Barefoot trim disaster?

[MellisaNM]

I will definitely keep you all updated. I appreciate all of the advice.

[MellisaNM]

It will be a new farrier. Not that same trimmer.

[Standard_Bread]

@KBC

As an ex pat Brit I have exactly the same reaction when I hear coronary band!

If it’s any consolation (?), I grew up in Pennsylvania in an American family with American trainers and (mostly) other Americans at the barn and I too say coronet band instead of coronary band.

[skydy]

@Standard Bread

If it’s any consolation (?), I grew up in Pennsylvania in an American family with American trainers and (mostly) other Americans at the barn and I too say coronet band instead of coronary band.

I think we’ve sorted it out now. The term coronet was lost in translation, by me, earlier on in this thread.
Either term (coronet or coronary) is correct and is used for the same part of the hoof. The terminology used depends on the geographic location of the user, or the terminology taught to the writer/speaker.

[Standard_Bread]

@skydy

I think we’ve sorted it out now. The term coronet was lost in translation, by me, earlier on in this thread.
Either term (coronet or coronary) is correct and is used for the same part of the hoof. The terminology used depends on the geographic location of the user, or the terminology taught to the writer/speaker.

Sure. And all I was doing was commiserating with KBC about a shared feature of our respective idiolects. Don’t think I was dog piling on you now.

[skydy]

@Standard Bread

Sure. And all I was doing was commiserating with KBC about a shared feature of our respective idiolects. Don’t think I was dog piling on you now.

No sweat. I didn’t think that at all.

[Chall]

Sooo, the right front, in the side view with the left fore, is it growing in new hoof at the top at a tighter angle, a sharper downward slope?

Does that hoof want to be more upright? One person said it’s a high/low situation. Would that be the right fore that wants to be “high”?

Asking this an educational question, not as a “what should be done” question,
because hoof diagnosis is always a mystery to me.
I never see the obvious.

[Palm_Beach]

@S1969

I’d definitely want an xray of that right front. That’s a weird looking foot. And, might as well do them both for comparison. Is the side of that hoof really indented like it looks, or is that a just an effect of the photo or illusion?

It looks like a club foot to me from the couple photos I glanced at.

[Bluey]

I would guess a really good farrier would not have touched that foot without having a vet and x-rays on hand first.

Will be interesting to read what the vet determines is going on there.

[trubandloki]

@Standard Bread

If it’s any consolation (?), I grew up in Pennsylvania in an American family with American trainers and (mostly) other Americans at the barn and I too say coronet band instead of coronary band.

On this line - I have been in NY my whole life and I am as melting pot American as they come. I have learned both terms and use them interchangeably.

OP, I am glad you are getting the vet out and a different farrier. Looking forward to the updates.

[alibi_18]

@Palm Beach

It looks like a club foot to me from the couple photos I glanced at.

Problem is, the club foot doesn’t seem to be there in the « before » picture where the horse still had shoes.

[joiedevie99]

@alibi_18

Problem is, the club foot doesn’t seem to be there in the « before » picture where the horse still had shoes.

I agree. If may be that a good farrier with some x-rays and acrylic can build out a little bit of foot to get the angles lined up better in just one shoeing - while the foot is allowed to regrow.

[hank]

@alibi_18

Problem is, the club foot doesn’t seem to be there in the « before » picture where the horse still had shoes.

Bingo

[Crashing_Boar]

The proper job of any farrier is to make the horse comfortable enough to work sound. Unfortunately, IME most barefoot trimmers are idealogues who care more about proving a theory than making the horse usable. I have told several that if the theory makes the horse unsound, the theory is wrong and the HORSE is right!

Bottom line: If the job makes the horse comfortable and sound for his work, it’s a good job. If not, seek elsewhere. All the theory in the world isn’t worth the powder to blow it to hell if it gets you an unsound, painfully unusable horse. And I mean NOW. The idea that he may “come around” after 6 months or a year of pain is baloney. Best to embrace the job and practitioner that does what’s right for the horse you want to ride over the one who honors unproven “theory” over practical results. BTW our horses have been out of the “natural selection” loop for hundreds of years. A purpose-bred domestic horse is NOT a Mongolian pony, a Prezwalski or a Mustang.

That is all . . .

[MzCarol]

@S1969

4 weeks is a very short schedule for most horses, and 3 weeks is ridiculous unless there is something specific going on (e.g. maybe like a pony that hadn’t been trimmed in 10 years and needing therapeutic trimming.)

There shouldn’t be anything to trim at 3 weeks. Could you smooth the edges? Well, sure. But why? It’s not necessary and most people won’t pay for that. And most farriers/trimmers won’t come out for that, either. It’s a waste of their time and/or they will hurt the horse if they actually “trim” it.

I have to disagree here. I learned to trim my own horses 7 years ago because a good farrier was not to be found in my area. I learned via the Equine Lameness Prevention Organization (ELPO) based out of Colorado. First, one has to fully understand the main goal of trimming in the first place. The main goal is to keep the hoof in proper alignment with respect to P3 (coffin bone). As horses’ feet are continually growing, the hoof distorts based on conformation and thus load baring on said hoof. To keep the foot in proper shape and balance for the longest period of time which is most beneficial to the horse, hooves should be trimmed no more than 4 weeks apart, max 6. The problem is that paying someone to do it costs a lot overall so most people spread out their trims as far as possible, but that isn’t what is best for the horse they love so much. Leaving feet to grow that much in between trims causes the frog to stretch, the proper breakover point of the hoof to be lost, etc. It amazes me to watch how much upper lameness (neck, shoulder, etc) is actually caused by horrible trimming. It’s the truth - no hoof, no horse. Anyway…My own horses are looked at all the time as they are in my backyard and I can tell by looking at them how long it’s been since their last trim because I know them so well and how their feet grow. Yes, I do take a rasp to their feet every 2-3 weeks because I get rid of the flare as soon as it starts to show up which in turn takes less time because I don’t let their feet get to disaster stage and it keeps their feet properly balanced and shaped for the longest amount of time (95%). While there may not be anything to ‘trim’ there is certainly something there to rasp and maintain properly. People are so used to waiting 6-8-10 weeks between trims that they don’t even realize how long their horse is actually out of peak shape - and a lot of times this is what causes sprains, strains and tears.

And yes, agree about no need for a “barefoot trimmer.” Most farriers have lots of clients that they don’t shoe. They CAN shoe if a horse needs it, but they don’t if it doesn’t.

[Palm_Beach]

@MzCarol

I have to disagree here. I learned to trim my own horses 7 years ago because a good farrier was not to be found in my area. I learned via the Equine Lameness Prevention Organization (ELPO) based out of Colorado. First, one has to fully understand the main goal of trimming in the first place. The main goal is to keep the hoof in proper alignment with respect to P3 (coffin bone). As horses’ feet are continually growing, the hoof distorts based on conformation and thus load baring on said hoof. To keep the foot in proper shape and balance for the longest period of time which is most beneficial to the horse, hooves should be trimmed no more than 4 weeks apart, max 6.

Wrong. Mine go 6-8 and have been for many years, and are sound and win lots of competitions. No problems. No distortions, although one gets very very mild flares behind. Mine are in front shoes, though. Maybe your trim just doesn’t hold up.

[KBC]

Re the idea of 4 week trimming, if that’s the case why is 6 week trimming, shoeing the ‘normal’ practice? Hard to believe that 6 was settled on randomly.

[Bluey]

A barefoot hoof will wear or not wear depending on what the horse does and the ground it does it in.

A barefoot pasture ornament horse on nice soft grass will wear differently than one working in an arena or trail riding.

There really is no rule of thumb when it comes to horse feet care

Let common sense and the horse in front of you determine what it needs.

[Redemption3]

@MellisaNM

Vet and farrier will be out. I have her in boots now. Here are some pictures from different angles. I feel really bad that I didn’t stop using this trimmer earlier in the process. These are from yesterday and I have a kind of bad picture of the sole 2 days after the trim. Excuse the fact that it is a little dirty she was sore so not wanting to pick her feet up for me to get a good picture. I will get a better picture when someone else is here to take it. This is not a cheap barefoot trimmer either she charges about 15 dollars more than most trimmers, so I thought since she was pricer she would do a better job. They told me her feet would look bad throughout the transition to barefoot. I made a huge mistake in my judgement.

I feel for you and your horse and am happy to see you’ve gotten good advice and help here. I’m also learning about farriers…

[BabyDentist2021]

I’ve had horses with and without shoes but my current Oldenburg mare is 11 years old (I’ve had her since she was 2 yrs) and she has never had shoes. She’s generally trimmed every 6-8 weeks in the summer and 10-12 weeks in the winter or whenever she looks like she needs a trim/cleaning up. I’ve got a small rasp that I’ll use every now and then just to smooth the edges if she’s getting some chips or flaking and that tends to be all she needs most often. Being barefoot and worked regularly she wears her feet down much more than one with shoes so there’s generally not as much hoof to take off and you need to make sure your farrier is aware of that and doesn’t trim them too short. I also like my farrier to beval the edges - I find they don’t chip as easily.
I’d recommend using any good farrier - not necessarily a “barefoot trimmer” - in my personal experience her worst trims were done by barefoot trimmers - I’ve only used two over the past 9 years but have always been happier with a good farrier.
She is not generally sore after a trim unless she was trimmed a tad short but even that that clears up on its own within a few days.
I would also recommend using a hoof supplement (I’ve got mine on a 1/4 cup Farrier’s Formula Double Strength) and Keratex - I use Keratex Hoof Gel every few days (on the entire hoof - even the underside, frog, and heels). If you need to strengthen the hoof and not just maintain it I would use Keratex Hoof Hardener.
I recently had radiographs taken of my mare’s hooves and the vet said she had very hard but thin soles and excellent angles.

With all of this being said, I don’t think going barefoot works for every horse - one of my thoroughbreds would get a stone bruise almost immediately if he pulled a shoe in the pasture. When I bought mine as a 2 year old I planned on shoeing her when she showed signs of needing them but that day just never came. Definitely easier on my wallet!