A bit off side, but has anyone used the Pessoa Contraption on their horse? I see people use it, the horse seems to go well, I am lazy and can’t imagine hooking all that stuff up.
I had an instructor years ago who would use it on a horse that she would occasionally exercise for a client. The owner of the horse was trying to transition him from western pleasure to dressage (or eventing; can’t recall). The horse did appear to work over his back in it. Every time I’ve looked at the construction of the device though, I can’t help but think that it would cause the horse to catch itself in the mouth. Maybe that’s not true; I got that conclusion from looking at the physics of the device.
I was taught by my trainer to run the lunge line through the inside ring of the bit and then attach it to the surcingle. i use side reins with elastic adjusted so the nose is in front of the vertical. Sometimes I use sliding side reins which seem to help my horses stretch down and raise their backs.
The better way to lunge, imo, is using two lines, more like long lining but on the lunge and that would imitate rein action more. It is very artistic, I’ve seen a few people do it really admire it.
I used to disdain those that lunged before a ride… but then I got a horse that benefits from it :winkgrin:
I wouldn’t say he is cold-backed (he doesn’t buck or bolt) but he always is much better if I give him some time to warm up sans rider. So… somedays I’m jogging alongside him, other days he is on the lunge.
For green horses I don’t care for attaching the line to the bit. Lines are heavy and noisy (noisy in terms of how much weight/movement/activity is happening) and if you are also using side-reins, it’s usually too much activity on a horse’s mouth and not necessarily conducive to teaching acceptance of contact. For that reason I’d prefer to lunge in a caveson or a rope halter when doing serious work. I prefer the lightest weight lunge you can find so usually lunge in 1/2 of my long-lines (which are made of a thin material). I almost never lunge w. the poll method as I do think it’s too much for most horses.
If I’m just lunging the horse to eyeball him and see if he is sound, he’s lunged in a halter or if he was tacked up, with one bit clipped.
For some reason I cannot believe in side reins - I feel they do not have the nice give and feel that real hands to. I have used the do-nut ones, set very loosely and have liked them better. I know everybody uses them, but I don’t get it; I feel it encourages a set head and is like riding with set hands.
I have liked the bing-bong effect of the do-nuts, that work gently on the mouth encouraging the head to lower and the back to round.
Generally, tho, if the horse is going quietly, I dispense of that if her mind is in the right place and just ride.
Pros, no doubt, will differ.
[QUOTE=Countrywood;8667265]
A bit off side, but has anyone used the Pessoa Contraption on their horse? I see people use it, the horse seems to go well, I am lazy and can’t imagine hooking all that stuff up.[/QUOTE]
IMHO/E, it’s kind of punishing depending on the horse. The bigger they step and the more they swing their back the further they pull the line and cause catching in the mouth. It’s essentially a pulley mechanism. I think there are other ideas out there that are more rewarding when a horse steps under himself. Smaller horses with less dramatic strides might do okay with it but I see a lot of people warm up in it in the barns around here and there’s lots of short mincy steps and false frames…
It also, in my experience, causes them to go dead in the mouth which isn’t fun when a client tells you “can you ride Dobbin, he’s been very stiff lately” and you have to nearly pull his teeth out to get him to turn…
[QUOTE=mvp;8667178]
You have to leave the cotton line out in the sun and the rain for awhile. Then put it on an expensive- and/or doesn’t-belong-to-you hot baby horse. Then it will break. I don’t know which of these ingredients-- expensive horse, sun rotting the line, not your horse, hot baby-- does it, but that’s the recipe for breaking a cotton line… in more than one place at once.[/QUOTE]
There is no excuse , hot baby horse or not for a longe line to be on the ground. Longeing in a situation such as that is not for novices. Longeing is not just running a horse in a circle to wear them down. It is a cultivated activity which takes the trainers full attention, and training.
The only time a very good longe line of mine was broken was when I allowed an “expert” to use it. :mad:
[QUOTE=beowulf;8667333]
IMHO/E, it’s kind of punishing depending on the horse. The bigger they step and the more they swing their back the further they pull the line and cause catching in the mouth. It’s essentially a pulley mechanism. I think there are other ideas out there that are more rewarding when a horse steps under himself. Smaller horses with less dramatic strides might do okay with it but I see a lot of people warm up in it in the barns around here and there’s lots of short mincy steps and false frames…
It also, in my experience, causes them to go dead in the mouth which isn’t fun when a client tells you “can you ride Dobbin, he’s been very stiff lately” and you have to nearly pull his teeth out to get him to turn…[/QUOTE]
The chambon, if one wanted to lunge a horse with some sort of topline-stretching device, is pretty forgiving and can encourage a nice stretch.
[QUOTE=capricorn;8667298]
I was taught by my trainer to run the lunge line through the inside ring of the bit and then attach it to the surcingle. i use side reins with elastic adjusted so the nose is in front of the vertical. Sometimes I use sliding side reins which seem to help my horses stretch down and raise their backs.[/QUOTE]
I was originally taught to put the lunge line through the bit and over the poll, but worked with a french classical trainer who would lunge the way you described. She would use a single side rein either on the inside or outside depending on what she was trying to achieve.
[QUOTE=Countrywood;8667317]
The better way to lunge, imo, is using two lines, more like long lining but on the lunge and that would imitate rein action more. It is very artistic, I’ve seen a few people do it really admire it.[/QUOTE]
I ache to be that coordinated. 
[QUOTE=merrygoround;8667334]
There is no excuse , hot baby horse or not for a longe line to be on the ground. Longeing in a situation such as that is not for novices. Longeing is not just running a horse in a circle to wear them down. It is a cultivated activity which takes the trainers full attention, and training.[/QUOTE]
If the horse suddenly cuts in on me, I am often not fast enough to pick up the slack. But I strive to do better every day. 
I have never had a horse that tolerated the line through the bit and over the head. It works like a gag if any pressure at all is applied to the line.
IF I don’t have a proper lunging cavesson, I run the line through the near bit ring, around the nose, following the cavesson and wrapping it around the cavesson at least once then clip to the same near bit ring. Makes a circle of the nose and hugs the nose nicely without drooping or pulling tight and it doesn’t pull on the bit short of a big explosion yet easy to maintain control if that does happen. Side reins can still be used and not interfered with.
I tried that configuration after watching a video done by Baron VonBlixen Finecke. He used a similar configuration with the lunging cavesson on a young stallion. It works well with a cavesson too if you do a wrap on the top of the noseband.
Susan
[QUOTE=Crockpot;8665931]
I don’t know which edition you have. My copy shows different ways to attach but none are solely to inside ring. see Method a on p. 34 at this link- note that it is attached to noseband though it goes through inside bit ring.
Don’t do the bit/noseband clip unless you have a well trained horse–it doesn’t give you much control. My young horse was always well behaved lunging, until one time he got distracted by the neighbor’s pony, took off and ripped the lunge line out of my hands, ran down my driveway with the lunge line trailing, ran up the neighbors driveway, and back up my driveway before I caught him. He lacerated his elbow (must have gotten the lunge line wrapped around it) and had to have stitches, and an hour later was dead lame in a back leg. Somehow he had dinged his stifle.
Fortunately he recovered in a few days, but I learned my lesson (and had quite a hefty vet bill)! I now run the lunge line through the inside ring and over the poll (when I lunge, which I rarely do anymore).
[QUOTE=Countrywood;8667317]
The better way to lunge, imo, is using two lines, more like long lining but on the lunge and that would imitate rein action more. It is very artistic, I’ve seen a few people do it really admire it.[/QUOTE]
This is how I trained my mare to lunge and it worked extremely well. My older sister taught me to do it this way, and when I moved to the DC area from Iowa (as a strictly western saddle rider back then at an entirely English barn), boy, did I get some funny looks from the people in my barn! Using two lines was great, though, because I could easily transition from lunging her to ground driving her.
These days, I use the same method as capricorn mentioned above. Lunge line through inside ring of bit attached to surcingle (or girth buckle if lunging with my saddle on), and elastic outside side rein.
[QUOTE=capricorn;8667298]
I was taught by my trainer to run the lunge line through the inside ring of the bit and then attach it to the surcingle. i use side reins with elastic adjusted so the nose is in front of the vertical. Sometimes I use sliding side reins which seem to help my horses stretch down and raise their backs.[/QUOTE]
I’d love to hear more about this method. I’ve only seen it used a handful of times. Given the placement it seems like it would provide a lot of leverage. In the event that a horse hard bolted it seems like a correction or even just attempting to hold on could leverage a mouth to the girth line fast enough to flip a horse.
With a well-mannered horse it seems like it could provide a nice feel and mimic a sponging inside rein?
I would imagine you know ahead of time if you’re going to lunge a horse (I’m a fan), but I can’t imagine I’ve ever attached the line to the bit. I’ve tried side reins and didn’t find them useful. I think a halter or cavesson would be fine.
Wow, thanks for all the replies so far! My purpose for lunging is the fact that my gelding is still quite young and we don’t want to ride him too often yet, but still give him a “job.” He lunges quite well and doesn’t do anything stupid, but that being said, I did try him in just a halter today and didn’t feel that I had enough control, especially with turning…
[QUOTE=Countrywood;8667265]
A bit off side, but has anyone used the Pessoa Contraption on their horse? I see people use it, the horse seems to go well, I am lazy and can’t imagine hooking all that stuff up.[/QUOTE]
Yes, I own one of these and use it occasionally.
I don’t want to get into a side reins debate, but if I had to choose a piece of equipment to use for lunging a horse, I’d choose either a Chambon or (for a lazy horse), a Pessoa Contraption. Both of these can be adjusted to reward the horse for reaching out and down with his neck. I don’t have much use for anything that just brings the nose in, or has the horse push into the bit without allowing me some control of the base of his neck.
The Pessoa Contraption can make a horse work hard, I have been told. I follow suit and don’t use it for more than 15 minutes or so.
[QUOTE=Countrywood;8667317]
The better way to lunge, imo, is using two lines, more like long lining but on the lunge and that would imitate rein action more. It is very artistic, I’ve seen a few people do it really admire it.[/QUOTE]
That IS long lining.
