Argument with Farmer: WWYD situation

[StormyDay]

@wsmoak I guess usually I probably would just pay it and say, well that sucked, move on. But it just feels like when I rains it pours right now.

I had a 20k well charge (the well pretty much immediately failed the second I moved in), a new (to me) truck purchase (old one died in the middle of a snowstorm), a horse with EPM (that was a fun $1500 vet bill), a client dropped off a horse that they didn’t want who has some medical issues, I got hit with a tax loophole that cost me about 5k over what I thought my taxes were going to be this year, and I have to go in for surgery (that my insurance is not covering, because medical insurance is so wonderful in this country. Yay for medical loans…) in a month.
So it just felt like another little twist of the knife in the whole thing.

Also I do think it’s weird that he did it right after we had such heavy rains. Especially as we had beautiful, dry weather for the past week.

[frugalannie]

Check out laws in your area. Here if a farmer fertilizes a field, he is entitled to the crop. Call your local Ag extension office to get info. I agree with making friends and then easing him out. Yes, what he did was (and is) egregious, but really what’s the goal? If it’s to become a part of a neighborhood or punish him for his actions, that’ll help dictate what you do. (And I know there are lots of other options in between those two.)

[frugalannie]

Also check out the laws of adverse possession in your state. If someone farms a plot of land for some length of time without a written demand to stop or a valid contract limiting their term, they may have a claim on the land. Here it’s 15 years, the farther west you go the shorter it gets. Our California born neighbor says that out there it’s 4 years. He would make us request permission in writing every year to hack a trail on his property because he was afraid we could claim it under adverse possession.

[PaddockWood]

Wow. Given all that transpired and you two talking and him knowing you have plans for the property and then he comes and drives over flags and markers? I would be SO.pissed.off.

On the other hand I get it - if you need him for hay and it does suck to have neighbors you have in conflict but come on…that is bullsh*t he came on your property and did that.

[StormyDay]

I certainly will. I’ve never heard of that, but I’ll make sure it doesn’t apply here.

Looked it up; doesn’t apply here. He doesn’t meet the requirements, plus it’s 15 years or more even if he did.

[punchy]

Those legal theories you cite are not applicable. He had a contract with the former owners to hay their field; there was no doubt who owned it. And, a farmer can’t just go around spewing seed all over other people’s property without permission and say he is entitled to the harvest.

The farmer is a bully. I would politely decline to pay him and I wouldn’t let him hay the field. Take photos of what he did to your property and get documentation from your contractor for work they have to redo, in case asshole farmer guy gets a lawyer.

[Jaegermonster]

i agree with Punchy. This guy is an ass and a bully and hes doing it because he thinks he can get away with it.

[fordtraktor]

I am usually a total “be nice” person with a family full of farmers, but this is egregious. Don’t pay him. This is not the time to play nice. Be professional only, not rude, not a pushover.

[trubandloki]

Before you make up your mind on how to deal with this situation, maybe ask around to find out what kind of person this guy is. Is he typically a bully? Or maybe this was just a ditzy mistake and he is normally an honest and easy to deal with business man.

[frugalannie]

That’s good news. Knowledge is power especially in the hands of a horse person!

[Weezer]

This is a tough one. It’s hard to tell if the farmer is being ignorant or being a bully but I think this is a time for the classic question “do you want to be right, or do you want to be happy?” If you want to be happy, assume he had the best of intentions and it was a misunderstanding. Offer him $1000 and tell him you will be tending to the land on your own from now on. That gives him a graceful way out and establishes you as a reasonable person. You may not be worried about preserving a relationship with him, but in a rural area, you can’t afford to have enemies.

[Bluey]

Repeating.may be a good idea to consult an attorney, as paying him may establish that he is working the land and gives him some rights.

He took it on himself to barge in there and fertilize, without a firm agreement with you, the new owner, so don’t make it ok by paying him now, not without legal counsel.
He had a written contract before, he knows about them, he jumped the gun on this to obligate you, maybe, so don’t fall for it, find out first where you stand there.

Sorting this out doesn’t has to antagonize him or make you mad.
Be businesslike, listen to him and then tell him what YOU want to make of this odd situation.

[StormyDay]

I’ve decided to give him a call tomorrow and tell him that while I feel bad that he sprayed the field, we have no contract for him to tend the land and he didn’t notify me in any way he was going to be on the land in general. If he wishes, he can hay the bottom 4 acres of the pasture for this year only, and that’s all I can offer him. If he wants to do that, he needs to notify me every time he plans on being on the property so I can lock the horses up appropriately (don’t want them running through a fence in terror because there’s a scary loud monster in the next field over).

If he pushes further for compensation I will tell him that he was trespassing and send him a letter from a lawyer.

I just really cannot justify spending a grand on something that I didn’t ask for, want, or budget for. If it was a couple hundred bucks, I might be more open to that, but a grand is pretty expensive to pay for someone else’s mistake.

I went out after work to look at the damage further. It’s torn up in the wet parts but overall not too bad. There’s some ruts/dents in the grass, but I think I can just have the guys roll over it when they compact the arena. However, one of the white 4ft tall fence markers is broken in two, another is ran over, and of course there’s the flags. I don’t understand how you don’t see neon white 4 ft tall T posts or brightly colored utility flags?? And when you do see them, your thought process is ‘I’ll just mow those right over?’

Thanks for letting me vent/give me ideas. I was worried maybe I was overreacting.

[MapleBreeze]

Why not just make a deal that you get some of the hay this year in exchange for use and no rights next year?

[Rallycairn]

The way I read it, she’s turning it into arena and pastures so she can bring her horses home, but maybe I’m misunderstanding.

[StormyDay]

@Rallycairn

The way I read it, she’s turning it into arena and pastures so she can bring her horses home, but maybe I’m misunderstanding.

Yes that’s correct; it’s all going to be used by me for my horses. I can hold off on using the bottom 4 acres for this year though if I need to.

[Huntin_Pony]

In my area, the stakes for you would be much higher than how this particular farmer feels about you as a new neighbor. The word about the incident would get around to everyone else in town and would possibly bias opinions of you by other providers. Of course, the effect will depend on what this farmer’s reputation is and how accurately the story is told.

So what I’m suggesting is that it’s very important for you to be calm and reasonable and do nothing that the long-time residents will think is out of the ordinary. First impressions are lasting and important, especially if you will need good working relationships going forward.

I DO sympathize and I DO think he was in the wrong, but I really advise restraint and even humor if at all possible.

[StormyDay]

@Huntin_Pony

In my area, the stakes for you would be much higher than how this particular farmer feels about you as a new neighbor. The word about the incident would get around to everyone else in town and would possibly bias opinions of you by other providers. Of course, the effect will depend on what this farmer’s reputation is and how accurately the story is told.

So what I’m suggesting is that it’s very important for you to be calm and reasonable and do nothing that the long-time residents will think is out of the ordinary. First impressions are lasting and important, especially if you will need good working relationships going forward.

I DO sympathize and I DO think he was in the wrong, but I really advise restraint and even humor if at all possible.

I’d agree with you if I lived in a smaller community or hadn’t lived here for 4 years already. While I’ve only been at this house for a short time I’ve been in the area for 4 years and have connections to people here already/a reputation. I’ve always been quick to pay anything I get done with my contractors, vets, farriers, etc.
And while I certainly don’t want to anger anyone intentionally or come into a place and cause a bunch of drama, I also am not going to let myself get walked over.

I feel like the fact that he didn’t reach out to pay for the use of the field this year really says something about this whole situation too.

Sorry. The more I think about it the more I’m just like ‘what a cluster****’.

[Huntin_Pony]

Okay, got it. You know your community and situation and I don’t, admittedly.

Maybe you have some mutual friends who could mediate the situation?

Otherwise, I agree that consulting an attorney in the community couldn’t hurt.

[StormyDay]

@Huntin_Pony

Okay, got it. You know your community and situation and I don’t, admittedly.

Maybe you have some mutual friends who could mediate the situation?

Otherwise, I agree that consulting an attorney in the community couldn’t hurt.

No one I know has heard of him From what I gather most of his hay sells to feed stores down south, and he does a lot of his farming over the border in MD, though I could be wrong about that.

I do know that there’s another farmer in the neighborhood that he got into a minor conflict with. Not that it’s here nor there; I have no real details on what happened there.

Also, admittedly I am not a hay farmer, but I do think it’s really strange on the timing of when he sprayed the field. Last night we got more rain which was in the forecast several days out. So not only was the field wet when he sprayed, it just rained more and possibly washed all the fertilizer into the stream on my property, which of course is the main feeder stream for the lake that the other farmer that he got into a fight with owns….
I’m wondering if I inadvertently stepped into a weird tit for tat feud or something.