Let’s say a decent AP saddle like a Stubben.
How well do they work for the dressage phase? Do they limit you in dressage with seat position? Is Stubben a decent brand for this?
What should you look for in a AP so as not to limit yourself on the flat.
I would appreciate your thoughts on the subject, especially if you take dressage lessons/do well in the dressage phase in a AP saddle.
One thing to watch out for is that stirup bar placement varies between dressage and jump saddles. I think that is why I a lot of people do not like all purpose saddles.
What level are you riding, what are your goals, what is your budget, and how much value do you place on advancing your position, your placings, etc.?
I evented in a Stubben Siegfried up to Intermediate HT level, and did a CCI* with steeplechase in it too. My dressage position was a chair seat, but I was comfortable in it. I bought a dressage saddle which didn’t fit me that well, and I was so uncomfortable that I opted to use my Siegfried.
However, when I found a dressage saddle that fit, I was able to do a much better job as a rider in the dressage phase.
I think up to Training level you can do a totally fine job in an AP as long as it doesn’t put you in entirely the wrong position. Once you are doing sitting trot for your entire test, it’s generally easier to maintain a dressage position better in a dressage saddle.
Don’t forget some APs tend more toward the dressage saddle shape (flaps aren’t as forward), so you may like them more for dressage than for jumping.
I sit the trot better in my jumping saddle! I can do dressage in both although if you are working for dressage position where you are more upright or behind then you will struggle. I do struggle in dressage lessons since I’ve ridden in a jumping saddle so much, I feel like I’m going to fall off backwards by the time my trainer gets me upright enough.
I ride in a Stubben Sigfried AP and have really had no issues with it in the dressage phase. I have no intention of getting a dressage saddle, unless a few grand happen to fall into my lap or my hubby offers to buy one for me!
And it will also depend on your and the horses conformation. A short legged friends main horse until recently was a 16.3 wb cross. For them the AP was by far the best choice due to her shorter leg. To have any knee bend in a most dressage saddles she tried her leg was over the knee flap and her ankles near the bottom of the flap. So she went with a bates AP and used the adjustable knee blocks in different positions for dressage and jumping. Most people didn’t realise when doing her dressage she was in an AP as it fit her so well.
My general recommendation is to avoid an AP saddle altogether. Any AP that won’t “limit you in dressage” will limit you in jumping. Buy a well fitting jumping saddle. It will serve you for any level. Do your LL dressage in it. When and if you want to move up beyond N/T or refine your dressage purchase a dressage saddle. At that point you will have everything you need. Buy an AP now and when and if you want to refine you are stuck looking for 2 saddles.
Thank you everyone.
I have a Jaguar jumping saddle that is really comfortable and a Passier dressage saddle and a wide shouldered young horse that may fit the dressage saddle when he is in shape, but for the next bit he needs a saddle.
I thought of a used AP saddle for the next year since he will mainly do flat work/dressage with some cavaletti work. But also I like the idea of a shorter stirrup for him till he has more miles.
Riding in a dressage saddle feels so much different than the jumping saddle, enough that I couldn’t see using the Jag for dressage lessons (assuming it even fit him, which it doesn’t). Trying to be cheap and figure out a way to have my cake and eat it too. I have not rode in a AP since I was a kid and that was a cheap little saddle.
ps. Maybe I should ask if you can do small jump work in a AP saddle that is more dressage geared?
[QUOTE=Blugal;8815625]
What level are you riding, what are your goals, what is your budget, and how much value do you place on advancing your position, your placings, etc.?
I evented in a Stubben Siegfried up to Intermediate HT level, and did a CCI* with steeplechase in it too. My dressage position was a chair seat, but I was comfortable in it. I bought a dressage saddle which didn’t fit me that well, and I was so uncomfortable that I opted to use my Siegfried.
However, when I found a dressage saddle that fit, I was able to do a much better job as a rider in the dressage phase.
I think up to Training level you can do a totally fine job in an AP as long as it doesn’t put you in entirely the wrong position. Once you are doing sitting trot for your entire test, it’s generally easier to maintain a dressage position better in a dressage saddle.
Don’t forget some APs tend more toward the dressage saddle shape (flaps aren’t as forward), so you may like them more for dressage than for jumping.[/QUOTE]
Thanks!
I had a Lexington TC and I’m sorry I sold it. I’m a perpetual training level rider and the max for jumping was 2’6". So I didn’t really need to change my position much when practicing dressage vs jumping. I loved it for trail riding! I only have a dressage saddle now and it is hard to get out of the horses way when going up hills.
If you find one that let’s you stay balanced over your heels I think you will like it.
If you have and like the Passier, you may be quite suited to an AP model. I’ve done a bunch of eventing at Training level on several different horses in a VSD like this one (VSD stands for all purpose - Dressage). I’m short-legged so for proper jumping I prefer the VSS (the S is for jumping) with a more forward flap. The VSD is absolutely fine for dressage - with my shorter legs they don’t really hit the knee roll.
As with any other type of saddle, you’ll have to ride in it and try to do all the things you want to be able to do in it. The stirrup bar placement that may be absolutely perfect for one person may be awful for you. I would recommend velcro knee blocks so they can be moved to support a variety of leg positions. You can then also have different size blocks if you like for different purposes.
“Needing” to have a dressage saddle at the lower levels is an American thing. In England most people ride in GP saddles. Personally, I find that although I can ride with a quite straight leg I don’t choose to unless the majority of my ride will be in collection, so working 3rd or so. On a lower level horse I like my knee more bent and I do just fine in a GP saddle.
One of my rare clients that has GP saddle is an eventer that uses it as a jump saddle at Training Level and loves it. A well-designed GP saddle really is versatile.
I wish more people would use GP saddles. Since many people with desk jobs have tight hip flexors they can’t really drop their leg as straight as a dressage saddle requires. So they have to have some bend in their joints. That puts their knee into the block, which pushes their butts back against the cantle, and then they think they need a bigger seat. That only allows their hips to go further back and behind the motion. If only they would ride in a GP which would support a range of leg positions they could sit in proper balance and have better dressage scores!
[QUOTE=sheltona01;8815616]
One thing to watch out for is that stirup bar placement varies between dressage and jump saddles. I think that is why I a lot of people do not like all purpose saddles.[/QUOTE]
This is the MAJOR point.
If you take a dressage saddle and shorten the stirrups to jumping length it will put you in a “perch” position.
If you take a jumping saddle and lengthen the stirrups to dressage length, it will put you in a “chair” seat.
How much do you change your stirrup length? If it is only a hole or two, an All Purpose may work for you. But if you have 6 holes difference, it probably won’t.
[QUOTE=no.stirrups;8816605]
As with any other type of saddle, you’ll have to ride in it and try to do all the things you want to be able to do in it. The stirrup bar placement that may be absolutely perfect for one person may be awful for you. I would recommend velcro knee blocks so they can be moved to support a variety of leg positions. You can then also have different size blocks if you like for different purposes.
“Needing” to have a dressage saddle at the lower levels is an American thing. In England most people ride in GP saddles. Personally, I find that although I can ride with a quite straight leg I don’t choose to unless the majority of my ride will be in collection, so working 3rd or so. On a lower level horse I like my knee more bent and I do just fine in a GP saddle.
One of my rare clients that has GP saddle is an eventer that uses it as a jump saddle at Training Level and loves it. A well-designed GP saddle really is versatile.
I wish more people would use GP saddles. Since many people with desk jobs have tight hip flexors they can’t really drop their leg as straight as a dressage saddle requires. So they have to have some bend in their joints. That puts their knee into the block, which pushes their butts back against the cantle, and then they think they need a bigger seat. That only allows their hips to go further back and behind the motion. If only they would ride in a GP which would support a range of leg positions they could sit in proper balance and have better dressage scores![/QUOTE]
The person that suggested an AP is from Germany and has similar opinions. In fact the comment was, “who has stomach muscles to ride in a dressage saddle properly?” lol.
And I totally agree with the stirrup position, but that is also dependent on my body type how that plays out. Think I will just spend the time finding a balanced AP/GP saddle that is older but from a good brand and the horse loves it.
If you need a saddle to fit him and you plan on jumping go with a jumping saddle that way when you are jumping bigger fences and doing more serious dressage you only need to buy one saddle.
