[QUOTE=Mara;6944502]
To further not-hijack, when did the practice of prefixing an imported Thoroughbred’s name with an asterisk end? And why?[/QUOTE]
An asterisk in front of a name implies it was imported.
For example *Forge Nimbus (was imported from the UK).
An asterisk in front of a name implies it WAS imported.
For example *Forge Nimbus (was imported from the UK).
This person is not LYING if we use the true definition of “imported”. I agree. But it is as misleading as the whole Canadian Warmblood claim that can many times be end up being a PMU draft cross. (Not that I am picking on Canada or Canadians…just sticking with the Canada thing) I would give this seller ONE chance to clarify and if he or she seems shady I would steer clear!
I think the term imported gets thrown around way too much, but whatever…
My imported Belgian mare was imported from Canada, how’s that. LOL!!
To me I do not care if the horse is imported or not. I only look at the horse as I see in my point of view. I do not care about the the horse’s breeding, too. I only look the individual horse how well he(she) behaves, moves and jumps. If anyone brags that their horse(s) is imported I just rolled my eyes! It is such a “brag” thing.
I think I will stick with “brought in from” from now on lol!!
[QUOTE=LuvLHDachshunds;6945146]
To me I do not care if the horse is imported or not. I only look at the horse as I see in my point of view. I do not care about the the horse’s breeding, too. I only look the individual horse how well he(she) behaves, moves and jumps. If anyone brags that their horse(s) is imported I just rolled my eyes! It is such a “brag” thing.[/QUOTE]
It may be a brag thing to some people, but to others its a way to make more money. I asked about the Irish thoroughbred above tongue in cheek because I am seeing it first hand with a horse I sold. I sold horsie for a reasonable price due to lack of show miles but tons of potential as what he was…a black type Thoroughbred who raced 13 times, won a decent amount, was bred by Juddmonte in Kentucky, retired sound, and was re-purposed as a jumper with great success. The “trainer” to which I sold him re-listed him one month later with $15k added to his price-tag after advertising him as an Irish Thoroughbred because he has Caro in his bloodlines. Obviously an educated buyer can look up his tattoo and find him on Juddmonte’s website, but I view this as a move to make money off of unsuspecting people by being dishonest. To some people the fact that their horse was “imported” may be worth $15k more, I just wish that sellers wouldn’t lie in order to make their horses appear to be.
I have seen it used as well for horses that were “imported” from/to Canada/US and I always thought it was a touch misleading since most people would assume the horse came from Europe (or another continent anyhow). I figured it was a way for people to make their horse look more valuable in their mind. To me it is right up there with people that advertise their Draft X as a warmblood because it is a mix of hot/cold blood and they think it will sell better with the label “warmblood” on it. They should be proud of their DraftX and sell it as such not try to be misleading.
I myself will only use the term imported if the horse did indeed come from Europe to not be misleading to potential buyers. As well as a warmblood to be of true traditional warmblood breeding (Han/Hol/KWPN/Old etc)
[QUOTE=Sabino Farm;6944749]
But it is as misleading as the whole Canadian Warmblood claim that can many times be end up being a PMU draft cross.[/QUOTE]
The same can be said of American Warmbloods! 
Regarding “Irish Thoroughbred”, I would assume it was along the same lines as “Polish Arabian” and a descriptive as to type, rather than an indication it was actually from Ireland.
I do not discuss my mare as being “imported” even though she came from the US, although if I was advertising her, I would likely list that she was US born.
[QUOTE=Stoney447;6945430]
I sold horsie for a reasonable price due to lack of show miles but tons of potential as what he was…a black type Thoroughbred who raced 13 times, won a decent amount, was bred by Juddmonte in Kentucky, retired sound, and was re-purposed as a jumper with great success. The “trainer” to which I sold him re-listed him one month later with $15k added to his price-tag after advertising him as an Irish Thoroughbred because he has Caro in his bloodlines.[/QUOTE]
:no: There are more evil people on this planet these days. Makes me sick.
im·port 1. To bring or carry in from an outside source, especially to bring in (goods or materials) from a foreign country for trade or sale.
So technically not a lie but most likely a ploy to make it seem more impressive, thus more $.
I’d prefer to see “from Canada” after the imported part, but it isn’t a lie so it wouldn’t make me upset. I would keep in mind whether or not the sellers were being forthcoming in sharing the horse’s origins or trying to maintain the vague ‘imported’ part. Just as I would be wary of someone over emphasizing the fact that the horse was imported (from anywhere), I’d be skeptical of someone who wasn’t clear about where the horse came from.
Funny, that Polish Arabian comment made me think… Polish Arabian = to me, bloodlines and probably not fresh off the boat ;)… Yet Irish/NZ Thoroughbred = quite possibly imported (but not a definite). Don’t know why that is that way in my mind…
I think I’m less concerned with the qualifier “imported” than I am with the actual bloodlines. A mare giving birth to a horse in Germany isn’t different in my mind than that same mare being purchased by an American and giving birth on U.S. soil. The foal is the same foal. A horse from Canada is still an import, although we think of imports as usually coming from Europe because the numbers show that most of them are. The European bloodlines are well represented worldwide now. I don’t know why people are so hung up on “import”. Regarding Irish TBs or English or NZ TBs, I view them coming from different breeding stock than American TBs - often bred for different purposes (i.e. steeplechase or hunting versus flat racing). In my opinion, TBs are not all the same TBs. What’s wrong with highlighting a horse’s breeding by labeling it with line qualifier such as “Irish” or "American/OTTB), regardless of where it is born? It’s up to the buyer to do homework to figure out if the horse in question is the right horse for the buyer. Just my opinion.
[QUOTE=J-Lu;6960204]
Regarding Irish TBs or English or NZ TBs, I view them coming from different breeding stock than American TBs - often bred for different purposes (i.e. steeplechase or hunting versus flat racing). In my opinion, TBs are not all the same TBs. What’s wrong with highlighting a horse’s breeding by labeling it with line qualifier such as “Irish” or "American/OTTB), regardless of where it is born? It’s up to the buyer to do homework to figure out if the horse in question is the right horse for the buyer. Just my opinion.[/QUOTE]
Sure I agree that it is definitely up to the buyer to do their homework on the horses that they are looking at purchasing. Also, in my case the trainer’s choice of advertising does not seem to be helping her sell said horse for way more than he is worth anyway.
My issue is not that she is advertising him as an Irish thoroughbred being from Irish lines but happened to be born in America. He has 1 Irish horse (Caro…who is quite popular in many American bred horses from back in the day) in his pedigree, 3 generations ago. Every other horse in his pedigree as far back as I can find is a well-bred American thoroughbred. His mare-line is very successful, but definitely American for more generations than the pedigree chart shows.
I mean, she can do whatever she wants to sell him, and good luck to her. It just makes me sad that even our well-bred American thoroughbreds are thought so little of in the sport-horse market that we will call them “Irish” or “NZ” or whatever if they have one ancestor as such, instead of highlighting their American lines as well. By diminishing the contribution of the American lines that make good sport horses we perpetuate the problem at hand, imo. All of these lines came together to make the great sport horse, not just one Irish great-grandsire.
I agree with those it’s not the “imported tag” that makes a good horse. But technically it really only means the horse has crossed a border at least once in her/his life. The reason for all the emotion is what people make of the term. It is the assumption that a horse must be particularly good because it came from somewhere else. This assumption is made in the receiving country, not the sending one. In the sending country you will find breeders ‘bragging’ about how many and where all their stock has been exported to thinking it looks good on the studfarm portfolio.
The underlying truth is that someone went to a lot of effort to locate this animal and bring it home whether it’s only a few hours across the border or across the atlantic sea.
I’ve been on both ends as my family has bred Hanoverians and our first horse that ended up being exported was born in 1980. It had sold to a jumper from the South and from there was sold on to an American who took it home when it was 9. I also buy and import Welsh Ponies from Wales to Germany on a fairly regular basis to school and use for teaching and then sell on when the right buyer comes along.
I personally find it a good idea to disclose the origin of any horse I offer for sale. It’s bits and pieces I as a buyer would want to know: Where did it come from, what has it done, what has been done with it before.
To the Welsh experts the prefix alone pretty much tells them where it came from but there aren’t only experts out there buying horses and I praise myself to provide full service incl. after sale care, plus as the breeder or trainer of the horse I have an inert interest to make sure my client buys the right horse for them and the ownership turns into a success story, not a story of failure and disappointment.
I therefor think information is a good thing so the term imported in my way of thinking is incomplete but should for the sake of information point out the country at the same time. There’s a reason why people bring horses from Canada into the States and vice versa: There are some great horses to be found in both countries.
Does the fact that a horse came from far away make it better? No. But the fact that someone spent a significant amount of time and money to take it home from god knows where and bothered to go through the paperwork-burdens with an import might very well serve as proof that they liked this animal a fair bit 
Try to look at it with less emotion and use the term as what it is, a piece of information to give to prospective buyers. Now if someone called their horse imported and it isn’t that’s a lie.
As far as Irish TB goes: If it was registered as an Irish TB it is, if it is born in the US and ‘only’ has Irish lineage it’s a TB with Irish bloodlines as far as I am concerned.
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