Well, our modern day horses don’t really resemble the ones that evolved on the steppes of Asia anymore.
Przewalski’s horse - comfortable at -50F but not good for racing:
My horse - fast but not warm at -50F. Needs blanket and shelter:
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Hardly skinny and has plenty of hay and unfrozen water. Been 3 years since we have had -50 windchills. Horses aren’t suffering. They are used to traveling for water and shelter which is the tree line. The old horse would be so stiff if he was locked up in a corral, and didn’t have to actually walk daily to water tank. [ATTACH=JSON]{“data-align”:“none”,“data-size”:“small”,“data-attachmentid”:9961648}[/ATTACH][ATTACH=JSON]{“data-align”:“none”,“data-size”:“small”,“data-attachmentid”:9961647}[/ATTACH][ATTACH=JSON]{“data-align”:“none”,“data-size”:“small”,“data-attachmentid”:9961646}[/ATTACH]
I get all of that- mine are barefoot, and mostly rescues. However, they move around their paddocks because they want to. They do have to come over tot he trough, from their sheds. But I am not going to design their world just to make like difficult. The weather does that just fine.
Definitely. I totally get that. But this lady lived on the East coast of North Carolina, where it might get into the 20s, maybe teens but not often and not long term. But, come to find out later, of course, that the horse is standing in a paddock 24/7 without shelter and probably not free choice hay so it’s shivering when it rains. Of course it is. But that’s a whole 'nother story.
Horses are creatures of the short grass steppe. Between about 15 and 60 degrees F their heat budget is neutral. Outside that range they need some help in form of shelter, shade, wind breaks, etc. It’s common knowledge that they tolerate cold better than heat.
The above presumes no clipping or under lights horsekeeping so that they grow a normal, winter coat. If anything is done to remove what protection God/nature/whatever intended that they have then that protection must be replaced. This is true for ALL horses even though some may tolerate the extremes the normal range better than others.
One of my mares was born 1000 miles from the equator in Brazil and imported as a foal. She grows hair like a yak. The other three are all born here or first generation from them. They grow adequate coats to protect them in an East TN winter (where we can, and do, sometimes drop below zero F).
If you’ve got a wind break and water and feed available then you’re better off outside and in, because outside they can move around and generate heat. The barn may be slightly warmer but they are limited to a stall and can do nothing more than “stall walk” to stay warm. I’m not sure that’s a really good idea. Trying to “force” exercise IMO would be highly questionable. The average adult horse knows more about its present needs than it’s owner sitting in a warm house. This is one time where free feed hay is a good idea as eating and digesting hay, in and of itself, is an activity that generates heat.
My thoughts are likely valid until you get someplace where you will see long periods of deep cold. There practices will likely change to meet the demands of the specific environment.
Screaming diatribes shouting “ABUSE!” because somebody doesn’t like somebody else’s husbandry practices usually represents binary thinking and poor binary thinking at that!!!
G.
It’s fine to discuss differences of opinion in horse keeping practices, but please do so without the personal commentary/insults.
We’ve edited some comments.
Thanks,
Mod 1
Give me a break. My horses are not off of the steppes of china or off of the plains of the SW USA. They are hot house flowers of specific breeding, and they get cold in winter and hot in summer. So they wear blankets and stay part of the winter inside, and in summer they spend part of the time inside under fans. They are not bred to survive out in the elements and one actually shivers if he’s cold. There is no survival of the fitness with any horse I’ve ever owned.
At one barn, when the BO left both of my horses out in 17 degrees in sleet, a neighbor called animal control and the BO when one of my horses was shaking, not shivering, like crazy. I got to the barn from a trip before the BO and brought my horses in and rugged them up.
BTW a mare is not “like a yak.” She’s a nak or other term. Not trying to be pedantic, but don’t call a mare a yak.
No horse I have ever had desired to be out in a cold wind. In our years in MN I never blanketed, but my horses sure made use of the huge barn I was lucky to have. Several days of well below zero temps and add a wind to that? I never saw them poke their head out the big door.
Water was inside and I fed hay inside , they had no need to go out.
Exactly. All those expensive broodmares and youngsters in KY got no blankets. Check out Claiborne’s page:
LOL it’s not -20F in Kentucky very often. My horses don’t get blanketed in 34F and light snow either.
As long as your horse is healthy and capable of producing a full winter coat, they are just fine outside 24/7 with access to windbreak, food, and water.
I live in North Dakota. I have never even owned a blanket. My horses live outside 24/7, even during blizzards. They do not have any shelter to go into, but we do have natural windbreaks (tree rows) for them. We usually keep a round bale out 24/7 for them. They weather just fine.
Last winter was a doozy. We had a blizzard every week for about a month. Actually had trouble with the horses escaping the pasture by simply walking over the fences, because they were buried and the snow was so packed. They seemed to quite enjoy going “exploring”. Stinkers…
Well according to the above poster horses do just fine with round bales water and a wind break. There horses have no shelter other than a tree line. Weathered blizzards and all and did just fine no blankets either. Mine own horses use the tree line for wind break. So having them in a shelter with hay/water inside is totally unnecessary. There horses their built to be outside, not living in a shelter/ barn 24/7 because it cold windy out. Give me a break!
It’s a human thing not a horse thing to have a barn.
Well, I totally baby my guy, he loves his blankets and hates to be cold. He grows hair like a yak and has hay 24/7 but shivers around 30* F and around 60* F if its wet. He prefers to sleep in his stall with tons of shavings. He’s out 16 hours a day and gets plenty of movement playing with his herd mates, running around like a fool.
Just because they can survive like that doesn’t mean they don’t enjoy the finer comforts life can bring them.
Some horses might do “fine.” Some might not. And some treelines might be adequate windblocks, but others might not…that would also depend on climate and terrain.
In general, once you start talking about subzero windchills, you need at least a windblock for most horses. For many others you’ll need a lot more. It’s a human thing to breed horses for specialized performance events. You can’t have a horse that’s been changed over generations to race, for example and compare it to a highland pony. They are simply not the same anymore.
Not to mention - no one has suggested that horses should live in a shelter 24/7. I think most of the responses suggest that with an adequate windblock, there really isn’t a “too cold” temperature…so at minimum, you should provide them one.
I’ll go one further to say that hay and water should be reasonably near the windblock in subzero wind chill temperatures so that horses don’t have to choose adequate shelter OR adequate food & water.
We will have to disagree.
My horses put themselves in and I feed accordingly. Just because they can weather it doesn’t mean I will make them stay out when they would rather be in. I don’t have stalls and they have always come and went as they please.
When you domesticate them and take them out of their natural environment, you then have to provide for the things you took away. Food , water and a place to get out of the elements. A windbreak does nothing to stop a cold rain.
A blanket is a “human” thing but I see you use one on your horse with no problems.
Well having water near wind block is next to impossible. Being its no where near a power source, no where near the hydrant either… Running extension cords isn’t even an option. Wind block is a stand of pine trees. They have a round bale out at all times never without. They come up once a day to drink & get fed grain. There not being left hungry when bales down to not much new bale is put out. Yes they have to walk a fairly good distance to water but there is no other way. If snow gets too deep a path is plowed so horses can get to water and back to hay with ease.
I take care of my horses they are not starving and suffering,there happy and in good weight. I just don’t pamper them… [ATTACH=JSON]{“data-align”:“none”,“data-size”:“small”,“data-attachmentid”:9962827}[/ATTACH]
Whatever. You were the one who said:
My horse’s are out 24/7 no matter how cold it is.30 below zero or 50 below zero wind chills. Outside with shelter they never use in winter months
And my point was that I doubted very much that your horses “didn’t mind.” -50F wind chill is not a comfortable temperature for any horse with no shelter. The fact that they didn’t use the shelter probably had more to do with it not being where their hay was.
I rarely have temperatures below -20F, but believe me, my horses choose to stand inside when it is subzero with wind - so I feed them there.
Can horses survive in ND, etc w/ out a barn and only a tree line for a wind break - sure. Are they perfectly happy and wouldn’t prefer a barn? I have a story…
Back a few years - when I had an old shetland pony keeping a two yr old TB company in a paddock w/ free choice hay, a run-in shed and water tank. Perfect for some. It was one of those snow storms where it’s first warm and snowing/raining and then the temps plunge and the winds roar. The gate snaps freeze and gates freeze down. Lovely. It was evening and all the other horses were in the barn. Snow was knee deep and the wind cut through everything. My eye lashes were freezing up from my breath. I took pity on the baby and the pony and decided to try to bring them in. I had to chip the gate out and then, with bare hands, try to defrost the snap. It took both hands alternating to defrost the snap. Finally I got the gate open and started to halter the baby TB. The gate swings open a tiny bit. The pony - old foundered pony w/ a coat like a yak, who never did anything faster than a meander - BOLTS for the barn -leaving me trying to hang on to baby horse as we wade through drifts. Baby was good. Pony, w/ a 4 inch coat - knew where life was good and it absolutely was in the barn.
Survive yes. Not miserable… hmmm
Then give your horses what they need. Many of us don’t use your program but still ARE giving our horses what they NEED.
G.
I would like to make the distinction between “survival” and “comfort.” Sure, a dog will survive chained to a doghouse in subzero temperatures, but we all know he is going to be miserable. Same with horses. They can survive weather extremes, but are they comfortable doing so? Many are, many are not.
I pride myself on developing a working relationship with my horses, and part of that is seeing to their individual needs. Isn’t that how man and horse bonded in the first place, with us providing food, safety, and protection from predators, and in exchange they allow us to climb on their backs, stick needles into them, get into claustrophobic metal boxes and jostle down the road, jump fences, dance in place, etc. etc.?
To that end, I enjoy providing my horses with what they need to be comfortable. As I posted earlier, most of my horses have never needed to be blanketed, but now I have a TB who does. Would he survive without one? Of course, but then I’d be buying another round of ulcer meds in short order.
To each his own when it comes to horse management. I just object to people issuing definitive statements like “Horses don’t need blankets.” Perhaps that’s literally true, but some horses really do need them to live a comfortable, happy life.
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