I’ve ridden lots of horses - lost count at 300, mainly OTTBs and other green beans/sales horses. I agree most things can be fixed with patient training, and sometimes we aren’t willing to invest the time it takes to address those issues, dismissing them as “just the way this horse is.” However, I adamantly believe some horses are mentally unstable/ill, whatever. Just like people on the spectrum - they can be wonderfully productive and talented, but have things that aren’t “normal” and just like with people, you have to try to figure out how to address it, but sometimes, there is nothing to be done, other than ear plugs, or whatever. But of those 300 horses, there were only 3-4 that I thought were truly unhinged and needed to be pasture pets or euthanized (one was charging things, including people, in the pasture).
That said, I find my horses that are noise reactive are more reactive at home to strange noises than at shows, where everything is new. So at home, if it’s normally fairly quiet and now there’s a chainsaw running in the neighbor’s yard behind the trees, that’s suspicious, but at a show, it’s all new and different, so I don’t have the weird noise spooks like I do at home. Not that they don’t react to stuff at times, but it’s not like at home. And I normally like them having to cope with things - I may not get to work on lengthening on a day they are tense due to noise, but I work on getting them to relax about the noise instead. I will use ear poms and now my new silencing bonnet for snow sliding off the roof, and I recently used it as I’m recovering from a fall that affected my hip, and didn’t think I could bear a little sideways spook, so made it easier on myself during recovery.
Thank you, I was going to say the same thing. I know a trainer who rides a lot of fancy young horses - and most are pretty sensitive and reactive. But only a few are NOISE reactive - and there is a huge difference. And there is a difference between spooky and noise reactive - I have a pony who is spooky - I got him a year ago, and he IS improving, but for him it isn’t noise, it is everything, he just totally lacks confidence. He is getting better, bu
I’ll also say - until you’ve ridden a lot of different TYPES of horses, it isn’t really accurate to make the statement “your horse can’t possibly X”.
You’ve ridden mostly OTTB, who are different (and exposed to a different life at a young age) then the typical horse. I’ll start with that point, and it is an important point.
Then - while I haven’t ridden 300 horses, I have ridden a LOT of horses, mine and others. And a lot of different breeds. And I have not found this to be true of all horses. SOME horses, yes. And my own little mare - no, it is all noises, all places. I’ve tried all kinds of “exposing and desensitizing”, and it is just who she is. And I’ve seen others who are just always going to be reactive to a specific stimuli.
This wasn’t directed at me, but my mare is noise reactive ALL THE TIME. Someone shoots off a gun, and she rips around her paddock in sheer panic. Helicopters are one of the worse - I live near a small private airstrip, and when the helicopter flies over, she looks like she’s going to drop dead of terror, I’ve seen her work herself into a foamy lather over that combination of noise and ground vibration. There is no desensitizing - I live in the country, guns go off regularly, and still terrify her. Whether on her or off, she’s scared. When I’m riding her, I can feel her heart thumping double time when there is a scary noise. But it isn’t just an “under saddle” issue. Her mother was super sensitive (to everything) too - there is a genetic component… My mare is MUCH better then her mother, but she is who she is.
Some of us ARE good riders and athletes. While I’m older then many on COTH, I’m still in decent shape, and can ride a LOT of spook and buck. To be honest, I’ve never tried ear plugs on my mare because, well, they aren’t allowed in the show ring. But I do believe - if a horse goes better in ear plugs, why are they not allowed? Especially since the noise muffling bonnets are now allowed. Personally, if it makes some horses less reactive, I think it would be better for ALL of us. And if one less person gets bucked off, it is also better for ALL of us.
And I agree, some horses need time to settle at a show - and others don’t. I know my girl very well - and slowly walking around does NOT benefit her. Her feet need to move - fast - when she’s worried. I’m far better getting on and trotting her briskly with a lot of quick, short transitions. Spooky pony, OTOH, does well with a walk and some time to mull over his current situation. Horses are different - there is no single formula for all horses.
OP - you might propose a rule change - dressage rules change all the time, and now that the ear bonnets are allowed, maybe the rule committee will be more open to the idea of ear plugs?
I think this is why ear plugs bother me. I’ve been reading this and pondering it, and trying to put into words why I am fine with them not being allowed for dressage.
If your horse can’t handle the warm-up, or being at a show, then don’t do that. As I see it, you can try to work through it, do something else, or find another horse that is happier doing what you want to do. Some horses just aren’t wired to handle that much stimulation. We’ve bred some very very hot, sensitive types who can’t cope with the world around them. The answer isn’t to make them cope with it (though we can certainly try to help them handle it better so they are less anxious in general). The answer is to find where they are happiest. That might mean more turnout, a quieter barn, not competing, different feed… but trying to force them into a round hole when they are a square peg is what bothers me.
Interesting thread! I have a 12-year old gelding who is very sensitive to certain noises - the Gator being driven down the barn aisle way, the diesel generator running when the power is out, the noise of power floating. He has been reactive to these noises since I purchased him as a 4 year old and repetition of the noise does not lessen his reaction, which is to move away from the source, if possible. He has no or little reaction to other noises, such as someone target shooting near the ring, barking dogs, doors slamming, etc. I mentioned this to my vet during the spring checkup/vaccinations visit and his opinion was that these particular noises, probably due to a combination of frequency and decibel of the noise, are physically uncomfortable to this particular horse. The vet pointed out that many humans have the same response to certain noises. Think of your reaction to the sound of fingernails on chalkboards (some people will remember this!) or the sound of the CO or smoke detector going off in your house. He said puff balls could help to lessen the discomfort while still allowing the horse to be aware of his surroundings. All the training in the world will not mitigate his reaction to these particular noises, which, thankfully, are usually not present at shows near the warm-up arena.
Yabbut, you bred a mare that was even more noise-reactive than you current ride and also you don’t want to come off… so ear plugs are the solution?
If find both arguments-- “This is the (unsuitable) horse I have, so I should get to use ear plugs,” and “I shouldn’t have to become the athlete that can match my horse’s needs but I want to show, so I should get to use ear plugs”-- pretty unconvincing. And breeding one… I just don’t get that at all.
And the people who defend their right to show a horse that they might not be skilled enough- or athletic enough (or patient enough or trainer enough) to ride at a show by getting butt-hurt and claiming that they shouldn’t have to be “perfect,”-- note that no one said the bar was that high. All you are required to do is be adequate to the horse you bought.
ETA-- I say this as someone who bred a hunter for herself as a young sprout, I interviewed both parents very carefully and placed a premium on a good mind. This horse wasn’t the fanciest, but I bred a mind that I could ride without lunging or drugs. If I can do it, you all can do it. And if you can’t ride it, admit it and buy or breed one you can. It worked for me.
Yes, absolutely. Many COTHers are quite fit/athletic/fit for the task at hand. I do not mean to imply that all aren’t.
I have a spooky horse and my trainer asked me to have his blood tested for mineral deficiencies even though he looks quite well. She was just a little concerned about his “electric” (sudden) spooks. But that is who he is, IMO. But I’m doing the test anyway because we have selenium deficient ground here. He gets better and I do work with him on it. But he’s very astute and notices any change in his environment. It’s just…him. He does fine at new places because he doesn’t know the normal from the abnormal.
A rule proposal certainly wouldn’t hurt. What have you got to lose? They say no, then ok. But atleast you tried.
Honest question. Why would you breed a horse like this and perpetuate this trait, especially if it is a negative trait in the chosen sport you’d like to do (competitive dressage?)
I realize it is a tangent but since it came up - Not athletic is not the same as saying out of shape/no fitness.
I know it is hard for those of you who are athletic to believe but some of us were born with two left feet (not literally, using that old saying). No amount of money spent with the best trainer there is can fix this… It is not a matter of just being more fit. (I am not saying being fit is a bad thing, just saying it is not the same thing.)
Funny how people assume that those who can’t only can’t because they are not trying hard enough.
Well, because sometimes it IS the truth. Sometimes.
But like I said in my earlier post, sometimes fitness is irrelevant and usually it’s my lack of coordination or reaction time when/if something happens :winkgrin:
I also see a lot of truly unfit riders, but perhaps that is common in the more “leisure rider” community? Or just pure chance.
And that’s why I say those who can’t are not being taught properly. Now, fear issues are a totally different story - and that’s when the question should be if it’s the right horse, for a horse who is a problem in this way. Different story. Fear may or may not be rational, but it’s not something you can train into submission - though at times it comes from lack of skills, and learning skills can get you there.
Anyway, I’m one of the least athletic people I know. VERY unathletic. Add to that I have exercise induced asthma, allergies, I’m short and round, when I learned this I had a left leg which barely functioned and nerve damage on my left side, a horse who is too big for me, and I basically have everything stacked against me physically. I have a horse who is world class athletic. (Not a world class dressage mover - more an eventing type, but mentally dressage is better for him.) He BUCKS. He does not have to get his head down to do so, and while he gives an overall tension warning, the doesn’t have to bunch muscles up more and prep for his favorite move. He uses that galloping over advanced cross country experience to without warning leap into the air - and all four legs stay straight, with all four hooves approximately 3’ above the ground. He lands front hooves first, plants those hooves, and lets the momentum kick his heels up over his head. In turnout, it looks like he might flip a$$ over teakettle. Apparently he has done that with me multiple times. It actually doesn’t feel as big from the saddle. But anyway - I’m super unathletic, and so it took a LOT of time to learn it. But I learned to ride through that crap. I was taking 6-8 lessons/week on as many horses as I could find, and any time I got on and my horse felt explosive my trainer rode him instead. But he taught me to handle it. I do NOT believe that any other individual who is typically abled is unable to learn these things. If they are not afraid to and are trying, I just believe they are not being taught by the correct person. I do think these are things rarely taught, and not easy to teach - but if I can learn it, anyone can. Choosing not to? That’s totally acceptable. My sanity is questionable that I chose to stick it out and become a bucking specialist. It was certainly never something I sought out.
I don’t think you read my entire post - I have never used ear plugs on my mare. I’m just pointing out (in response to some who don’t seem to understand there is a difference between noise sensitive and sensitive) that some horses are noise sensitive. And it is different then plain ol’ sensitive. Or spooky.
Not sure what you mean by “more noise-reactive then you current ride” - if you mean more sensitive then her mother, I said the opposite, she is much better then her mother, who is a mare of international bloodlines.
And that the comment “become more of an athlete” isn’t necessarily relevant.
Read my post for comprehension or don’t comment on it.
Because the dam is from internationally competitive bloodlines - known for talent - and sensitivity. Because she already had one fabulous foal before I bought her. Because I bred her several times and only ONCE got a super sensitive baby and got a lot of really easy, wonderful riding horses - by picking my stallions based on their excellent temperment. I kept the super sensitive one. I had many reasons to breed the mare, and did a lot of research on her bloodlines;)
Man, I really wonder about some of you the way you put shame and blame on a rider because they have problems that you don’t. Yeesh. And some people wonder why dressage riders have the reputation as being hoity-toity. :lol: News flash, a running martingale is no where near the same as ear poms. And the poms lessen the noise, they don’t make a horse deaf. Have none of you ever worn ear plugs? I can talk to my co-worker while standing next to the paving machine. If we weren’t wearing plugs we A) couldn’t hear a dang thing because the machine is so loud, B) would ruin our hearing for life, and C) wouldn’t be able to talk to each other.
I had a horse that was noise reactive at the beginning of his training. We did not use poms on him, he got better the more I rode so by the time I was ready to show he was a steady-eddie. A friend had a horse that never got better. He was boarded at the trainers from the time she got him until she retired him (about 15 years later). He was a wonderful AA hunter and he used poms at every show.
I don’t think poms are any different an aid then specialty shoes.
Here’s my take on it - I ride a very sensitive, spooky TB/Hanoverian cross. We did some local schooling shows our first couple of years together, until I realized how much they stressed him out. I finally decided it wasn’t worth it. I also realized the trainer we were working with wasn’t a good fit for us. (He was getting more tense and spookier as time went on.)
Switched barns and trainers and although we had to start over, two years later we are making slow but steady progress. He has finally learned to relax and he’s actually starting to stretch into contact. And while he’s still spooky - it’s not nearly the issue it once was. First - we now have connection and second we’re both more relaxed and I’ve learned to roll with it . . . I’ve also added jumper blinkers to his bridle - legal - no, does it help him concentrate, yes. Does it help him worry less? Yes. Does he still spook? Yes, but not nearly as often. It makes our rides more productive and it makes him more comfortable. If he was noise sensitive I wouldn’t hesitate to use poms - life’s too short not to enjoy riding my best buddy, no matter how quirky he is.
You misread me. I did comprehend your post. You were the one how said the dam of your horse was more noise-sensitive than her daughter. I did not say you had used ear plugs.
But if you think I am an unfair or stupid reader, I’ll take that and I’ll refrain from commenting on your posts in future.
FWIW, I never said anyone was a bad athlete… or great or anything else. Rather, when those folks said they ought to allowed to use ear plugs because of some less-than-up-to-it version of athlete (and you can read their words yourself), I was taking them at face value. So the accusation didn’t come from me.
Exactly, my mare is for sure not deaf with her poms in, but she is a lot happier.
Funny I’m a Western Dressage rider, in Canada, and our national rules don’t allow a nose band, I wonder how many people who say puffs change the playing field think about all the choices that are allowed with bits, bridles and nose bands these days, why so many choices, because horses are individuals and go better in different choices. My mare likes a double joint rather than a single, and I get to choose.
Shoeing is a good comparison, you can shoe, go barefoot, shoe, shoe remedially, shoe for performance…I guess there are rules covering it, but you can choose.
Somehow the riders of “internationally competitive” horses have figured out a way, without earplugs, to get their horses to stop being reactive in stadiums with PA systems, applauding audiences, music playing, and all kinds of other things, so I would still think this would invalidate the notion that horses are just noise sensitive and there’s nothing you can do about it. The allowing of the soundless bonnets at FEI is relatively new. Prior to that people had to figure it out.
My Exploding Pony was reactive to everything. And I mean everything. It got better over the years but he was never, ever reliable, either at home or away from home. I never rode him in anything other than a snaffle bridle with a flash and a regular old dressage saddle. It never went away.
I have a mare who is an absolute packer (unfortunately not so sound, sigh). I did not magically become a brilliant rider between the two horses. Perhaps I was a bit better, but I assure you I did not make her so much easier and less dramatic by improving my skill set a thousand times over in a couple of years.
Right now I am riding two horses - my AQHA who is very easy but has huge separation anxiety and personal space issues. I’ve all but given up taking him to shows because he is quite unhappy and try as I might, I can’t get him to stop melting down in the warm-up. It tends to get worse, not better the more we go and do.
My GRP is a very well trained schoolmaster who is noise sensitive. I adore him, except when he suddenly bolts with me because rain starting pounding on the roof. So after about a dozen really awful rides this December one of my trainers suggested putting a noise canceling bonnet on him during windy, stormy times. It changed everything. I don’t use it all the time, but I do when it’s likely to be loud. He is much, much more confident. Which makes me much, much more confident.
I don’t think it’s a bad thing to make us both more confident and safer. I’m assuming that I’ll use it less and less as time goes on but my personal belief is that every positive ride improves partnership.
I think that if a dressage horse doesn’t progress from being so spooked by noise, that it must be ridden in noise buffering gear to compete, then it needs a different job. Not all horses, however well bred they may be, are suited for the competition arena.
So many problems are caused by trying to adapt the horse to our expectations rather than adjusting our expectations (realistically) to the horse.
