Nobody to watch Suzie. But does Suzie need to be watched? What if she’s just reading a book in the lobby waiting for mom or walking along the pastures looking at horses and not causing a problem? What exactly is the issue?
I think kids are far too supervised these days. My childhood was pretty “free-range” as those things go and I would have loved to just spend time at a barn. In a few cases when I was able to, I did and I was very respectful and polite as I was grateful of my time there.
This isn’t black and white… I would say at 14 if the girl has a horse of her own and is of high enough experience than that is perfectly fine she should be able to handle riding her horse on her own. IMO as long as her older sister is watching the girl that is eight than thats fine. If the girl is there like any other boarder and respects the hacking rules of the barn whats the issue, its a question of maturity really. You can get hurt by a horse any time wether or not an adult is present.
my barn has strict rules about dropping kids off and evaporating. under a certain age, the parent or guardian must be on the property the entire time the child is.
If Suzie is a little older, maybe not and if she reading a book waiting to be picked up after a lesson, certainly not.
I was speaking to the practice of some parents that drop the 10-14 or so year old kid off at the end of the driveway to just hang around all day, believe many of the other responses have also been aimed at that situation. May or may not own or lease a horse, may or may not take a lesson but they are there for hours on end with nothing in particular to do. Nothing to eat either, we’ve bought a few something out of the vending machines feeling sorry for them there for hours.
If if a parent chooses a more free range parenting style, that’s fine. But if it involves somebody else’s property and somebody else’s business with the expectation somebody else will supervise them? Somebody else has every right to say no and there are some good reasons for doing so.
Barn Owner should have a policy regarding unaccompanied minors, post it, communicate it to all boarders and lesson parents, and do his/her best to see that it is enforced. The Barn Owner is the one assuming any liability and also the one insuring the facility and operations — so s/he needs to know what the insurance coverage requires and what they are personally comfortable with. While it is certainly true that some young people are more experienced and responsible than others the same age, it can get messy if you allow some kids to be in the barn unsupervised but not others that are the same age. If the barn is a lesson oriented facility with a good number of young people involved it’s also wise to realize that not all parents have any horse knowledge or good sense so best not to leave it up to the parents.
Dropped off with no reason to be there and expected to be supervised and fed at no cost? WTH? Sorry, I was not imagining a scenario like this. It’s hard to imagine even after you describe seeing it. I was thinking more of the barn rats that are around after riding, work the day camps (kids are allowed to work day camps with trainer approval at age 11), etc. I see these types at my barn on a regular basis so I can tell by sight usually if they are supposed to be there. I would question anyone at my barn that looked out of place and/or hanging around with nothing to do. Kid or adult.
Correct, this was not addressed to legitimate barn rats with reason to be there.
I feel sorry for these driveway drop off kids. I know one was a month behind in lesson fees which was horrifically awkward and another told her Mom stories about how many horses she rode every day…who knows what motivates parents here never to come into the barn. But it’s not up to the barn to solve that or be responsible for entertaining or providing free day care/lessons/rides for these kids.
My trainer eventually caught the one behind in bills at the end of the drive to stop the kid from being dropped off and told the parent of the other their kid was not riding anything except the lesson horse in the lesson…and that was horrifically awkward for the poor trainer. Shouldn’t ever be in those situations as a business owner.
I, and a group of girls my age, were at the barn almost all day all summer essentially unsupervised. Probably from age 8. There was one adult worker and maybe a trainer on site, but both were always busy working. The stipulation for us being there was that we were useful! We did a lot of barn work, but also rode a lot.
Maybe this was uncommon. I am 23, so I don’t think my experience counts as ‘back in the good ol’ days’ either.
Dependent on the situation I’d say
At a barn, I think it would be very logical for the BO/BM to know exactly what their liability insurance will or will not cover when it comes to minors, and set their own barn policy based on that.
With that said, think of other situations where kids are dropped off or left alone. Kids go to the park all the time on their own (granted, those are usually public/city places). Kids may be dropped off for sports practice while the parent goes and runs errands. Kids may run over to the local convenience store on their bike by themselves and go buy some candy. Etc.
Obviously, it is up to the BO/BM to decide their own barn policy. In my opinion, I don’t see anything wrong with the kids being there by themselves.
When I was about 12 (or probably younger), I would catch, saddle, and ride my horses by myself. I started playing sports when I was in the 5th grade (roughly age 10 or 11) and I would sit at the school by myself after practice, and wait for my parents to get there to pick me up (with farming/ranching, they were sometimes late if they had trouble in the field). At even younger ages, I’d be left home alone at times.
I too think that most kids nowadays are way too “monitored”. Give 'em a little freedom!
At the time, in my state, I had my driver’s license at age 14 and was driving myself where I needed to go (legally 
). Was driving vehicles on the farm WELL before that age… 
Our barn has a rule that no minors ride without an adult present to supervise (usually the parent, unless the trainer is there). However, the rule is sometimes not enforced for kids age 15 and up.
As a parent, I would be very uncomfortable with any kid riding alone (not too keen on adults doing it either). Any horse can spook and leave you unconscious or injured, with no way to call for help. It’s just not a good idea. I often think that parents who do the drop-off are very ignorant about the potential risks.
[QUOTE=Foxglove6;8658084]
Nobody to watch Suzie. But does Suzie need to be watched? What if she’s just reading a book in the lobby waiting for mom or walking along the pastures looking at horses and not causing a problem? What exactly is the issue?
. . …[/QUOTE]Lol, the Suzy’s that I knew hung out on the shavings pile behind the arena wall and would slide down the shavings, then run around and climb on the office roof to jump down on the pile again, or if certain ones were there they would pop their heads over the wall or bang on the wall and scare us in the arena. My trainer read them the riot act over that.
Wow, this thread really took off overnight. Thanks for all the input.
In this particular situation, both sisters seem unusually focused and responsible for their respective ages. Both are coming to ride and do horse things - not just hang out. Giving the parents the benefit of the doubt, maybe they just assumed trainer was there as she normally is on that day and time.
Younger sister half leases a very reliable school pony, but older sister has just graduated to ownership with a fairly green horse who has had a couple of verifiable green moments - and that is really my main cause for concern. Not so much that she is dealing with the horse independently but that if - God forbid - something really bad happened, it might not be noticed for a while - or it might be on the 8yo to take action.
At my prior barn (small, no resident trainer), expectations around minors and supervision was situational - based on both the kid and the horse. But this is a larger multi-discipline barn with several resident trainers.
I think I am going to see if this is addressed in the boarding agreement at all and decide whether to generically mention it to management based on what I find there.
This is something for the barn to discuss with their insurance company, first of all.
I was a beginner rider, given a small horse on my 14th birthday, and I took on total care of her at a nearby backyard barn with no arena or trainers. I rode her down the sidewalks to the trails from day one. With no helmet. And no cellphone (they didn’t exist yet). And figured out how to retrain her bad habits on my own. Now, this was far far away in time, and there were no adults at the barn to be bothered by us. So I do think a competent rider in early teens can be left alone with a horse. And she might be competent to oversee an 8 or 9 year old.
My sister got her own horse at 11, after I’d had mine for a winter, and went riding with me up and down the sidewalks and trails. Bareback. But I think mostly girls didn’t get their own horses in our community until they were 12 or 13.
But I can also see how children loose in a big boarding barn might make everyone more nervous, than children hanging out at a small backyard facility with neighbours around, and fewer rules and other people’s unpredictable horses to get in trouble with.
That said, the freedom from adults and the chance to be totally responsible for something were hugely important to me as a teen rider. I can’t imagine growing up with today’s helicopter parents. I watched five adults (two non-horsey parents, horse owner and husband, plus coach) micromanage a competent eleven year old tacking up her lease horse for a lesson a few weeks ago, and thought if that was me, I’d have run screaming.
I don’t have a clear answer. If I was the kids, I’d feel I wanted and deserved the freedom and responsibility. If I was an adult in the barn, I’d feel some responsibility to keep an eye on the kids, and that would take away from my own enjoyment of my own barn time.
Also, what is ‘adult supervision’? Is it helicopter mum sitting on the bench in the arena watching every move, and telling the girls to cut it short cause they have to get home for dinner, even if mum knows nothing about horses and could do nothing but shriek in an emergency, and often gives the kids wrong information or suggestions? Is it an actual lesson? Does the trainer have supervised rides where she keeps an eye on things? Is it enough to have a barn worker cleaning stalls (wearing her Ipod or blathering away on her bluetooth, and oblivious to the rest of the world)? Does having another adult rider on the premises (like the OP) count as supervision even if the adult rider has no connection to the family, and doesn’t want the worry? On the other hand, isn’t it good if the kids come down at a quiet time in the barn schedule, and can putter around and enjoy their horses without getting under the feet of the dressage queens and other cranky adults?
Life has changed.
I understand the liability thing, though, from the owner’s perspective.
but when I was a kid, if you hung around the barn, you got handed a pitchfork and put to work.
[QUOTE=HLMom;8658284]
As a parent, I would be very uncomfortable with any kid riding alone (not too keen on adults doing it either). Any horse can spook and leave you unconscious or injured, with no way to call for help. It’s just not a good idea. I often think that parents who do the drop-off are very ignorant about the potential risks.[/QUOTE]
As far as riding alone goes, that is 99% of my riding. If I didn’t ride alone, I wouldn’t get to ride at all. I do always have my cell phone with me (strapped to me; not the horse) but that is part of the RISK that I take with swinging a leg over a horse whether I am alone or not; accidents can happen.
[QUOTE=HLMom;8658284]
Younger sister half leases a very reliable school pony, but older sister has just graduated to ownership with a fairly green horse who has had a couple of verifiable green moments - and that is really my main cause for concern. Not so much that she is dealing with the horse independently but that if - God forbid - something really bad happened, it might not be noticed for a while - or it might be on the 8yo to take action. [/QUOTE]
When I was 14, I had pestered my mom for quite a while to let me ride the 4-year-old green horse she started (and unbeknowest to her, I had already been sneaking a ride on him here and there 
). She gave him a little “tune up” in the spring and finally said FINE! Go ride him. And I did. And that included alone riding on him.
She never got him back, btw.
But of course, remember that “bad things” can just as easily happen on a bombproof been-there-done-that horse too! That doesn’t guarantee you are “safe”.
Barn staff are not free babysitters. I hated boarders who tried to pull stuff like this.
I once had mother try to get me to watch her 7yr old ride after 5pm. Just so she could get her son to hockey. There was no one else at the barn. I had my own kids to pick up from after school care. Some people have no concept that others have lives too. I needed to remind a lot of boarders that I wasn’t a barn kid to use and abuse.
I’d like to add to what I said above. Several folks have commented that kids are over-supervised and that who’s independent enough to be left at the barn is situational. I agree with this completely.
However, it’s important for rules to be carefully enforced. For every kid who can help run the barn, there are six who will just loiter around, get in the way of people working, and be a liability if they get injured.
For what it’s worth, me and a friend were essentially helping run a camp and lesson program starting at about ages 14 and 12. This involved independently handling a lot of horses and semi-independently supervising other kids in the 8-12 range. It was a lot of responsibility and a wonderful experience. BUT: The BO/trainer lived on site, so there was always an adult on the property, and there was always a trainer watching when anyone rode. I also remember we sometimes lied about our ages around parents, because it was not the case that just any teenagers were welcome to show up at the barn outside of scheduled lessons.
I cannot think of any circumstances when I would be ok with a kid in the 7-11 range handling horses without an adult in the vicinity. Kids this age can absolutely be responsible and good horsepeople, but accidents happen. A single teenage supervisor is inadequate. What happens if a horse goes down, or a stirrup breaks, or horses get loose - etc?
Life and times have changed. Now it’s almost impossible to find a part time job at 15/17. No one wants to pay the high minimum wage to minors. It’s easier to only hire 18+.
It’s not wether a kid is responsible/mature or not. If they are under 18, an adult has to be responsible for them.
The public boarding barn that I board at has not policy about minors being at the barn by themselves and this is in California. Heck the trainer does not care either if they ride without supervision as long as they only ride their horses. However as a parent, it makes me uncomfortable. However, I have to remind myself that these children are not my responsibility.
I think the difference on it being OK to drop your kids or not drop your kids is the communication with the barn owner or other adults associated with the barn.
A parent that drops the kids, no matter how responsible and independent the kids are, but does not first confirm with the barn owner that it is OK and that there is an adult somewhere in case of emergency is a very irresponsible parent. People (the barn owner mainly) should have a choice on being in charge of extra kids or not.
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