When lunging goes awry...

[JustJump]

[QUOTE=beowulf;7848981]
I don’t think, at any point, no matter how beautiful the partnership, a person is ever fully in control of another sentient living being. JMO.[/QUOTE]

If the horse has doubts about this, the partnership is in trouble. Sometimes serious trouble.

Panicking horse in a crosstie? Just get out of the way.

Panicking bolting horse on a longe line? Dangerous and should not be happening, but letting go is not a choice that one should be contemplating, unless one had no business being out there in the first place with such a horse.

When it happens, and it does, from time to time, usually through ignorance, letting go can create a drastically dangerous situation.

[yellowbritches]

I honestly think I can count on one hand (and barely fill that) the number of times I’ve had to let go or lost the lunge line while lungeing a horse. And I’ve lunged a lot. Part of it, as others have said, is not to let it escalate. Lungeing is work, not play time, and while I don’t punish a little silliness, I am quick to shut down any down right unruliness. I think you are far more likely to lose the horse if it is a session of letting the horse act like an idiot on the end of a 30ft line.

The couple of times I’ve been forced to let go was when I was becoming dangerously close to being dragged or losing an appendage. The horse, at that point, was usually running blind and totally shut down. I do have to say that, with the exception of one case (and that horse was particularly stupid and unruly), the complete release of pressure usually rapidly de-escalated the situation.

Most times, if they get lit up, be it by a spook or just plain goofiness, I can reel them in and regroup. It might take some muscle and some tough love, but I can usually get it done.

[Madaketmomma]

Make sure that there isn’t anything in the arena-I was of the don’t let go group until I tripped over a ground pole because I was focusing on the horse who was acting up. As I was falling the lunge line ripped through my hand and 1 surgery and 6 pins later I have about 70% strength in my left hand. I will never get more than that strength or gain any more mobility in that hand.

[french_fry]

[QUOTE=JustJump;7849540]
If the horse has doubts about this, the partnership is in trouble. Sometimes serious trouble.

Panicking horse in a crosstie? Just get out of the way.

Panicking bolting horse on a longe line? Dangerous and should not be happening, but letting go is not a choice that one should be contemplating, unless one had no business being out there in the first place with such a horse.

When it happens, and it does, from time to time, usually through ignorance, letting go can create a drastically dangerous situation.[/QUOTE]

This is the silliest thing I have ever read. But I will be sure to let the extremely respected trainers I know who have occasionally had to drop the line that they have no business lunging horses, let alone riding them professionally.

Sometimes I wonder if certain COTH posters actually interact with horses out in the real world.

[kdow]

[QUOTE=JustJump;7849540]
If the horse has doubts about this, the partnership is in trouble. Sometimes serious trouble.

Panicking horse in a crosstie? Just get out of the way.

Panicking bolting horse on a longe line? Dangerous and should not be happening, but letting go is not a choice that one should be contemplating, unless one had no business being out there in the first place with such a horse.

When it happens, and it does, from time to time, usually through ignorance, letting go can create a drastically dangerous situation.[/QUOTE]

If you don’t recognize that sometimes with ANY horse and ANY skill level you might have a situation where it is “let go or be dragged” when you have a large creature on the end of a bit of rope, I question your understanding of physics.

It is not a situation you should plan for (“oh, well, if this unwise thing doesn’t work out I will just let go”) but to have it in your head to hang on no matter what is dangerous too. There is a lot of power in a horse. Even a large person can be moved by that power if the horse completely loses it’s mind and is not responding.

Like I said, better to have a loose horse with an attached lunge and an uninjured person to deal with THAT problem than a loose horse with an attached lunge and an injured person who CAN’T deal with the loose horse on account of being badly injured. Both scenarios have the horse loose, only one of them has the person able to do something about it.

[fordtraktor]

Yeah, it has only happened to me a few times in the last 25 years but when it does, there is nothing to be gained by getting drug around like someone who fell on waterskis and forgot to let go of the rope. I do my best to stay to the side and pull them around, “disengaging the hindquarters” as the cowboy types say. If you can do that in time you can stop them. Prevention is the best medicine…practicing vigilant technique, but the best laid plans very occasionally go awry, as anyone around young horses long enough knows.

If they do get away, the key is to (1) amp up the hardware on the face so that this time you have whatever power you lacked last time, and (2) put them back to work and work their bums off. If you’ve got a smaller space, go there.

[ACMEeventing]

[QUOTE=french fry;7849842]
This is the silliest thing I have ever read. But I will be sure to let the extremely respected trainers I know who have occasionally had to drop the line that they have no business lunging horses, let alone riding them professionally.

.[/QUOTE]

+1

[merrygoround]

[QUOTE=JustJump;7849540]
If the horse has doubts about this, the partnership is in trouble. Sometimes serious trouble.

Panicking horse in a crosstie? Just get out of the way.

Panicking bolting horse on a longe line? Dangerous and should not be happening, but letting go is not a choice that one should be contemplating, unless one had no business being out there in the first place with such a horse.

When it happens, and it does, from time to time, usually through ignorance, letting go can create a drastically dangerous situation.[/QUOTE]

Now she tells me! I had no idea!

[JustJump]

If you get your kicks from working with horses that you might lose control over at any given second, and would like to perpetuate the idea that this is the norm, have at it.

That’s certainly not my idea of a good time, but to each his own.

[RileysMom]

I think there is good technique and skill and then there is: stuff happens.

I have a dog–a lovely mama’s boy who comes running across a field when called, snuggles, gives high fives, plays the “find it” game (he’s so smart!), loves everyone and other dogs, doesn’t have an aggressive bone in his body, and is generally a sheer delight. We run together and he obeys verbal commands on-leash (walk, stop, wait). But two weeks ago, a squirrel crossed our path, his autonomic nervous system + instinct kicked in and he charged after the tempting animal–it was all I could do to hang on to a 60lb animal–he almost ran into the street. I was really shaken up because l really almost lost the leash.

So now take the above scenario, take away the nuanced interactions between human and animal (arguably, horses are not as intelligent as trained dogs) and increase the size and power by a factor of 20. Sometimes, the animal is too strong for a human, regardless of training, trust, and skill.

[myrna]

yup sometimes poop happens.i have done a lot of ground work with young horses.lungeing,long lineing etc. never had one like my current horse.he is only 7 and has not worked much in his life yet.mostly a pasture ornament.i really really like him.he has had some body issues that i am working thru with chiro & massage.it has been hard for him to go to the right on the lunge,sometimes he will just turn his head to the outside and be gone.i cannot hold him then.i use a cavesson or side reins and a surcingle.(been doing this for a while).if i am not watching 110% he might pull away or not for weeks at a time.it is getting better ,i like him too much to give up! i know this is part attitude and part remembered pain.

[doublesstable]

With horses I feel much of the training goal is to win… have a good ride; end on a good note etc. And with young ones mostly - end with good enough and don’t push your luck

With horses nothing is perfect… but you should always try to be prepared to win.

If you are working with a young horse on a line have your tools to help you. Gloves, possibly bit with attachment for longing; closed in round pen; longing cavison, bitting rig (like a Pessoa or side reins)

If you have trouble find someone that is more educated than you.

I have done this with one of my difficult young horses years ago. He tried dragging me around even with side reins, surcingle, etc. Called in a professional that worked it all out and was a fantastic thing to watch.

Don’t let it become a habit. It’s the worst thing we can do for a horse… don’t be afraid to call in someone else to help regardless how educated you are; everyone needs help once in a while.

[Hippolyta]

Wearing gloves increases your chance of being able to hold on to the bugger. Dad taught me that gloves for almost any job improve safety odds.

I always lunge with gloves, even if horse seems like she is having a dull day.

[doublesstable]

[QUOTE=RileysMom;7851071]

So now take the above scenario, take away the nuanced interactions between human and animal (arguably, horses are not as intelligent as trained dogs) and increase the size and power by a factor of 20. Sometimes, the animal is too strong for a human, regardless of training, trust, and skill.[/QUOTE]

If you know you are dealing with an animal that is much more powerful than you you can still be prepared and use leverage for control…

But yes; stuff still happens - go in it being prepared and bad things are less likely to happen.

The other day my horse that has been on lay up for almost a year was fresh and I needed to trot him for the vet; Vet says “do you need help?” I said “I need a groom or a chain… either one will work”. LOL

[Hippolyta]

[QUOTE=eastendjumper;7847907]
I’ll drop the whip if I need to, and hold onto Longe line with both hands, bracing my far hand in a fist on my waist near the small of my back, bend my knees, and lean back a bit. I’m very small but have never lost a horse when they’re getting really strong with this trick. Having the line go up and over the crown piece really helps get the control back.[/QUOTE]

bracing with the hip was how we were taught to keep a hold on (or move) our nutty heifers/steers when halter breaking. Works most of the time, even if you aren’t Atlas. Good tip!

ETA: no, this does not mean wrapping the line around your waist

[french_fry]

[QUOTE=Hippolyta;7851184]
Wearing gloves increases your chance of being able to hold on to the bugger. Dad taught me that gloves for almost any job improve safety odds.

I always lunge with gloves, even if horse seems like she is having a dull day.[/QUOTE]

People lunge without gloves? :eek::eek::eek:

Granted, I even wear gloves to take my well-behaved horse out to turnout, but I’m basically the only one at my barn that hasn’t gotten rope burn at some point in the past couple of years, sooooo…

[Hippolyta]

[QUOTE=french fry;7851411]
People lunge without gloves? :eek::eek::eek:

Granted, I even wear gloves to take my well-behaved horse out to turnout, but I’m basically the only one at my barn that hasn’t gotten rope burn at some point in the past couple of years, sooooo… :D[/QUOTE]

In this, we are alike. gloves, always, for just about eerything

[Phoebemoonpie]

I have a pony, Well, not exactly, she is 14.3 hh and quite substantial (Haflinger x) about 10 years old; I don’t know much at all about her life before I got her but she is practically saintly under saddle - well, a lazy saint - but when we started trying to lunge her she became a maniac. Seriously she is like a completely different animal. Recently she finally got away and now, being the smart creature that she is, she actually makes a conscious effort to get away every time. I assure you that NO amount of skill and knowledge will keep any person holding onto the line when she makes her move. Addressed by lunging her in the round pen until she submits to it and might try side reins, which we haven’t so far. Too bad this even got started because she doesn’t even need lunging to be ridden, but now it’s a “thing” and needs to be worked through.

I can’t help but find it humorous that some believe that it’s always poor handling by a trainer that allows a horse to successfully ditch them on the lunge line.

[Dune]

[QUOTE=Phoebemoonpie;7896162]
I have a pony, Well, not exactly, she is 14.3 hh and quite substantial (Haflinger x) about 10 years old; I don’t know much at all about her life before I got her but she is practically saintly under saddle - well, a lazy saint - but when we started trying to lunge her she became a maniac. Seriously she is like a completely different animal. Recently she finally got away and now, being the smart creature that she is, she actually makes a conscious effort to get away every time. I assure you that NO amount of skill and knowledge will keep any person holding onto the line when she makes her move. Addressed by lunging her in the round pen until she submits to it and might try side reins, which we haven’t so far. Too bad this even got started because she doesn’t even need lunging to be ridden, but now it’s a “thing” and needs to be worked through.

I can’t help but find it humorous that some believe that it’s always poor handling by a trainer that allows a horse to successfully ditch them on the lunge line.[/QUOTE]

RE-read your post, it was in this case poor handling that allowed the situation to occur. The first time she was “a maniac” she needed to go into the round and yes, perhaps have side reins on as well. Even you, looking back, can probably see that now. I’m in the camp of set them up to succeed. I’ve longed a LOT, a LOT of horses/ponies and I could count the times I’ve “lost one” on one hand and have fingers left over. EACH time I did, it was totally MY fault. Being caught by surprise is the human’s problem, not the horse. Hopefully I’ve learned my lesson and I don’t have any “surprises” left! It gets very dangerous to have a horse running loose with a longe line in a big training barn…

[crosscreeksh]

[QUOTE=HicksteadFan;7848875]
I would definitely not use a chiffney bit! These are extremely severe and are not meant to be used for lunging. They are a supplementary aid used with a regular halter. They shouldn’t be used as a bit while lunging or riding.[/QUOTE]

AGREED!! A chiffney is a wicked tool and not meant to be used as a bit under any circumstances!! Even at the horse sales, most people have gone to snaffle bit snapped to the halter. Chiffneys are totally unforgiving instruments of torture!!