Advice for bringing along the young hunt horse

[GrayMare]

I have a green horse (overall green as well as green to hunting) that I have just started hunting this season (alternating second and third field). She’s going splendidly so far, but starting to develop a bit of anticipation (mostly being distracted and not listening well to the rider) for the first part of the hunt when she thinks we are about to set off on a run. She also pulls a bit when we do first get going–and it isn’t so much the pulling that bothers me as that I feel like she’s ignoring me.

She hasn’t actually done anything bad or out of control, it’s more that I feel like if she did it would be hard to correct her, or that if I did need to pull up suddenly for some unusual reason it would be difficult. Does that make sense? She stops just fine when the other horses stop, and stands nicely at checks at any point during the hunt, her “issue” is more when we first get going. After we’ve been going a bit, she settles perfectly and has the feel of a responsive and well mannered hunt horse.

I’m curious about other people’s programs for starting young hunt horses. Perhaps she needs to step back a bit from hunting and spend a bit more time back in the ring and on normal trail rides? Perhaps step back and try to keep her in third field more often? (There isn’t always a third field available.) I don’t want her to get more and more anticipatory about hunting. And I don’t like that feeling where she has tuned me out, I want to get her mind just a bit more back on her rider. Is it better just to keep hunting and expect that she will get more relaxed with more experience?

FWIW, the mare is overall doing quite well and has earned compliments from the master. However, I’m hoping for her to be my hunt horse for years to come and I’m looking for ideas to make sure I stay on a good path with her training and development.

I’d love to hear some thoughts, ideas, and suggestions from those more experienced than I at teaching young horses their job in the hunt field.

[xeroxchick]

Age? Breed/type? This can make a difference in the approach one takes.

[lesson_junkie]

Here are a few not very original ideas…I make a priority of keeping up with my regular riding lesson while I ask my green horse to learn to hunt. The foundation that teaches a horse to be obedient in the field is built in the arena.

I look for every chance I can to get my horse out in the woods with a quiet group. I make it clear my horse is green and I have no interest in galloping through the woods like bandits. Quiet trot and canter sets teach your horse to be calm at all gaits, but no flying around, pulling and unbalanced.

When out hunting, I will bring my very green horse in early, while things are going our way. That way I don’t have to try to school on a tired, frustrated, confused horse, and the day stays positive.

And-Rome wasn’t built in a day. Stay patient.

Like I said, nothing you don’t already know, but sometimes it helps to know you aren’t alone. Good luck!

[Huntin_Pony]

GrayMare -

Congrats on your horse doing so well!

For me, it’s a balancing act of sorts between wanting my horse to listen to me and wanting my horse to know its job. For starters, I have (only) two rules for mine: 1) you gallop with your head up 2) you don’t pass the horse in front of you unless I tell you to.

Once I have those two rules firmly ingrained, I try to give my horses as much autonomy as I can. I find that they (as you said) watch the horses ahead and watch the terrain and adjust themselves without much intervention by me.

Now I will say that there are times when I am tempted to pull or to try for a half halt for reasons of my own and it’s nice when they go through, but in actuality the horses usually stay safe and sane without much “help.”

So you will have to assess your horse and yourself and see how much autonomy is too much for you to tolerate and how much your horse has earned. This, for me, is one of the delights of bringing along a hunt horse. In general, they learn the game readily and continue to improve for several seasons.

Again, for me the aim is a horse that can take care of itself and me too.

Have fun!!

[GrayMare]

Xeroxchick, she is a 4yo Irish/WB cross. I debated about getting her out hunting this year due to her age, but thanks to a series of events it was either hunt her or sit at home. I do worry that even though she has been overall so good that I need to be careful not to overdo things for physical reasons as well as training reasons. I’m open to opinions on how much one should hunt a four year old to begin with.

Huntin’ Pony, thank you for the advice. I think you are probably right that when she is distracted I shouldn’t pick at/ fight with her, but rather focus on the main points. My instinct is to pick, I’m just trying to get her attention. But, perhaps she’s trying to do the right thing by having her brain focused on safely traversing unfamiliar terrain. I hadn’t thought of it that way before.

Lesson junkie, yes, I think I might need to alternate weeks of hunting with weeks of ring work and hacks. I ride h/j primarily, and have not had a trainer involved with this mare at all. But I think she is at the point where maybe she ought to do some lessons with her with my H/J trainer–some more focused flatwork and some little cavaletti/ gymnastics might be just the thing to get her focus and attention back where I want it. She’s only four, so lessoning and hunting in one week might be too intense of a schedule for her, I think I would need to break it up a bit. Getting other people together for controlled trail rides is a bit tricky this time of year when everyone is either working during the week or hunting on the weekend, but it probably is an effort that I need to make.

I just want to make sure that my mare gets better and better with each successive hunt, and not more and more anticipatory. Is there any secret to make sure your horse gets more confident and relaxed with each hunt rather than more distracted as they learn how exciting it can be?

[Huntin_Pony]

The biggest “secret” ingredient is TIME.

I will admit that I “review” the progress in my mind after each day out, but unless there’s an obvious issue, it’s just to take note and add that experience to the trend of my horse’s performance.

All the days are different - weather changes, sport changes, other horses’ behavior changes, terrain changes, etcetera . . . I try to keep this in mind and take note (but seldom take action) so that I can build my understanding of what is easy for my horse and what is difficult.

I feel like the more I know about the horse’s strengths and weaknesses for the job the better I can focus my training both at home and in the hunt field. I have not started one as young as four, but if so I would definitely stay in the slower fields until the horse was relaxed and confident.

Again, have fun!! Your horse and your approach both sound GREAT!

[GrayMare]

SLW, might you be willing to share an exercise or two?

[Benson]

I second the “come in while everything is going well” advice.

[jawa]

I would add being willing to drop back to 3rd or go in if your horse gets TOO excited by a run. It is not the time that you will want to, but it can be helpful to cut out the excitement if it is too much.

I like to get to the meet early enough to walk, trot, canter with half halts both directions before the meet starts. I feel that this helps me to know the attitude of my horse prior to moving off with the group and gives me an opportunity to “school” the correct response.

4 is young, but maybe hunting multiple days a week (one day in 3rd and one in another field) for several weeks will take the excitement away.

I have found taking a horse back to a slower flight mid hunt can help with the excitability. This was very helpful with my older pony who was a pocket rocket. I moved him from 1st to 3rd field multiple times a hunt and even went in early mid run if he wasn’t listening. It took a while, but it did make a difference. He finally learned that you only get to stay at the party if you keep your wits about you.

I also agree with the advice to not nit pick. It is so easy to be in your horse’s mouth when they are really doing a perfectly acceptable job hunting.

Happy Hunting!

[GrayMare]

Jawa, I never have “warmed up” pre-hunt before and I think that is a great idea. That would give me a chance to get into her head a little before we are out in the hunt field where you can’t often pause and make corrections. I also like the idea of switching fields mid hunt, because this mare is smart as a pony and I do think she will (like your pony) quickly realize that she can only party if she can keep her wits together.

I have been trying to go third field as much as one is available, and as much as the junior riders I ride with will allow me Yes, I do think she needs to step back and do third field only for a period of time here. It’s good for me to hear it from fellow fox hunters.

As far as going in early, I think this would be a good thing for many horses. For this particular one, she is calm and satisfied with herself after the first run and seems to be in a mental zone where she is interestedly absorbing the proceedings. She doesn’t get tired and “fried” or fussy the way some horses do. She gets tired in a good way, if that makes sense. However, I’m going to file this advice away because things are always changing with young horses and I could see having a day where this would be the right thing to do.

[jawa]

SLW,

I think these are great exercises…not just for the horse, but also for the rider. I think many times we as riders get SOOOO caught up in the excitement that we are “yelling” at our horses the entire ride, or picking at our horses when they aren’t doing anything wrong. These exercises teach the horse and rider that we can respond to each other quietly.

[Huntin_Pony]

SLW and jawa -

I couldn’t agree more. MY Connemaras respond really well to this approach also.

And SLW, very well described.

[gumtree]

I only work with TBs. Not all have the temperament for hunting but neither do other breeds. I pretty much always start with hound walking to ascertain if they are going to be worth the effort.

We have the benefit of a large property to work with. I don’t spend a lot of time in our ring with them. In my mind and experience it has limited value when it comes to hunting. I just haven’t found that a lot of “ring environment” translates well to being out and about. To each their own on this. Mainly use it to hone their jumping skills but even then the majority of their schooling is done out and about. Checking, standing, starting off, learning to respect what is being asked is done in the wide open spaces and our woods.

We have lots of mixed types of jumps of the kind that would be encountered on any given day out with the hounds. We also have the benefit of riding around the neighborhood and or trailering to a friend’s farm to mix things up. Our horses have to be comfortable with stream/river crossing, muddy, boggy areas and some “ditch” experience.

In the end if the horse has the mind/temperament and athletic qualities we are looking for it becomes a matter of putting “miles” on them. As much as possible. Putting up with the drawbacks until they learn and become comfortable with the drill.

IMO you “play the game” you have under you when out hunting. IMO it’s not a time to for a lot of “lessons”, schooling. I think there is too much going on for the horse to really learn anything and may make things worse. Plus it is a bit annoying to others out with you.

I think it is best to buddy up with a few friends on seasoned horse if they will put up with yours. I keep to the back of the field I am riding with. Pick my spots carefully when pulling up at check. Newbies by nature are going to run a bit. Most are not going to stop on a dime. So I always make sure I am in a position to circle when pulling up suddenly.

We encounter a lot of woods and tricky terrain so circling is not an option. So I try and have a plan with others that won’t mind me sticking my horse between them. That doesn’t always work out but by and large. If I have to mix it up with others the members are pretty understanding. Plus offering up apologies never hurts. If the horse is being a bit of a butt head on the day I call it a day. It’s the ones that don’t know when to call it a day. Constantly trying to use the day as a schooling session is what annoys others IMO.

To each their own on these things.

[jetjocky]

Agree with the “softer is better” approach. I ride a Welsh-Arab pony who is quite sensitive. By doing a version of the exhale described above, I can pretty much stop him within a few strides, or at least downshift from the gallop to the trot. If we’re on a run and he gets a little strong, he tends to come back by half-halting to the beat of “stea-dy, stea-dy, stea-dy.” I also tend to ride at speed with my reins bridged, so if he pulls, he pulls against himself, not me.

I was fortunate in that this pony was pretty easy to start. We were lucky enough to go out with hounds during a few late summer trail rides, so he got to see hounds in a lower-pressure environment. We had also spent the summer doing the hunt trail rides, so he knew how to go in a large group.

A number of horses I’ve known come across the “third hunt hump,” when by the third time out, they’ve sort of figured things out and it may either go well or badly at that point. That can be a good time to opt for the slower field and keep things on the slow side, so they don’t get the idea that all they are going to do is go out and blast around the country. And, as others have mentioned, exposure and experience out and about are the best teachers.

Good luck teaching your horse to hunt!

[GrayMare]

SLW thanks for sharing, that’s exactly what I was looking for, some subtle ways to encourage little miss mare to tune back into me when she is distracted.

Jetjockey, that is exactly what we are experiencing, a “third hunt hump” of sorts where she has just figured out what is going on enough to try to anticipate. In her case it isn’t terrible–I just want to make sure we get over the hump and the hump doesn’t get bigger…

Gumtree, your post was excellent, I enjoyed it even though my little mare is no thoroughbred. It’s interesting to reflect on the differences. While TBs can be hotter, OTOH I do think that OTTBs are more comfortable with galloping along in a group. Yes, they might get strong or excited, but they “get it” that they are galloping along in a group with some control from a rider. IME they have a lot more learning to do with regard to the going slow part and the checks, and probably have to get used to ditches, creeks, etc. My mare is the opposite–she will cross trappy country comfortably, stops on a dime when the other horses stop, and stands at checks like a champ. She is unnerved by the galloping in a group part.

Your post actually made me consider that this mare has probably not had enough experience working at trot and canter in a group with other horses. Wednesday I made my junior accomplices join me on their horses for some fitness work with her out in a back field. I could feel her little brain starting to get revved up, and then she realized that it really wasn’t that exciting.

[jetjocky]

Often going back to the slower field is good for dealing with the third hunt hump. Maybe spend the next several hunts there if you can, to help level out the full-time run and jump idea.

Others have mentioned the value of flatwork and other attention-keeping exercises. Second continuing with those as well.

[gumtree]

Thanks

“While TBs can be hotter, OTOH I do think that OTTBs are more comfortable with galloping along in a group. Yes, they might get strong or excited, but they “get it” that they are galloping along in a group with some control from a rider”

They should that is how they are broke/started and trained until they go to the track. At the track they go out in “sets” and other times galloped by themselves. Regardless there are a LOT of other horses around them every day when training.

I only work with TBs and they are all broke and trained on our farm. No track just a very large field to train with. So they are exposed to a lot of things. Especially during fawning season. They are all started in our ring in groups and once they have breaks and mind the bridle well enough they go into the wide open spaces.

From what I have seen with other breeds it seems they are broke/started as individuals. So by and large they are never worked with, trained in groups. Being put in “tight quarters” clinking irons, being taken back circling the group and asked to run on and pass etc.

“IME they have a lot more learning to do with regard to the going slow part and the checks, and probably have to get used to ditches, creeks, etc.”

I have not found this to be true as a rule. Depends on the horse, its background and the trainer, person working with them.

One thing to keep in mind when asking this type of question is the fact everybody has a different idea/experience of “Hunting”. What kind of horse fits their Hunt territory and “style” of Hunting.

[GrayMare]

If anyone’s interested I thought I’d give an update. I took a step backwards (sideways?) and spent a few weeks working with my mare in the ring, practicing jumping (gymnastics and little courses), and along with it a lot of transitions and especially transitions within each gait, along the lines of some of the suggestions here (SLW). A lot of work trying to get her to “cue in” a little more automatically. I did a couple lessons on her with my h/j trainer, who told me to stop over-thinking her training “as a hunt horse,” and to focus more on her proper education as a riding horse, teaching her to be responsive and rideable just like any other horse, and then we spent the lessons doing just that. Fair enough!

The ground here was not conducive to galloping on my fields, so we weren’t able to practice moving at speed in a group. But, I did practice putting her into a hand gallop in the ring and then changing gears back to a slower canter, back and forth, etc. The first few times I did that it was clear that she was completely uneducated about the gallop-canter downward transition. You know, because once you get galloping you should just keep galloping!

Many hunts were cancelled due to weather so I never did practice going in third field, which I really had intended to do. In any case, things seemed to have really clicked for her the past few hunts and she has been a real gem, being reasonably patient as we set off, and then riding on a soft rein and being very adjustable. I’m so pleased with her that she has taken what we worked on in the ring remembered it in the hunt field. I’m so disappointed the season will be winding down soon. But, I’m really having fun with her and wondering if we might try a few small events this year to keep the momentum in the off season.