Badminton anyone?

[OverandOnward]

[QUOTE=goodmorning;7571083]
… Should make the WEG course interesting.[/QUOTE]

Who’s the designer for WEG?

One of the disappointments for Clark was that had he finished still #1, even in the top 3-5, and then had a respectable show jumping, he would have been in a great position to become a WEG team rider.

What does this retirement do to his WEG possibilities? This is not a good time to have that happen. Can he work on fitness and have the good part of his ride be what the team pickers look at? Can he say it was due to the wind, etc., others also retired … but what if it’s windy on WEG day?

Was it 2 years ago? Clark has a great run going around Rolex KY with Glen, then ended up retiring (or something) close to the end of the course. (That was the year Glen broke the frangible pin - although I don’t think he broke the log - and was charged 21 penalties.) Does that count now with the WEG selectors, given that this is also a failure to finish close to the end? Surely not, I wouldn’t think.

In fact, re some earlier comments … what does this Badminton result do to WEG selection generally for all the teams?

[3dazey]

I am in perfect agreement with mugsgame and doodlebug. I got to watch all of it and was never in terror that it was anything remotely dangerous. All the (fantastic) BBC commentators, all of whom were former or current (even riding at Badminton) 4* competitors and what they said was it was a big-jumping course which hasn’t been seen so much in recent years, with little or no let-up in concentration allowed. Many of the problems were perhaps slips in concentration, a lack of understanding of what kind of pace and balance were needed for a particular fence, that kind of thing. I never felt a horse was unjustly punished, even at Huntsman’s Close where I did feel bad when a couple horses got hung up on those enormous corners, it really looked that the riders lost their lines and the horses just couldn’t cover the mistake. Big big jumps. You just could not skate through on an average type of jumper no matter how good-hearted, and you couldn’t let down your guard at all. I think that probably is the definition of 4*. Everyone shouldn’t finish. But you hope everyone walks away, which they seemed to today.

PS Anyone hear how Lucinda’s horse Flying Finish is? I never saw why he hurt himself as he jumped beautifully down the escalator then started hopping a bit.

[goodmorning]

Well, Tiana can probably bring you home. But I feel that way about Sinead. I wish she had gone around Badminton…

Is WEG supposed to be a bigger question than Badminton? With all the rider focus I guess?

[mugsgame]

The ground jury are going back over footage. Nicola Wilson demolished the vicarage V and they are not sure she went through the flags on it.

[RiderWriter]

@Blugal;7571082

I only watched the last half, but I did not see a single horse slip. I think the ground was holding and perhaps tiring, but nobody was having poor jumps or turns due to slips.

Peter Atkins posted on FB that he had the biggest studs in his box on Henny’s feet and he still couldn’t get a grip… they skated down the Outlander Bank. He also said jumping from the mud was extremely tiring. If others weren’t slipping, I’m curious as to what they did differently? I’m not an eventer so this is an honest question, I really don’t know!

[retreadeventer]

I don’t know. The numbers say the course was too much for the entry.

[mugsgame]

Anyway would you not be more worried about the issues at 3* at Jersey Fresh? Some of those horses have been round 4*!

[CaitlinandTheBay]

[QUOTE=mugsgame;7571117]
Anyway would you not be more worried about the issues at 3* at Jersey Fresh? Some of those horses have been round 4*![/QUOTE]

What happened at Jersey?

[DLee]

I watched every ride and saw quite a few slips. They may have been more in the first half, I don’t remember. The designer said he thought weather was definitely a factor and was disappointed in the number that finished.

One of the rotational falls made me gasp a bit, but in general the horse falls did not look really awful. No screens, no horse ambulances, no life flights… and lots of shakeups. Pretty great really.

Super disappointed for Clark though. Will never forget Buzzy through that keyhole landing at the bottom!

[vineyridge]

Here’s what I remember the Radio commentators saying–One was definitely Matt Ryan, but I’m not sure who the female was but she was clearly a former or current rider. And then there were the interviews afterwards from the riders who finished.

One or more rider said that the course rode very different from the way it walked. It seemed to me that every time there was an oops moment, even if the rider was able to save it, it was the result of a mistake. The horse jumped too big or too small, got too close or too far from the jumps, didn’t make the striding in the combinations, or drifted slightly in one direction or the other. There seemed to be absolutely no margin for error and no room or time to correct. Whether or not you think this is the sort of course that 4*s should be, it’s nothing at all like the old style ones. They were big and galloping and far from technical. This course was technical from the 4th fence on without let up. IMO, cross country should not be to the point where the rider has to control every single stride perfectly. Talk about exhausting, and I would suggest, dangerous, although apparently none of the multiple horse and rider falls were bad. IMO, that was just pure luck. And frangible pins. Think how many times the pins had to be replaced; that’s very unusual. Either they were saving rotational falls, or the jump was being hit hard by multiple horses.

The course designer for both the 2014 WEG and the 2016 Olympics is Pierre Michelet, the Frenchman who does Pau and Saumur and many of the other French courses.

[Fergs]

[QUOTE=3dazey;7571100]
Anyone hear how Lucinda’s horse Flying Finish is? I never saw why he hurt himself as he jumped beautifully down the escalator then started hopping a bit.[/QUOTE]

Apparently he scraped his stifle and was initially sore but is now comfortable and should be totally fine. Phew.

[Doodlebug1]

[QUOTE=vineyridge;7571150]
Here’s what I remember the Radio commentators saying–One was definitely Matt Ryan, but I’m not sure who the female was but she was clearly a former or current rider. And then there were the interviews afterwards from the riders who finished.

One or more rider said that the course rode very different from the way it walked. It seemed to me that every time there was an oops moment, even if the rider was able to save it, it was the result of a mistake. The horse jumped too big or too small, got too close or too far from the jumps, didn’t make the striding in the combinations, or drifted slightly in one direction or the other. There seemed to be absolutely no margin for error and no room or time to correct. Whether or not you think this is the sort of course that 4*s should be, it’s nothing at all like the old style ones. They were big and galloping and far from technical. This course was technical from the 4th fence on without let up. IMO, cross country should not be to the point where the rider has to control every single stride perfectly. Talk about exhausting, and I would suggest, dangerous, although apparently none of the multiple horse and rider falls were bad. IMO, that was just pure luck. And frangible pins. Think how many times the pins had to be replaced; that’s very unusual. Either they were saving rotational falls, or the jumps was being hit hard by multiple horses.

The course designer for both the 2014 WEG and the 2016 Olympics is Pierre Michelet, the Frenchman who does Pau and Saumur and many of the other French courses.[/QUOTE]

Vineyridge, I think this is pretty much what I was trying to say about being tipped just slightly too much towards micro-managing - but it WAS quite an old style course - it was not twisty-turny technical, it was big, open and galloping but with a greater element of control than ‘the good old days’.

I find it fascinating that people hark back to the ‘old’ format - when horses did twice as much, on really wet ground - and this was NOT really wet - and finished much more tired - and now are saying ‘oh it was the ground, it asked too much’.

I hope you get to watch the whole thing (and not just the highlights that will inevitably be the ‘thrills and spills’ and see what you think.

I DO, as I’ve said earlier, think it went too far in what it was trying to do, but it really was so close to being a really great Badminton. Much closer than the numbers suggest.

[kcmel]

[QUOTE=CaitlinandTheBay;7571120]
What happened at Jersey?[/QUOTE]

Only half the CCI*** pairs finished XC.

[DCW]

Is there somewhere to watch a replay of it? I cant stomach chalking up 30+ bucks

[goodmorning]

Here’s a great interview I found while scanning YouTube. Lucinda Green & a Badminton Horse. I hope the course doesn’t let up for next year. http://youtu.be/xSMZiyRlYuA

[JER]

[QUOTE=Doodlebug1;7571195]
Vineyridge, I think this is pretty much what I was trying to say about being tipped just slightly too much towards micro-managing - but it WAS quite an old style course - it was not twisty-turny technical, it was big, open and galloping but with a greater element of control than ‘the good old days’.[/QUOTE]

I agree with this. And I was there, if presence counts for anything.

XC was genuinely exciting this year. No horse traps, nothing unfair. Looking at your watch got you absolutely nowhere except an ‘R’ for a knackered horse. Smart riding could move you from 41st place to 2nd.

If that’s not a perfect world in eventing, then I don’t know what is.

In response to some things mentioned earlier:

Lucinda Frederick’s horse whacked the flag with his stifle on the Staircase-area fence. She cleared the final element, galloped a few strides down the hill, and pulled up. This happened right in front of me. Horse was ouchy on that leg. Very obvious what happened.

The first horse out on course looked to be a victim of a slip in the footing and got 20 pens as a result. Otherwise, the ground was really quite good. I’m assuming better than average for a spring UK course because this ground is well-prepared. However, you couldn’t go for time in it.

Horses had to be given a chance to read the fences. This is where problems came up, even with the big names. Miscommunications led to run outs and stops. Nothing wrong with that.

One sign that a horse wasn’t going to get around was a rider who went to the whip early on. Maybe that comes back to pushing the horse too hard in the early part of the course and ending up with nothing left by Huntsman’s Close.

Also, can anyone out there explain to me what benefit there is to giving the horse a smack with the whip at the apex of a jump? Your horse has successfully jumped, as requested, and while in mid-air there is nothing – nothing – he can do to accommodate your request for more velocity. So what is the point of this exercise other than to publicly demonstrate that you’re a dunce when it comes to the laws of physics and probably also of animal training? If you want him to gallop away, you tap him on landing. If you want a snappier takeoff, you tap him on the approach. But a big wallop in the air over the fence?

I’m hoping Paul Tapner hangs on for the win. I really admire his classic riding style.

[nzrider]

Don’t forget that at Badminton, its pretty much all “big names” just because they haven’t won enough to be commonly known of around the world doesn’t mean they haven’t been holding their own in all the 3s in the UK/Europe/rest of world. If they haven’t gotten the results at 3, they don’t get a start because its based on horse rankings. So you don’t get the adult amateurs with only enough rides to qualify turning up to have a crack at it, because they don’t make the start list. You do get very experienced adult amateurs on very experienced horses who are as skilled as many of the big-name riders but don’t have the strings of horses and don’t compete on the continent so much.

I didn’t think it was a terrible course at all watching it. Problems were well spread all around the course. Things like freaking out your horse at the brush key-hole with a bad ride seemed to result in a stop at the Mirage pond, few nasty falls at 18A but interesting that the commentators (inc. guest riders) seemed to be of the opinion that removing 18B had led to riders not giving 18A the respect it deserved and coming in a bit quick. Some slipping problems with the ground that made you gasp, but I suspect it was probably more that the ground was very tiring because it was a bit greasy and the horses had to work that much harder to stay balanced. Which is hugely strength-sapping.

And just having another read through the results, I have heard of pretty much every one of those riders at other events and past badmintons. They are all pretty experienced, just not many recent medal winners!

[tm1]

Interview with Tim Price and Paul Tapner. Favorite quote from Tim Price: “One minute you’re the rooster, then next minute you’re the feather duster.”

[ozjb]

We stayed up to watch Natalie Blundell (daughter’s coach) and then stayed up to watch the whole thing! I was so surprised at the mistakes, falls and eliminations, but happy that there were no serious injuries.

I’m biased, but I thought Nat and Algebra really held their own against the world’s best. She is a wonderful rider on a brave little horse. It would have been a fairy tale if she had make it round clear. Actually, I think it is still a wonderful story. OTTB, former Pony Club horse mixes it up amongst the world’s top riders and horses.

Nat is such a hard worker . . . doesn’t come from money, had to sell almost everything to get overseas, she is a great teacher and coach. Nat is one of the few riders who takes the time to teach kids from way out in the country. And she is soooo humble!

Someone asked if we had watery ditches in Oz. The answer would be no. Ditches, yes, but with water in them? Not often! At least not where we live.

[Fergs]

Here is a video of Mary King making a phenomenal save today (before she pulled up). I have to say that the footing looks pretty craptastic to me.

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=wkg0DHhKOTw&feature=youtu.be