You must admit that he makes a number of very good points. I thought his writing style was entertaining. I completely agree with him that it is very very unlikely that anyone will be pushing vegetanarianism on American after banning horse slaughter.
You also keep saying that all are killed and hauled the same way but that really isn’t true. Cows are not jammed into pig haulers routinely and they are slaughtered in a fashion designed for their species. You yourself said earlier that the kill floor had improved dramatically for cattle due to improvements made by people like Tempe Grandin.
[QUOTE=county;1871857]
Just can’t take someone serious who talks about how terrable slaughter is while stuffing his face with beef steak. They all get killed and hauled the same way.[/QUOTE]
IN myopinion, there is a big difference between cows and horses. Most cows don’t know love and caring and most trust humans. There is a difference. How many cows trust humans and are raised with love and kindness. Of course, some horses never know love and kindness but most do by someone.
I also like my steak and I totally disagree with slaughtering horses.
How many coiiws are raised with love and kindness and trust humans? Percentage wise much much more then horses. Cattle are raised and kept to help make their owners loving as a rule. Many horses are not. I see many many more cases of horse abuse and neglect then cattle.
[QUOTE=county;1872036]
How many coiiws are raised with love and kindness and trust humans? Percentage wise much much more then horses. Cattle are raised and kept to help make their owners loving as a rule. Many horses are not. I see many many more cases of horse abuse and neglect then cattle.[/QUOTE]
I don’t know where you live but cattle are not raised with love and kindness and they do not trust humans (I am sure there are some) in my area. Most “meat” cows are not around long enough to be abused (they are born, fattened up and slaughtered). I feel bad for any animal that is slaughtered but I feel the worse for horses.
I rarely see cattle raised without love and kindness, they can be abused from the minute they hit the ground same as horses but its rare they are. If they were abused instead of being raised with love and kindness there would be no money in them. Alot of peopole place horses above other livestock to me there is no one better then the other and abuse of any is as much wrong as another.
I rarely see cattle raised without love and kindness, they can be abused from the minute they hit the ground same as horses but its rare they are. If they were abused instead of being raised with love and kindness there would be no money in them. Alot of peopole place horses above other livestock to me there is no one better then the other and abuse of any is as much wrong as another.
IMO it is not a matter of love or trust. ALL animals feel pain, hunger, thirst and fear the same. Whether it is a cow, chicken, pig (very intelligent animal) or horses waiting in line smelling death and blood. I’m sure they all feel the same terror and fear.
Also, if a person is willing to bring a horse to slaughter, it makes me wonder how much love this horse knew anyway…:no:
A great deal many times no differant then any species. But not everyones defintion of love is the same. Same as many things.
Also, if your willing to bring your horse to slaughter, it makes me wonder how much love this horse knew anyway…:no:[/QUOTE]
What the hell are you talking about? When did I say I took a horse to slaughter? I would never take a horse to slaughter or any animals.
[QUOTE=county;1872305]
I rarely see cattle raised without love and kindness, they can be abused from the minute they hit the ground same as horses but its rare they are. If they were abused instead of being raised with love and kindness there would be no money in them. Alot of peopole place horses above other livestock to me there is no one better then the other and abuse of any is as much wrong as another.[/QUOTE]
You must be talking about 4-H project cattle, not ranch cattle.
The ranch cattle I’m familiar with are not tame, do not come when called, must be roped or cut from a herd to catch, must be restrained in a chute for any sort of medicating or vetting, do not get groomed and coddled every day, would not run up and plunge their nose into a halter, would not follow me around the pasture looking for attention. (And certainly could never be trained to guide the blind as horses are.)
I could never even get close enough to pet even one in my pasture. These cattle are trained to come for cattle cake. I still can’t touch them. Frankly, I don’t know how anyone ever catches a cow to steal it. Horses are much easier to steal (mine was, anyway).
Lora- I don’t think the comment was aimed at you but rather to those pro-slaughter folks that want it as an option to do so.
I watch a couple hours of a cattle herd being vaccinated. They were rounded up with cow dogs and riders on horseback. There was no ‘love’ involved- only the necessity to keep the herd healthy for a profitable return.
It’s okay to dispose of the cow horse through slaughter- wonder if they’d do the same for the cattle dog if given the ‘availability’? In my book they are one in the same…
Like I said depends on ones idea of love. Most my cows are halter broke, IMO getting up when its -35 and feeding and watering cattle is as much out of love as doing it for the horses. When I worm and vaccinate the brood mare herd there rounded up and done same as when we round up the cattle. And they also are used to make a profit but both species are done because we love them and want them healthy. Theres certainly cattle that are run through chutes etc. but I’ve been to lots of places where 100’s of horses are also. And like I said the owners of them love their livestock very much. Just because its not the same way someone else does hardly makes it less of a fact.
[QUOTE=LarkspurCO;1872796]
You must be talking about 4-H project cattle, not ranch cattle.
The ranch cattle I’m familiar with are not tame, do not come when called, must be roped or cut from a herd to catch, must be restrained in a chute for any sort of medicating or vetting, do not get groomed and coddled every day, would not run up and plunge their nose into a halter, would not follow me around the pasture looking for attention. (And certainly could never be trained to guide the blind as horses are.)
I could never even get close enough to pet even one in my pasture. These cattle are trained to come for cattle cake. I still can’t touch them. Frankly, I don’t know how anyone ever catches a cow to steal it. Horses are much easier to steal (mine was, anyway).[/QUOTE]
Well, I’ll offer a couple answers. When a rancher has a herd of 100 head or more of cattle (1,000’s) is it not practical to halter break them and the industry is set up to manage them w/ pens and allies making the need for halter broken cattle non-existant, kinda like a BLM herd. Even a gentlemen farmer w/ a herd of 30 doesn;t have a halter broken heifer or steer, though w/ work his herd might come to a pen when range cubes are offered. Heck yes chutes are used because the chute keeps the bovine and worker safe. Think “Cow Kick”- a cow can kick straight out behind or 90 degrees to either side.
In fact, slightly spooky cattle, cattle who move away from handlers easily have it better than broke to death or wild cattle. Broke to death, tame cows have to be led or prodded to move through pens. Wild cattle try to jump out or through pens. Either way, the animal has a harder time than one that moves away from people. Yesterday at work we cut 4 young bulls that were 8 months old. One was a tough cookie and would not load and instead preferred to charge the owner and another person trying to load him. With each attempt to hit a person the steer also wrenched himself into the pipe fencing. Most odd and that behavior means that steer will head to a sale ASAP as no rancher of any size can afford to keep a troublemaker on site.
Oh, and to steal cattle you locate a remote section of pasture and back your stock trailer up to the gate, open gate and block exit w/ back of trailer. Set up panals to create a pen just around the back of the trailer. Herd cows/calves/steers into that pen and them sweep them into the trailer, close trailer door. This is also how the owners move cattle from one section to another the big difference being the owners do this in the daytime and do not have to keep looking over their shoulders out of concern about being caught. 
And the owners do not cut the ear tags out of the ears. 
AQHA UPDATE ON PASSAGE OF H.R. 503
For Immediate Release
September 7, 2006
AMARILLO, TEXAS – Today the agriculture industry, and in particular the horse industry, suffered a blow when Congress passed H.R 503, the American Horse Slaughter Prevention Act 263 to 146. The American Quarter Horse Association, along with more than 200 other agriculture and equine groups known as the Horse Welfare Coalition, opposed H.R. 503.
Officials with AQHA and HWC, who were in Washington, D.C., speaking with members of Congress about the negative impact H.R. 503 would have on the industry, expressed disappointment and concern over passage of H.R. 503. AQHA and HWC opposed the bill because of its shortcomings on a number of different fronts.
H.R. 503 does not offer any solutions to the 100,000 unwanted or unusable horses that are sent to slaughter facilities each year and infringes on the rights of all horse owners. Additionally, the bill does not have any oversight measures or guidelines for equine rescue operations that are expected to absorb these horses each year. AQHA supported humane transportation and treatment laws for horses bound for slaughter.
In the end, most members of Congress found it hard to vote against this bill, which was heavily lobbied for by animal rights groups and the Humane Society of the United States. While AQHA does not favor slaughter over other end-of-life options, it does believe it should remain an option for owners.
“We appreciate the hard work of the House Agriculture Committee,” said Tim Case, AQHA Senior Manager of Public Policy. “Our industry owes much gratitude to Representatives Bob Goodlatte (R-VA 6th), who chairs the Ag Committee and Joe Barton (R-TX 6th) chair of the House Energy & Commerce Committee. These gentlemen, along with their staffs, truly have the best interest of the agriculture industry and the welfare of horses in mind. We appreciate their work.”
By passing H.R. 503, AQHA and HWC officials believe bottom-end, unemployable and unwanted animals will suffer increased neglect and place an undue burden on state and local governments. The bill now moves on to the Senate.
If the AQHA and others really feel that there are 100,000 unwanted horses and they do not favor slaughter over other end-of-life options, then why aren’t they doing something about it?
Last time I checked the AQHA budget report for last year, they had something like 80 million or so in investments. Why don’t they set up rescues in Texas and other states and give a little back like the TB community has. Of course I think it is amusing to assume 100,000 horses that are considered unwanted would all need to be euthanized when we all know from feed lot rescues that many are re-homable, perfectly usable horses! How about finding them new owners instead of killing them!
Because some people like eating horse meat and it doesn’t bother everyone that they do. Why don’t they find homes for the cattle we eat?
[QUOTE=county;1873786]
Because some people like eating horse meat and it doesn’t bother everyone that they do. Why don’t they find homes for the cattle we eat?[/QUOTE]
If someone over-seas wants to eat horsemeat, go ahead - just not our “American horses” they can kill their own horses not ours.
Actually if we want to sell them our horses we can thats totally up to the owner. What should give anyone else the right to decide if I can sell my horse to someone regardless where they live?
you sound like a skipping record!
[QUOTE=county;1873786]
Because some people like eating horse meat and it doesn’t bother everyone that they do. Why don’t they find homes for the cattle we eat?[/QUOTE]
When did we start producing horses for meat? Does the AQHA have a meat halter division?
AQHA the other red meat! I can see it on a billboard in Amarillo!
Don’t waste my time or anyone else’s with the same old sorry argument. If you or anyone else wants to eat your horse you can! Go out to your pasture shoot one of your grade brood mares and chop her up. It is perfectly legal but I think if you took a poll you would find very few people that eat horses in the USA. Therefore, we are not taking food from any ones mouth! The Europeans can still slaughter and eat their own horses.
