete horses at this level? And if there are only a few pros left with skills and business models that allow them to own and develop horses at that level, what changes do they need to make in recognition of a changing landscape? The answers implied by that Facebook post and many of the responses seem to be that amateurs should be penalized – through limited opportunities to compete themselves – for their collective failure to fund the high performance divisions.
Yep. I don’t want to buy a horse for my trainer to ride. I want to buy a horse for me to enjoy and ride.
Why do I ride in the lowly 2’9/3 ft classes only? That’s what I can afford to do. I can’t afford the 6 figure or even upper 5 figure horse. I can only afford one horse showing- I can’t afford multiple. I can’t afford to go to multiple shows per month and I honestly do not think it’s good for any horse to do so. Not that the BNTs care. I do a max of 4 shows a year because that’s what I can afford. To be competitive in the big divisions, one would need to be showing more regularly. I just can’t.
I also can’t support a sport/division where the BNTs drug. Let’s face it, they all do it. Question that medication charge? What is in that “special juice” all your hunters get? Not enough owners/riders are asking the question.
I’m physically broken. My body can’t handle too many big jumps. It just can’t.
The shows I have access to are boring. It’s the same week in and week out. The show organizers ask for feedback but NEVER actually act on it- even things such as more shade. I only have so much vacation per year (although I think you Americans generally get less!). I cannot spend it all at a horse show!
Any way I think the biggest barrier is the cost- the horses, the shows, the boarding, the training. It’s extremely prohibitive. They need to face that it’s a rich person’s sport and the number of people with the sort of money to be participating at this level is dwindling.
Bolding mine, and I couldn’t agree more. Wow, that whole thread read as SO out of touch to me.
Showing is insanely expensive (as stated above numerous times), and I have no desire to have the legs jumped off my horse by a pro in a height division that he just plain doesn’t need to do. Why is it a client’s job to provide a horse for a pro to do pro divisions on? My horse did a full pro division his first couple years showing because it benefited his education (baby green and then 3’ greens). At that point I took over the reins to show in the 3’ and no longer pay for a full pro division because he flat out doesn’t need it, not because he can’t do it or can’t jump higher.
