Attention to Those Who Have Placed Pasture Horses in SouthEast

[BeeHoney]

@furlong47

Kelsey Lefever, Pennsylvania, 2012. Almost identical M.O. Charged with deceptive business practices and theft by deception including several felony counts. She ended up with only two years probation. But yes, there IS precedent. https://www.paulickreport.com/news/ray-s-paddock/kelsey-lefever-every-one-of-them-is-dead/

Thank you for sharing that link, very interesting. In Ms. Lefever’s case, however, there was 1) actual proof that the horses were sold to auction, 2) Ms. Lefever had an actual business that was operated advertised/deceptively with printed and online advertising materials, and 3) in addition she took money and bags of grain (not just a free horse) under false pretenses (theft by deception). Unfortunately I don’t think any of those things apply to the person we are discussing in this thread. But nonetheless, I much appreciated knowing about it.

[clanter]

@BeeHoney

FWIW I have never, ever seen or heard of any person being punished through the legal system for taking free horses under false pretenses. The real world just doesn’t care. Because the horses are giveaways with zero dollar value, there are no damages to collect.

basically there is a reason for the $1 sale rather than no cost give away as the dollar makes the transaction a completed contract in English common Law because of the consideration (payment in exchange for horse)

not sure if that would hold in Louisiana as transactions between private sector parties, principally contracts are based on French civil code (Napoleonic Code)

points are by me, not an attorney but as one who had to work with contract law during my course of employment… seek real legal advise from a professional

[xeroxchick]

All we can do is get her name out there. The horse world is small. Hopefully this will end her career. And her barrel racing career.

[jetsmom]

@BeeHoney

FWIW I have never, ever seen or heard of any person being punished through the legal system for taking free horses under false pretenses. The real world just doesn’t care. Because the horses are giveaways with zero dollar value, there are no damages to collect. After a horse disappears it’s extremely difficult to prove intent, or that the horse wasn’t in fact sick or unsuitable. It’s also generally impossible to prove what happened to the horse. It’s easy enough for someone to claim that it died of natural causes or that they gave it to someone else (and of course it’s illegal to trespass on other people’s property to verify anything). When a horse is sold anonymously through an auction there is no proof of identity.

Even in this case, is there any proof that the horses have gone to slaughter? All the owners know in this case is that this woman has collected multiple horses that have disappeared, and they believe the horses have gone to auction. To me, it’s highly likely that the horses DID end up at auction, but there doesn’t seem to be any proof.

According to the Netposse article, there is an “application for an arrest warrant” and people are pursuing “criminal and federal charges” but oddly Netposse does not mention the accused person by name in the article or on the website. Indeed, even in the reports on Netposse (at least the ones I looked at) the name of this person does not show up. Does anyone have an explanation for that? I will be following this story, but I think it is unlikely that there will be any “arrest” or legal penalties for this person.

I agree with Djones–the school cannot punish her until they have proof. If they were to punish her based on accusations and without proof they would be exposing themselves to a lawsuit.

As an aside, I want to make it clear that I’m not judgmental towards those who were taken in by this person. I lost a precious older horse to someone like this years ago and I’ll never give away an older horse again. Since then I’ve realized that many people make a little extra money by collecting unwanted horses with the promise of a good home and quietly funneling them to auction, usually through a friend or relative so that they keep their hands “clean.”

there is a KY case where someone was convicted for doing it with 2 horses that they sold to slaughter.
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=http://caselaw.findlaw.com/ky-court-of-appeals/1337993.html&ved=2ahUKEwjjq9qwhuPZAhVWzWMKHfvfD1oQFjAAegQIBhAB&usg=AOvVaw19qIcxbUCzehYKwrOgrQ7R

[BeeHoney]

@jetsmom thank you for finding that and sharing that. In this case, the person retained ownership of the horses and did a free lease, although I did not see that there was a written contract. I do find it amazing and heartening that the jury awarded the owner of the horses $1000 for their value, plus $125,000 for both “outrageous conduct” (intentional infliction of emotional distress) and punitive damages.

Pursuing a case like this is only an option for someone who has the $$ to risk on extensive legal bills, because there was no guarantee of success. There were investigators, witnesses that had to be flown in, a trial, and later an appeal. As is unusual in these type of cases, investigators were able to prove who the horses were sold to and that they ended up at slaughter. Although the owner of the horses won the case, there was of course no bringing her precious horses back from slaughter. And likely much if not all of the $$ she recovered went towards legal bills. I have to wonder if she ever even received the money awarded to her, because most people selling to slaughter probably don’t have $126K sitting around.

I am heartened to see another instance where someone doing this was punished, but I think the overall lesson is still that even free leasing an older horse is extremely risky.

[xeroxchick]

News channel in the Atlanta area is going to have a story about this at ten tonight. Fox Five.

[furlong47]

Netposse reports on their Facebook page that she was arrested for obtaining property by false pretense. I was going to post this earlier but couldn’t find the thread.

https://www.facebook.com/StolenHorseInternationalNetPosse/posts/2151350788212735

[xeroxchick]

She is in jail in Alabama waiting for extradition to North Carolina on felony fraud charges.

[js]

What happened to the original horse Willie, they news report said it would be in an upcoming seqment. Said it got sold twice ending up with a family, the owner calls and gets a big surprise?

[shiloh]

And that ends her career - veterinary and otherwise. Witch.

[FatCatFarm]

@shiloh

And that ends her career - veterinary and otherwise. Witch.

We can only hope. :mad:

[JanM]

Don’t bet on it. Just because she gets the boot from Tuskegee, (I’m assuming since charges are filed she gets booted) it doesn’t mean she can’t go to an off-shore school, if she can afford it. Many of those are open to anyone who can pay.

[shiloh]

But in order to get licensed to practice and dispense medications (esp. narcotics) in the US she cannot have any convictions on her record. And a past history of any criminal or nefarious (love that word) activities will keep anyone in US - and possibly elsewhere - from hiring her. Unless she changes her name, a quick trot thru computerland will bring up her activities and I don’t know anyone who would willingly hire someone like her. And really, if you were a patient and the least bit curious, again a quick zip thru Google would bring her up and I would never go back to that practice again.

[yaya]

Don’t jump the gun. She’s going to have to get convicted first. That’s a long way away.

[BoyleHeightsKid]

I’m so glad this vile person has been arrested. I can’t believe someone going to vet school would do something like this. She’s absolutely horrible and I hope they throw the book at her.

[spacytracy]

Im not siding with the university, but trying to expell a student is EXTREMELY hard. You have to have lawyers involved and proven, long documention. I work for a university and I’ve seen many students who should not be there but our hands are legally tied. Believe me, I am sure they want to expell her.

[trail_blazer]

Please follow all the updates on this story by checking the “FInd Willie” and Net Posse facebook pages. There is a lot going on and more charges may be coming soon. Sadly, more horses and scammed horse owners are still being identified as well.

[JanM]

Latest update from the NetPosse page is 28 owners, 47 horses, 2 goats, and over six states, and it is suspected that there are other animals and owners, and reports continue to come in. She is said to have waived extradition.

On the NetPosse page it also says first reported scam date was in 2013, so she’s been doing this for four plus years. With a big dually, and fancy trailer even in 2013, wonder where that all came from?

The NetPosse FB says a team of people who pull from kill pens bought three Arabs that were at auction, so maybe others were saved. The NetPosse page writer says that they think 47 horses, and the 28 owners in only the tip of the iceberg.

Wonder how many others are involved with this? There is no way this was a one person operation.

[FatCatFarm]

What a freaking parasite and to think she was becoming a veterinarian. I hope at least that never happens now. This woman has absolutely no business being in charge of any animal’s welfare, ever.

[JanM]

I hope there is enough to boot her from Tuskegee, but that won’t stop her from going to an off-shore for profit school, because my understanding is that if you can pay, you get in.

I wonder how many horses she scammed people out of, because I bet there are some that read about this, and they just didn’t want to come forward and admit they were deceived since they probably are right that their animals are long gone from this earth.