Attaching the lunge line to the bit

[Countrywood]

With all the talk about cavessons, I rarely see anyone use them. FEI level dressage trainers were spending winter here and they all lunged with bridles on the horses. The reality is that often cavessons don’t fit, and who has time to put one on. People have to do what is realistic and practical. I used a cavesson with my horse and he did not seem to prefer it, or go any better in it, then using longe clipped to snaffle ring and over the poll to outside ring.

My personal experience is I do not like lunge line attached to only the inside ring. Any horse can spook or act up and if they do, attached only to inside ring gives you little control and can damage the mouth as all the pull is from one side and bit can be pulled right out of the mouth or twisted. Over the poll seems to prevent antics which is better than dealing with them .

[arlosmine]

My problem with over the poll is that is is essentially a gag. Not my favorite effect, especially a youngster if something goes south. More pain on the mouth compounds an already bad situation. I have done it with a super heavy school horse who was being a turd.
If I need more control, I’d rather use a rope halter or a caveson or a halter with the longe line run through the rings over the nose like a chain.

I also only use cotton web longe lines that would break if the horse steps on the line. I shudder to think about a hose getting tangled up in a nylon line that’s attached to the bit. Yuck.

[trubandloki]

[QUOTE=arlosmine;8666458]

I also only use cotton web longe lines that would break if the horse steps on the line. I shudder to think about a hose getting tangled up in a nylon line that’s attached to the bit. Yuck.[/QUOTE]
My lunge line is cotton but I can not imagine it breaking easily. What type do you use?

[Crockpot]

My problem with over the poll is that is is essentially a gag.

I dont like it either- just a personal preference- because does not slide well enough and can get caught plus can counterbend the horse.

Was always a strictly cavesson user until that one horse who objected to it and clearly prefers a different method so why fight about it with the horse.

So for him I use the ‘a’ method in klimkes book and lungeline is fixed so it cannot noose up on the bit. So the pressure is on the cavesson, not the bit. Works for this horse who does not pull and hates a bunch of stuff on his face. Also hates flash so ditched that too in the early years.

I think there are some different acceptable ways to do this and as with most things horsey- no one holy way it must always be done.

See Klimke book excerpt, for example. He preferred the cavesson but then shows a few other acceptable methods .

[SendenHorse]

I was taught over the poll and never just to the inside bit (German school).
I use the “Y” attachment, personally on my horses.

[Foxtail]

[QUOTE=MysticOakRanch;8666405]
I’m not sure what the point of lunging is without some contact? That is what the side reins help with (among other things), teaching the horse to accept contact (and balance on a circle) without the added balance issues of a rider on the back. [/QUOTE]

My issue with side reins is that there’s no way to adjust them on the fly (i.e. in the middle of an exercise) based off of the way the horse is performing. Also, when adjusted loosely, side reins encourage nothing that couldn’t be encouraged without them. Adjusted tightly, they interfere with the horse’s natural way of going. I can see the value of side reins on a schooled horse who understands contact, but an unschooled horse is liable to learn to bend away from the circle to evade the pressure of the side reins.

The young horse, if given free use of his head and neck, and if brought along slowly and methodically, will learn more or less on his own how to balance on a circle. Teaching him the basics of contact can be done more effectively through long lining or groundwork.

[Lord_Helpus]

I use the Y attachment, too. I have an old hand made one with 'lobster claw" snaps at each end and a clip with a roller on one end and a hole on the other (to attach the lunge line to.

With the “roller” clip the contact always stays even on both side of the bit so you are never pulling the horse in one direction or the other. An added bonus to this method is that you do not have to reorganize everything when you change directions, so I frequently will go left for 3 minutes, then go right, then left, then right. I do this especially with a young horse, so their legs do not get torqued in one direction for very long.

I bought a horse last fall who went around with his head tilted. For some reason, one day I put the lunge line through the bit and over the pole — He immediately tilted his head to the side and I knew where his head tilt cam from. As soon as I switched to the Y with the roller his head as been perfectly straight.

[Scribbler]

[QUOTE=Foxtail;8666543]
My issue with side reins is that there’s no way to adjust them on the fly (i.e. in the middle of an exercise) based off of the way the horse is performing. Also, when adjusted loosely, side reins encourage nothing that couldn’t be encouraged without them. Adjusted tightly, they interfere with the horse’s natural way of going. I can see the value of side reins on a schooled horse who understands contact, but an unschooled horse is liable to learn to bend away from the circle to evade the pressure of the side reins.

The young horse, if given free use of his head and neck, and if brought along slowly and methodically, will learn more or less on his own how to balance on a circle. Teaching him the basics of contact can be done more effectively through long lining or groundwork.[/QUOTE]

I haven’t seen sidereins used to any good effect on a young, developing horse.

The peculiarity of my situation, though, is that the best riders/trainers I have access to have sworn off all “gadgets,” and the people I see using sidereins are doing a lot of other things wrong, too, and have poor long-term results. So I am keeping an open mind that it’s possible for a good trainer to use them well on a young horse. I’ve seen videos of schooled horses going well in sidereins, videos showing how to adjust and use sidereins. But that’s different from seeing how they work in schooling a green horse.

I longed for a while in a bridle, line across the poll from the outside bit ring. Then a rope halter. Now I have a European longing cavesson that can be put on and taken off under the bridle, and the noseband is light enough that you could leave it on to ride if necessary. I like that the pull/weight of the line is on the front of the nose, meaning that the head can be nudged to an inside bend; the rope halter tended to encourage a counter bend by pulling on the chin.

I have found that with some careful attention to shoulder-in/shoulder fore on the longe line, I can get maresy to stretch down and carry herself with just the cavesson.

[Countrywood]

The Y attachment is not bad I used to have one, need to get another (one of those mystery things that get lost over the years)

[GraceLikeRain]

[QUOTE=arlosmine;8666458]

I also only use cotton web longe lines that would break if the horse steps on the line. I shudder to think about a hose getting tangled up in a nylon line that’s attached to the bit. Yuck.[/QUOTE]

Really? I’ve seen horses dragging, stepping, tangled, etc. in cotton web long lines over the years and have never seen a single one break. One time the hardware thankfully broke but in the others the horse gave before the lunge line.

[Velvet]

Through inside bit, up over the crown and clipped to the outside. Never clipped straight to the inside. Just how I was taught and what has worked best when retraining horses–or starting them if you don’t have a cavesson.

[Dressage59]

My version of the Klimke book has it running through the inside bit and connecting to the outside bit. The USDF Lunging Pamphlet recommends through the inside bit (circle the bit), then under the chin and attach it to the outside bit. This is what my last trainer recommended. Going over the poll makes it act like a gag bit (somewhat harsh) according to USDF. Hope this helps.

[SendenHorse]

[QUOTE=Dressage59;8667019]
My version of the Klimke book has it running through the inside bit and connecting to the outside bit. The USDF Lunging Pamphlet recommends through the inside bit (circle the bit), then under the chin and attach it to the outside bit. This is what my last trainer recommended. Going over the poll makes it act like a gag bit (somewhat harsh) according to USDF. Hope this helps.[/QUOTE]

I agree, I remember this too. Never on center ring alone – running under chin to outside bit ring.

[SendenHorse]

any horse can trip, take off, spook etc and I wouldn’t want to only have the center ring. very good chance of the bit getting pulled through the mouth and harm the horse. why would anyone take a chance with this?

[merrygoround]

Young, green uneducated horses, cavesson either alone or over a bridle depending on education level of horse. I was fortunate enough to buy a Wels cavesson which has fit every horse I ever longed, it has a chin strap that fits similarly to a dropped nose band, allowing a gentle or strong nudge to the nose band as needed. Some of the other cavessons are just awful

Naughty young horses who think it’s a great game to strike at the line when in a cavesson get to have it go straight to the over the head route.

Never on the inside ring alone. bridles were not designed to be stressed in that way.

When longeing, the longe line is never static. In a well designed cavesson the hand can convey a similar feel as would be felt when riding on contact.

[mvp]

[QUOTE=GraceLikeRain;8666992]
Really? I’ve seen horses dragging, stepping, tangled, etc. in cotton web long lines over the years and have never seen a single one break. One time the hardware thankfully broke but in the others the horse gave before the lunge line.[/QUOTE]

You have to leave the cotton line out in the sun and the rain for awhile. Then put it on an expensive- and/or doesn’t-belong-to-you hot baby horse. Then it will break. I don’t know which of these ingredients-- expensive horse, sun rotting the line, not your horse, hot baby-- does it, but that’s the recipe for breaking a cotton line… in more than one place at once.

[poltroon]

[QUOTE=MysticOakRanch;8666405]
I’m not sure what the point of lunging is without some contact? That is what the side reins help with (among other things), teaching the horse to accept contact (and balance on a circle) without the added balance issues of a rider on the back. [/QUOTE]

I have used side reins and I have worked without side reins. Side reins are what I use when I want to work the horse on good footing and am really after some particular engagement goal.

I work without side reins when my goal is more to check in with the horse, get its attention on me, see what kind of attitude there is, or if I just want to watch how the horse is moving. I can do a lot of work with transitions and obedience, and using my body and how I work the whip and the line, I can create more bend, stretching down, and more engagement with a horse that is attentive to me.

IE: it’s possible to prevent the horse from mindlessly spinning around without side reins.

One thing I don’t like about side reins is that they don’t release and they don’t adjust quickly for different carriage choices, so I use them for pretty short sessions with specific need. Plus, they take time to put on and adjust. If I am able to ride, it’s often easier to just ride. But for other times, they are a great tool.

I try very much to always be listening to my horse and thinking about my specific goal, and adapt what I’m doing if it’s not working the way I want with this specific horse/situation.

[poltroon]

This has been a great discussion. I’m going to try the figure-8 technique on one horse. He goes best in the bridle but I too dislike the way it can have a gag effect which is not needed or kind for him. Wrapping the line around the nose this way may be exactly what he needs, so thanks!

[Crockpot]

Do what you think is right so long as not abusive.

Consider what is best for the individual horse and try not to be too dogmatic

[Lord_Helpus]

Mystic Oak,

It depends on why you are lunging the horse in the first place whether side reins or a Pessoa should be used.

My dressage horse needs to be lunged for 5 minutes to allow the muscles in his top line relax so he can do what is asked of him during the ride. We have tried walking on loose contact for 20 minutes, but that doesn’t do it. The only way he can stretch his neck and lift his spine is at a slow trot on a loose lungeline. When I see his head come down and his back swing he is ready to go to work.

In this instance, any kind of gadget would be counter productive.