Anything in particular to look for in the good potential hunt horse?

[Romany]

We’re horse-shopping, and saw a rather nice middleweight horse the other day.

It crossed my mind that he might have the potential to make a suitable horse for hunting - he’s well-mannered, calm-minded, well-schooled on the flat and over fences, athletic, no vices, etc.

So - apart from the normal health and conformation considerations one would look for in any horse, what else might make a horse particularly suitable (or unsuitable!) for a comfortable day’s hunting?

I was thinking that I could potentially buy this horse, hunt him for a season or so, do a little eventing, etc, and then sell him on in a year, but IMHO his price was prohibitively high and I’m not sure I’d make enough money to be worth the effort - even if I would probably have lots of fun bringing him on (I’m an experienced rider, but an inexperienced rider-to-hounds).

What about age and size? Any cut-offs there? And what would you expect to pay for a “good” (ie all of the above) hunt horse? And how far would you be prepared to travel to see that good horse?

[SteeleRdr]

For a prospect? I don’t pay any more than a few thousand dollars (3K tops). Good feet, free shoulder, great mind, good heart, good lungs, good eyes. As far as age for a prospect…3-5 is ideal. That way they aren’t too old when you’ve put work into them and they’re still young and in their prime (I’m talking from buying OTTB position b/c that’s what we mostly have). I don’t like wide horses for hunting…I get off and the next day my hips are sore from such a big barrel. Also, I prefer them between 16-16.2H because at that height they’re big enough to carry just about anyone and you don’t have to worry about them being too big when you have to go under a branch or through certain areas. I also am a big fan of smaller horses because they are easier to get off and on and also more agile than the bigger one’s out hunting. I also like a well balanced horse. Although people may think I’m crazy, but a nice natural lead change is always appreciated…makes for a much nicer ride if having to go through woods.

[JSwan]

A young prospect? Cheap. The nicest horse in the world might lose his mind in the hunt field. You never know.

What do I look for? Good feet, short back, good vision. I can deal with pretty much anything else. Age - don’t care - but to me a prospect should be young. Older horses/career change - should be priced to reflect uncertainty and possibility of problems with vetting. Height - I like a short horse - a problem because I’m really tall. But if you need a mounting block, don’t fall off in a field. Some people don’t care - but I can no longer lift my leg above my shoulder to mount a tall horse! And really tall horses can be a hazard on those low hanging branches. But this depends on the territory, too.

I learned the hard way that eventing isn’t hunting. Many horses can do both just fine - but some - like one or the other. The finest eventer may have a meltdown when in a large field and lots of hounds. So be realistic when setting expectations for the horse.

It also can take a few seasons for a horse to settle down in the hunt field - more so if the rider is also new to the sport. Usually people who buy a horse, hunt him a season or to, and sell him - are experienced foxhunters that can really develop a horse into a steady hunter. There is an art to it.

You may just want to buy him as an eventer, compete him, then maybe cap with a hunt during cubbing - when the weather is still warm and the pace is slower. Asking anything else might be a bit unfair - hunting is really an adrenaline rush - even for the calmest horse. And it would be best to hilltop - not go with the field.

Prices - well - I can’t help you much there except to say that maybe a few thousand for a prospect. If this guy has a lot of training under his belt - and some showing - the price would reflect that. Kinda hard to say because prices vary so much around the country.

[Romany]

Both really helpful answers - thanks so much!

You’ve both pretty much described my own horse to a T - perfect height, age, ability, mind, etc - lucky me (insert smilie - haven’t figured out how to myself yet).

The horse we looked at (described in OP) doesn’t much fit your criteria at all, so we’ll pass on him after all…

Still a great horse, though!

[armandh]

same song new singer

often covered: [pun intended] how they will do hunting is unknown until one hunts them. even those with recommendations against such as my last one [see my profile photo] may turn out well in the long run. this of course is not recommended for the new hunt member who needs a well made hunter or at least a horse they have a few years with. professional trainers can often make arrangements with hunts to bring prospects along.

[Conecuh]

[QUOTE=Romany;2434763]
…what else might make a horse particularly suitable (or unsuitable!) for a comfortable day’s hunting?

(I’m an experienced rider, but an inexperienced rider-to-hounds).

What about age and size? Any cut-offs there? And what would you expect to pay for a “good” (ie all of the above) hunt horse? [/QUOTE]

You got GREAT advice from the previous responders.

I would only add that as an inexperienced rider-to-hounds you might try to borrow some experienced field hunters to hunt so you can see for yourself what a “made” hunter is like, and what they have to put up with in the hunt field. It kinda makes you appreciate traits like calm-mindedness and sturdiness more than you may have in the past, and worry less about looks than you may have in the past.

The price range for hunt horses is all over the map. Someone looking for an experienced, well-trained, athletic, sound, bomb-proof stunning looker is going to be paying a lot … maybe in the $15-25 thousand range. Someone looking for a safe steady-eddy, without a lot of concern for looks or age, for second flight can often find a good experienced horse for under $5 thousand (got one in my barn right now). And, as was stated, if you can take an OTTB and make him yourself, you are talking $2-3 thou but a lot of time and effort. A made hunter doesn’t happen overnight. I have a great one I paid $1500 for as a green 6-year old, and wouldn’t sell him for all the tea in china now that he is experienced and trained. But he came with a sound mind and a sound body … the two key ingredients in my book.

Conecuh

[Romany]

Just curious - armandh - whatever were the recommendations against your horse - he looks purty nice to me?!

Conecuh - thanks for the price range suggestions - that alone bumps this particular horse out of a realistically profitable enterprise.

Oh - and for the record - the horse is a middleweight - not an OTTB (well, maybe in his wildest dreams).

[armandh]

gone over the bridge but not forgotten

over 12 years ago advertised as a event prospect 17.2 TWH/Clyde/paint
did I mention that on my pre purchase ride I wound up with a compound tib fib fracture and have a SS rod from knee to ankle. it was rider error and more the fool, I bought the horse anyway. during my recovery he was ridden in the hunt by our field master and in the off season I put him in training with Will
http://www.art2ride.com/Pages/Home.html
[at the time he lived next to our hunt club. ]
by the time I started riding him he was quite fit and strong with a keen desire to be in front. [several senior hunt members suggested that he might be too much horse] a ride the day B4, a double bridle, and very little grain the morning of the hunt took the edge off. after two more years of hunting it was just tack him up and go with a Pelham. he could be strong for the first 20 minutes but would jump anything he was put to and never lost a shoe or had an off day. 10+ years of hauling back on the reins the bad news and a strong lower back for me the good news. Since he would go where ever and never ran out of energy [must be the TWH half] I would occasionally get taged for the field master duties and on rare occasion whiper in. he was retired due to arthritis at this farm
http://www.fieldstonefarmfoundation.org/
and later euthanized after a bad bout of laminitus [sp?] in all 4. [unknown causation]

[wateryglen]

dummy me…

Never heard the term “middleweight” although I have a mental picture of this horse build I guess. Do you mean draft cross? And I don’t think of TB’s as light weights either. Around here many hunting TB’s are heavy boned. Is middleweight like a tb/qh cross? Why not just say his breeding backround?

I’m currently wonderfully amused about the new fad of everything being a “sport” pony now. Sport horse…Like that eventing 14.1 pony at Rolex ridden by Karen O’connor. Was probably an arab/something and for whatever reasons he’s called an american sport pony. In our area now there’s German Sport Ponies!!! Whaaaa??? Call them what they is!!! Expensive!!! Grrrrr…gonna go out and ride my “sport horses”…:winkgrin:

[Seven]

Curious - what about slightly older (i.e., 9-10-11 y/o) hunt “prospects”. These are super sound horses (been racing since 2 and retiring sound) that need to transition careers off the track. I know not all TBs make it in the hunt field, but for these especially sound horses, is there are market for them if they have the right mind? Imagine a season or two of hunt experience, so they’d be about 13 by the time they’re ready for sale.

I’m not concerned with it being profitable, just wondering if there’s a market for a 10-13 y/o hunt horse with a solid season or two of hunting?

[SteeleRdr]

I’m sure there is a market if the remain sound…are 1st field hunters…and are super in the field. Lots of people want something a bit younger than 13, but there are plenty that want something a little more mature. A 13 y/o with 2 seasons is not going to bring nearly as much as a 7-8y/o with 2 seasons.

[JSwan]

Oh - don’t you know?

Draft/cross - 1500$

Sport Horse - 15,000$

A rose, by any other name, would smell as sweet - and all that jazz.

[QUOTE=wateryglen;2441832]
Never heard the term “middleweight” although I have a mental picture of this horse build I guess. Do you mean draft cross? And I don’t think of TB’s as light weights either. Around here many hunting TB’s are heavy boned. Is middleweight like a tb/qh cross? Why not just say his breeding backround?

I’m currently wonderfully amused about the new fad of everything being a “sport” pony now. Sport horse…Like that eventing 14.1 pony at Rolex ridden by Karen O’connor. Was probably an arab/something and for whatever reasons he’s called an american sport pony. In our area now there’s German Sport Ponies!!! Whaaaa??? Call them what they is!!! Expensive!!! Grrrrr…gonna go out and ride my “sport horses”…:winkgrin:[/QUOTE]

[Romany]

Wateryglen - do a google images search for “middleweight hunter” and you’ll find images showing, funnily enough, middleweight hunters.

Yes, they do tend to be draught crosses, but not necessarily.

[Tantivy1]

Love the reference to “middlewight” but don’t forget to not leave out the lightweights and the heavyweights!

I believe these descriptions are more common terminology in Ireland and Great Britain.

Personally, I find myself increasingly using foot size to describe the American draft crosses who come in such a huge variety of sizes.

I consider a heavyweight to be a size 5 shoe or greater, think 10 inches+ of cannon bone to go with the pie platter foot! These make great mounts for the heavier gentleman riders but most cannot keep up with first flight at a really fast paced hunt though they would be fine at probably the majority of US hunts.

A middleweight is a size 3, sometimes a 4 shoe if of a lighter build. When fit, some of these guys can rock along in a fast first.

A lightweight draft is a size 0-2/3, probably has some Standbred or TB, overall more refined.

Again, this is an inexact personal method that I use to help differentiate drafters when describing them to others.

[Weatherford]

Technically (let’s see if I remember :eek:) a Heavyweight has minium 9" bone (that is around the cannon just below the knee), a Middleweight has 7 - 9", and a lightweight has under 7 inches.

Lightweight carries up to 9 or 10 st, Middleweight, up to 12 st, Heavyweight, over 12 st. I think - of course, I still don’t know what a stone is…

Not that anyone showing here in Ireland pays attention to which divisions the horse SHOULD be in! <sigh>

[Flash44]

[QUOTE=wateryglen;2441832]
Never heard the term “middleweight” although I have a mental picture of this horse build I guess.

I’m currently wonderfully amused about the new fad of everything being a “sport” pony now. Sport horse…Like that eventing 14.1 pony at Rolex ridden by Karen O’connor. Was probably an arab/something and for whatever reasons he’s called an american sport pony. In our area now there’s German Sport Ponies!!! Whaaaa??? Call them what they is!!! Expensive!!! Grrrrr…gonna go out and ride my “sport horses”…:winkgrin:[/QUOTE]

“Middleweight” comes with middleage. One has given up on ever being lightweight again.

That pony at Rolex is 7/8 thoroughbred, I think, with the 1/8 being Shetland Pony. I’m selling a Welsh cross and absolutely the other half is American Sport Pony!