Three years ago I had a severe, career and riding ending spine injury and I ended up selling the Ironman colt out of my BWP mare since I couldn’t ride. In this process I realized I really liked breeding and especially seeing how well the baby progressed. I am desperate for a way to stay involved in horses. We have a farm, great vets… Just hoping some of you experienced breeders can give me some tips on the breeding business, things you learned the hard way, etc. thanks!
It is definitely rewarding, but not a “money maker” and not for the faint of heart
I am a novice “breeder” myself as I can no longer ride. I am so glad you started this thread. Wishing you much success!
Have a plan for what you want to produce, and when/how you will market your offspring. What will you do if you want to breed hunter/jumpers and you get a dressage foal?
Have a plan for what you’ll do if something goes horribly wrong with a mare, a foal, a young horse. Will you insure everything, euthanize, pay out of pocket? Better to have thought about this before you get the “$3000 phone call”!
Even with a great vet, P&E can save you tremendously on ultrasound bills. http://www.equine-reproduction.com and their facebook group provide a wealth of breeding information.
Thanks a lot Anne and Rosebud, and good luck to you too Zuri! I realized that I made little to no money on my Ironman colt, but I truly take blame on that, I kept him till he was very nearly four waiting for a miracle with my back and then came to the stark realization that I had a horse that was two weeks from being four and wasn’t started, so I was way more negotiable on price with more invested in him than if I sold him as a youngster. Luckily he is making incredible progress with a fabulous owner and she is kind enough to keep in touch and post updates to FB… I realized it is pretty cool to see a fab horse and know I bred him… But at the same time I am unable to work in my profession and can’t go into something to lose money in the long run either…
One thing to consider is training costs of the offspring. Are you able to handle foals/ weanlings/yearlings or does your injury prevent that as well? If you can’t make sure you have really good farm/ barn help that is consistently reliable.
If you end up not selling offspring until they are at age to get saddle broke do you have access to a good young horse trainer in the discipline you are breeding? For example, where I am I have access to some fantastic young horse trainers. However, if I lived in North Dakota the story would be quite different.
Are you in an area that is easy to sell foals/ horses? Again, if you live in a very isolated area you may have to send your horses off the get broke and sold.
All things to consider!
One question Anne, if you don’t mind, is do you generally start marketing your horses as foals and increase price as age and training increase or do you wait to try and sell until they are older? I have heard that H/J folks generally prefer to buy when the horse is ready to start work. (Also, not to scare y’all, I am putting serious thought into this and have an appointment to meet with an experienced WB breeder next month) I have no interest in being a backyard breeder of junk, only top class WB’s, even if it is one a year.
Thanks Blume Farm! My husband is great at helping me, he got my Ironman colt leading, standing for farrier, loading, etc. My injury definitely makes me more cautious though…I would never try and ride…my Ironman colt was SO quiet and laid back I was ok working with him in short bursts of time (my biggest limitation is being unable to sit, stand or walk for long without excruciating pain later), but you are right, if I ended up with a hot baby I wouldn’t dare go near it…and I would have to pay someone even to show at inspections…and start under saddle if it wasn’t sold as a youngster. I am about an hour from Aiken, SC…good location.
The no money making comment above is errant. The not for the faint of heart comment is accurate.
To make money breeding , you must start with the best mare and breed for what the market wants.
I think if you are going into breeding, it has to be something you have very strong feelings about and you are willing to put more in it than you get out of it, at least initially. It is something that most breeders do because they love it and feel compelled to continue onward with their breeding plans because they believe in what they are doing, not because of the money making opportunities.
PennyG
[QUOTE=Bayhawk;7503290]
The no money making comment above is errant. The not for the faint of heart comment is accurate.
To make money breeding , you must start with the best mare and breed for what the market wants.[/QUOTE]
Yes, that is true but not always how it happens. Can you be an actor and makes millions of $$? Sure, but there are plenty of starving, very talented actors.
It is a combination of starting with good stock, making good breeding decisions, good stock management, and a WHOLE LOTTA LUCK. Luck that your mare is an easy breeder, luck that the breeding produces a healthy offspring, luck that the foal does not have an injury. Then if you are really trying to make it to the top…a WHOLE LOTTA MONEY to put your offspring in training with a top trainer/ rider, to pay for show entries, to pay for travel, etc.
So IMHO, the majority of folks do not make a living with a breeding business, especially since you will have to “farm out” a lot of the work of handling and training to others. And you would need a fairly big operation, not just a mare or two. I am sure not impossible, but not as easy as “I have three SPS mares from good lines, I am going to breed three foals a year and sell each one for $25K”.
Keep speaking with many breeders such as Marydell Farm, Home Again Farm, Rolling Stone Farm and get a good sense of the economics. Remember, a lot of big name breeders started out with a whole lotta money…Iron Spring Farm, Hilltop Farm, Harmony Sport Horses, etc…they didn’t make it with the horses.
And yes, Aiken is a good location!
Thanks everyone, and I do understand the points everyone is trying to make. I apologize for not being more clear on my intent as well, I have no delusions of getting rich or even earning much money at all. I get that an injury that precludes employment as a psychologist wouldn’t lend itself to earning a living breeding and selling horses, which is obviously much more labor intensive, especially at the scale it would take to earn any sort of living. My goal is more to breed one, maybe two quality horses a year to give me a project, to have some sense of doing something meaningful with the animals I love… My land, barn, truck, trailer, etc is not fancy but it is paid for… I think it is difficult and a lot of very hard work for anyone in the best health, in the best circumstances to earn a living in horses and I definitely don’t count myself among them.
I forgot to thank your all for taking the time to write such thought provoking responses. I really appreciate it!!!
Whatever you decide I wish you good journey. I always thought that when I could no longer ride I would learn to drive. I have a few friends that drive that I could work with…looks like fun.
Breeding a foal is not a lot of work. Raising a foal can be physically exhausting if there are ‘any’ problems. Something to keep in mind.
Lots of good advice here. As someone who started breeding when (I thought) my riding days were over, I can understand the appeal. I’ve been breeding now for 17 yrs.
My situation was abit odd because I ended up breeding FOR the horses I had. In other words, I didn’t set out saying , “I’m going to breed for X discipline.”
Instead, I had a nice Akhal Teke mare who I bought (supposedly) as a PB, but later breed politics had her (and many other Tekes in America) being deemed “non-pure.” This really effected the value of her foals in the Teke market.
However she gave me a stunning cremello colt (Kinor) who was sold (supposedly as a gelding). He came back to me as an entire, rambunctious 2 yr old stallion! But he was a lovely, strong, powerful mover (just finished his Flickr set…so can’t help but sharehttps://www.flickr.com/photos/99704127@N03/sets/72157642612886415/ ) For those of you interested in Teke crosses, take a look at the Sets for Cisco Rose, Kadima, Alborada and Kioyote Moon…all sired by Kinor o/o various breeds of mares.
The Akhal Teke is an “all-around” breed, but most known for endurance. I found that crossing Kinor w/good quality chestnut Arab mares (for that guaranteed palomino!) produced lovely foals who sold quickly to endurance riders. Since most of the mares I had were leases, my costs were minimal, so I actually made a profit most of the time!
I did not earn a living doing this, but overall it paid for itself. Very rewarding as well because 95% of the folks who bought Kinor babies still have them and the best of the group are just now starting their endurance careers.
Sadly, I lost my sweet boy when he was only 9 due to a terrible pasture accident.
My other breeding “adventure” has been with warmbloods bred for dressage.
I started that because I was an admirer of dressage (fell in love w/Rembrandt) and happened to have the opportunity to purchase a young Batido/E-line mare for very, VERY little because she was no longer sound to ride (kicked through a barn door) and had behavior issues. People were afraid of her.
But that was learned behavior…she was orphaned…and nothing I couldn’t handle. She was my foundation mare and gave me 2 breeding daughters. THOSE daughters (by Rubino Bellsimo & Weltmeyer) have given me daughters as well…mares better than their dams. The Weltmeyer mare in particular has been a great producer. She has had 4 filly foals o/o 4 different stallions (including Kinor…that was my only “oops” breeding in 17 yrs!) and all the WB fillies have been inspection winners & ranked in the Top Ten of the US for their registry. I am retaining the most recent filly for the future.
So you CAN do it “on the cheap” and 1 foal at a time. I’m living proof of that. But to do that you need to have a good eye for the bargain broodie (and lots of those around these days), what the discipline needs for a good match, and the willingness to do everything you can without alot of vet work, etc.
If you have more resources, you can go about it in a more organized way…by saying “ok, I want to breed jumpers.” Obviously put some work into knowing your bloodlines (LOTS of work on that…breeders need to have indepth knowledge of pedigrees…start your reading now), etc.
Then start looking for good broodies…keep in mind marketable pedigrees unless you plan to keep all the foals till they are grown and show them yourself.
BTW, this is (in general) NOT a good plan unless you have a family member who can do the riding/training. I am not capable of that myself, and so I really try to sell my stock as foals. You CAN make $$ that way…keeping them till mature is usually a losing proposition unless you have lots of land (grow your own hay, for example) and a “free” trainer.
Even then, you might end up spending large amounts of vet bills or lose the horse entirely when it’s 2.5yrs old. It happens.
Keep in mind stuff like foaling out the mare & handling the foal so it grows up to be a good horsie citizen…this takes knowledge and some physical ability (unless you hire someone else, then that just adds to the expenses).
Much of my breeding life I’ve had severe arthritis and have had 2 hip replacements. Until last spring I was walking with a cane for much of the time. But because of my early years working with racing TBs & polo ponies, I was still pretty handy with the stock…used my cane as a tool.
Have a great farrier that helped with the hoof stuff…most of my babies have turned out well, manner wise. But you need to be prepared to do that. Personally, I LOVE working with the babies…it’s my favorite part.
Be ready to be good at getting (good) pics & video of your stock, because you will need to market them. Get websites, FB pages, all that stuff I am no good at…but you really SHOULD have. You’d be surprised how much work all this is…
And be prepared for heartbreak…sometimes ALOT of it. I would advise you to read so many of the posts on this board regarding this topic. you can have mild heartbreak (ie spending $15K on vet bills in one year and getting no pregnancies…and don’t think that doesn’t happen…it does), moderate heartbreak (lose the pregnancy some time before due date), severe heartbreak (foal is born dead or dies shortly thereafter) or the kind that just tears you apart (horrid dystocia and you lose mare AND foal).
All this stuff can occur. No one is exempt. I have been very lucky in that I have never lost a mare, but have lost several foals. After all that time and effort and $$, it never gets easier to deal with.
So be prepared for that. You can do EVERYTHING right and this can still happen. If you have “livestock” you can have “deadstock.”
One of my worst stories from the breeding trenches is when I bred my foundation mare to Wolkenstein II (via frozen). She conceived TRIPLETS from one dose! Successfully pinched 2. Uneventful pregnancy. She goes into labor…the foal (a filly) was breech. Foal dies within minutes of being born. HUGE vet bill as well ('cause she was called out in the middle of the night).
Actually, I was lucky I didn’t lose the mare, but even so…and I have no doubt my story is no where near the worst in the breeding world.
So be prepared…
It can be a grand adventure and very addictive, but it truly is not for the faint of heart OR the faint of pockebook…
Start with the best mare you can possibly afford, with a proven performance record in her pedigree, and marketable bloodlines for your discipline of choice.
If it is an older mare, make sure she is still breeding sound and doesn’t have a history of pregnancy complications. Good luck! I only produce 2-3 foals per year, and it is still a full time job for me.
Thank you Kyzteke! I will be doing a lot of thinking. You all are right about it not being for the faint of heart!
Will you breed your mare to Ironman again?
I definitely will do that cross again, he turned out fabulous, with the best disposition! I had a huge response when I (finally) posted him for sale, I even got a message from an Olympian’s farm but he was already sold. With my limitations disposition is very important to me so I kind of see that as the niche I am aiming for - what I bred that horse for - fancy H/J with an children’s / adult am disposition.
I breed only 1-3 foals a year and manage to make a profit. I own my own farm/barn and do most of the handing etc myself.
I know it’s been said at least once already, but no harm in underlining it once more! 
HAVE A PLAN. Know what is selling well, what bloodlines, type, discipline etc. Preferably pick a discipline that buys foals or youngsters. Selling the youngsters as foals helps keep the numbers as low as possible and the risk is minimised (the longer the horse stays with you, the greater the chance of something happening to it - it is a horse after all!).
Talk to and learn from the breeders that are already successful. Watch what crosses they use, bloodlines, etc. Ask them what improvements they’re striving for, what their breeding plan looks like going forward.
BREED THE BEST. Start with the absolute best mare/s you can find/afford. Do not be swayed into taking on any old thing because it is cheap/available/belongs to a friend etc. Hold out for a very good mare. Also, look toward improving your broodmare band. Keep an excellent daughter. Sell on your mediocre mares or the ones that are not producing better than themselves.
Choose the best stallion you can afford. Choose stallions that are well known with sought after foals/youngsters.
MARKET WELL. Invest some time in having a good website or blog and keep it all regularly updated. Take excellent pictures and get video where ever possible. Use a professional if your camera skills are not good enough!
Best of luck! Overall it is a fun and rewarding experience.
