BE Requires Skull Caps--Your thoughts?

[Snugglerug]

British Eventing Now Requires Skull Caps on Cross Country at All Levels -...

I’m relatively new to eventing and only going BN (and I’m old, so I have no aspirations to the upper levels.) I’m not well-versed in the skull cap/helmet debate, and I would like some input from some of the more experienced riders/medical professionals/research people on the forums.

Do you think skull caps offer a safety advantage? Is there any research to support that, or is it all anecdotal? I’m a safety girl, so if there is a significant advantage, I’ll be all over it. Up to now, I’ve just continued riding in my 1k.

Thanks for the input!

[Willesdon]

This is the statement from BE to clarify the rule: http://www.britisheventing.com/asp-net/news/item.aspx?id=5313

BE is probably the leading authority on safety in eventing and has consistently engaged in research over many years, leading the way in innovations such as frangible pins, reporting and analysis of fall data, keeping an event incident log etc etc. If BE has clarified the rules to ban fixed brims it will have solid reasons to do so.

Having said that, most people in the UK probably already use skulls XC pretty much automatically

[Sticky_Situation]

I personally would be interested to see the science behind the decision.

I have been aware of the reasoning which many people cite when saying they believe skull caps to be safer - the belief that a fixed peak could cause torque on and therefore injury to the neck during a fall.

However, I don’t recall having seen any actual science to support of refute this position.

As I recall, BE also recently banned helmet cams based on a similar rationale, and although the possibility of helmet cams contributing to helmet failure is certainly worthy of being looked into, the only “evidence” cited at that time was speculation by a journalist that it may have been a factor in an accident that happened in another sport.

Clearly, they are making an effort to improve the safety of the sport, which is admirable … I just hope it’s being done based on the best available science and not just personal opinions and traditions.

[sunhawk]

I think that if there really is any danger from a fixed brim, it would be more related to jumping position, and the chances of going off over the front end, which doesn’t need a hat to fix, just some coaching, and building good riding habits

[Willesdon]

As I recall, BE also recently banned helmet cams based on a similar rationale, and although the possibility of helmet cams contributing to helmet failure is certainly worthy of being looked into, the only “evidence” cited at that time was speculation by a journalist that it may have been a factor in an accident that happened in another sport.

Precautionary principle? As it happens, BE have not be able to raise the money to pay for the research on hat cams.

[nzrider]

Neck injuries aside (I’ve got no opinion on whether that is an issue or not) - fixed peaks can cause facial injuries too. If you hit the ground at the right angle the peak is pushed down onto your face and can cause some quite nasty cuts. This I have personal experience of! Right under the eye, needed stitches

[Equibrit]

It may have to do with this;

European Equestrian Riding Helmet standard to be withdrawn

last updated on January 22, 2015 16:28
Amended 22 January 2015 - It has been announced by the EU Commission that the European Equestrian Riding Helmet standard (BS)EN1384 is to be withdrawn from the Official Journal of the European Union (OJ) at its next publication. This means that hat manufacturers will no longer be able to CE mark their hats using this standard and will need to recertify to a specification currently being developed.

The withdrawal of the standard has no effect on riding hats already on the market. Once a hat has been manufactured to a standard it will not become “non-standard” after withdrawal and can continue to be sold and worn. If riders have hats certified to the EN1384 they can continue to use them unless stated otherwise by rules of competition.

The existing EN1384 standard is currently in the process of revision. The withdrawal is due in part to the European working group responsible for the hat standard failing to reach an agreement on this overdue revision and subsequently causing the Commission to take this drastic step.

The draft proposal for the revision to EN1384 has to go through the laborious procedure of comment and review and it is still unclear when the final version will be published. An interim specification is being developed by a group of EU test houses and notified bodies (VG1) that will span the gap with a new specification and this is now available.
In the future, CE marked riding hats will have to be successfully tested and certified against an alternative specification to allow CE certification to continue. Companies can choose which they use and could include the new VG1 specification, the revised EN1384 once published, PAS015 or Snell.

The EN1384 and thus the BSEN1384 specifications have proved to be a popular standard throughout Europe with a wide appeal and have saved many riders from head injury, or death.

Whilst initially being promised a period of transition by the Department for Business, Innovation and Skills (BIS), the industry has now received news that this option has been retracted. This means that manufacturers will need to re-certify their (BS)EN1384 hats to the revised specification sooner than anticipated.

As a result of these recent changes, the disciplines and riding bodies within the UK will be reconsidering their hat rules for the future. Full details of the changes currently available are listed below.

Please note that where EN1384 is referred to this will impact upon hats that only meet that standard. Where hats are dual badged (ie. (BS) EN1384 with another standard such as Snell or PAS 015) then the hat will continue to be legal in competition.

British Eventing
British Eventing will permit (BS)EN1384 hats in 2015 but not thereafter.
All hats will be retagged in 2016 at which stage no hats made solely to (BS)EN1384 will be tagged or permitted for use.

Riding Clubs – British Riding Clubs will permit (BS)EN1384 hats in 2015 but not thereafter.
All hats will be retagged in 2016 at which stage no hats made solely to (BS)EN1384 will be tagged or permitted for use.

The Pony Club - will permit (BS)EN1384 hats in 2015 but not thereafter. Full details of the revised Hat Tagging procedure will be communicated out to the Membership and Volunteers shortly.

British Dressage – will permit (BS)EN1384 hats in 2015 but not thereafter

British Showjumping - will permit (BS)EN1384 hats in 2015 but not thereafter

British Horse Society – will permit (BS)EN1384 hats in 2015 but not thereafter. From 1 January 2016 hats made solely to (BS)EN1384 will not be permitted for use in BHS Approved Centres.

EN 1384 1996 / BSEN1384 1997 with CE markThe current European standard. This is the basic minimum standard for almost all formsof riding.

PAS 015:2011This specification is the BSI’s enhanced EN1384 standard offering more protection than the EN1384. this has been revised in 2011 with an increased drop height.

ASTM F 1163;2004a with SEI markThe American Standard

Aust/New Zealand SNZ 3838;2006 with SAI global markThe Australian and New Zealand Standard

Snell E2001The Snell Foundation Standard

[BritishEquestrian]

From what I’ve heard, it is a decision make due to the impact of the head cam which could have worsened Schumacher’s injury… I know BE haven’t the funds to research but there assumption is that hard peaked hats and head cams can affect head injuries especially with some of the fatalities last season involving hard peaked hats.

[vineyridge]

Given brain slosh when the head hits the ground, is it possible that a fixed brim would contribute to the severity of concussion as well the above mentioned neck injury possibility?

[poltroon]

It sounds to me like they’re not only banning fixed brims a la ye olden days but the lightweight plastic brims that snap to helmets that are currently common. I don’t see the point in that - those things pop right off.

I too would like to know the science behind this. I’m not aware of any injuries in the last few years that were attributed to helmet brims.

The impression I’m left with is also that it’s not clear that ventilated helmets would be permitted, just given what they wrote.

If they’re worried about rotational brain injuries, I’d note that IIRC, the two helmets that have designs to deal with that wouldn’t qualify.

[Equibrit]

I think they have said that anything attached to the helmet prevents it from doing it’s job. I would imagine that a protrusion would prevent the padding etc from coming in to play.

[poltroon]

[QUOTE=Equibrit;8036585]
I think they have said that anything attached to the helmet prevents it from doing it’s job. I would imagine that a protrusion would prevent the padding etc from coming in to play.[/QUOTE]

The lightly attached, lightweight plastic visors as on for example:

http://www.troxelhelmets.com/products/intrepid
http://www.devonaire.com/Devonaire-1019-Spectrum-Adult-Helmet-Brand-0-CPath-5-pid-1333.html
http://www.bitofbritain.com/Ovation_Schooler_Helmet_p/3406.htm

are unlikely to cause a problem.

I would also delicately note that there is a predominant vendor of skullcaps.

A textured surface, as a skullcap typically has, might be more likely to cause rotational brain injury than a more polished surface.

So if there’s science, let’s see it. If not, then I think the action is ridiculous.

[FatCatFarm]

What poltroon said. I ride motorcycles too and there has been a similar nonsensical argument going on that motorcycle helmets while preventing skull injuries can actually cause you to break your neck in a crash, which is the argument bikers often use to support their right to ride helmetless.

My daughter and I routinely ride in our Tipperary brimmed helmets at home and on trails and are very happy with them. A while back, she got dumped by a pony and face planted, and the visor/brim breaking off upon impact of the Troxel helmet she was riding in, is the only thing that saved her face from injury. I recently switched to riding in a skull cap on cross crountry because when riding in my protective vest, a Tipperary, the back of it pushes up across my shoulders and can push my brimmed show helmet, an Ovation, forward from the base interfering with my field of vision. The skull cap I purchased is a Tipperary Titan and not a CO. I love the Tipperary Sportage helmets and if I grow unhappy with the skull cap, will just pick up another Sportage in black since my older one is hunter green and I prefer plain black gear to show in and don’t have colors, and I do like having a visor/brim on hot sunny days.

[Highflyer]

[QUOTE=poltroon;8037134]
The lightly attached, lightweight plastic visors as on for example:

http://www.troxelhelmets.com/products/intrepid
http://www.devonaire.com/Devonaire-1019-Spectrum-Adult-Helmet-Brand-0-CPath-5-pid-1333.html
http://www.bitofbritain.com/Ovation_Schooler_Helmet_p/3406.htm

are unlikely to cause a problem.

I would also delicately note that there is a predominant vendor of skullcaps.

A textured surface, as a skullcap typically has, might be more likely to cause rotational brain injury than a more polished surface.

So if there’s science, let’s see it. If not, then I think the action is ridiculous.[/QUOTE]

If it IS science, shouldn’t it be required for all phases/ disciplines, not just xc, too? I actually wear one of the plastic Ovation helmets with the brim snapped off and a regular helmet cover over it, so I guess I am covered anyway.

[retreadeventer]

I think the testing standard being changed is the culprit, as Equibrit posted - I tried to make sense out of that…
Meanwhile, in 'Murica, we have the ASTM standard which is from what I know, having been at one time in the business of selling tack, considered a worldwide standard equal if not superior to the equivalent British testing standard. ASTM stands for the American Society for Testing and Materials, which is now ASTM International (since 2001 according to website.)
I did a story years ago on the first sorts of testings of equestrian helmets and basically a hydraulic cylinder slams the helmet onto a surface then measures various parameters. In the beginning the British “approved” helmets FAILED all ASTM tests. So the American manufacturers had to develop newer helmets with different abilities, which they did - Troxel and International spent a lot of money developing new products that would be retailable and make back their D money - when helmet use was not as socially forward as it is today.
All of which is ancient history now - helmet quality has improved from the early days and Charles Owen is one helmet make based in UK that passes ASTM and is sold here. I don’t see the “brimless” standard coming up in the US because so far I don’t think ASTM has a test that shows a fixed brim being different but I could be wrong. I hope that going forward that scientific research is the basis for all decisions regarding safety equipment and not politics but … that could be a vain hope …
(Here’s the link to the pdf about ASTM helmet standards - guess what you have to pay for it, it’s not free! http://www.astm.org/Standards/F1163.htm)

[bornfreenowexpensive]

[QUOTE=retreadeventer;8037386]
I think the testing standard being changed is the culprit, as Equibrit posted - I tried to make sense out of that…
Meanwhile, in 'Murica, we have the ASTM standard which is from what I know, having been at one time in the business of selling tack, considered a worldwide standard equal if not superior to the equivalent British testing standard. ASTM stands for the American Society for Testing and Materials, which is now ASTM International (since 2001 according to website.)
I did a story years ago on the first sorts of testings of equestrian helmets and basically a hydraulic cylinder slams the helmet onto a surface then measures various parameters. In the beginning the British “approved” helmets FAILED all ASTM tests. So the American manufacturers had to develop newer helmets with different abilities, which they did - Troxel and International spent a lot of money developing new products that would be retailable and make back their D money - when helmet use was not as socially forward as it is today.
All of which is ancient history now - helmet quality has improved from the early days and Charles Owen is one helmet make based in UK that passes ASTM and is sold here. I don’t see the “brimless” standard coming up in the US because so far I don’t think ASTM has a test that shows a fixed brim being different but I could be wrong. I hope that going forward that scientific research is the basis for all decisions regarding safety equipment and not politics but … that could be a vain hope …
(Here’s the link to the pdf about ASTM helmet standards - guess what you have to pay for it, it’s not free! http://www.astm.org/Standards/F1163.htm)[/QUOTE]

I thought ASTM DOES have issus with fixed brims. That is why even the hats like COs that do have brims have short ones that do break away or crush in an impact.

I’ve had a brim help save my face with a horse rearing and flinging their heads around…It doesn’t offer complete protection but did offer a little!

[blackwly]

[QUOTE=retreadeventer;8037386]
I think the testing standard being changed is the culprit, as Equibrit posted - I tried to make sense out of that…
Meanwhile, in 'Murica, we have the ASTM standard which is from what I know, having been at one time in the business of selling tack, considered a worldwide standard equal if not superior to the equivalent British testing standard. ASTM stands for the American Society for Testing and Materials, which is now ASTM International (since 2001 according to website.)
I did a story years ago on the first sorts of testings of equestrian helmets and basically a hydraulic cylinder slams the helmet onto a surface then measures various parameters. In the beginning the British “approved” helmets FAILED all ASTM tests. So the American manufacturers had to develop newer helmets with different abilities, which they did - Troxel and International spent a lot of money developing new products that would be retailable and make back their D money - when helmet use was not as socially forward as it is today.
All of which is ancient history now - helmet quality has improved from the early days and Charles Owen is one helmet make based in UK that passes ASTM and is sold here. I don’t see the “brimless” standard coming up in the US because so far I don’t think ASTM has a test that shows a fixed brim being different but I could be wrong. I hope that going forward that scientific research is the basis for all decisions regarding safety equipment and not politics but … that could be a vain hope …
(Here’s the link to the pdf about ASTM helmet standards - guess what you have to pay for it, it’s not free! http://www.astm.org/Standards/F1163.htm)[/QUOTE]

Fwiw, I did a very thorough consulting project for the U.S. Polo Assoc a few years ago which involved some extensive research into all the available equestrian helmet standards (for those who don’t know me, I am a neurosurgeon who does a fair amount of consulting on sports related TBI). I reviewed the British standards as well as ASTM, NOCSAE, SNELL, etc. I did not find any evidence that there is increased risk of injury when using a helmet with a brim. I’m not aware of any newly breaking research on the subject, and I keep up with this field quite closely. I can’t come up with any scientific basis for the BE rule change. We can all imagine instances where a brim COULD be helpful or harmful, but I think the evidence isn’t there.

I’m not doing anything different based in this rule change, myself.

[connemarafan]

I think some of the changes are to due with helmets with ventilation also, I know there has been a big shakeup in the UK as far as the standards but that these are not being implemented until 2016. Strangely the CO SJ XP (fixed peak) is supposedly still up to standard but the CO H2 SQ (v similar looking with fixed peak) is not. I don’t think ASTM alone is up to BE standard…

[netg]

I’ve also been helped by a brim, but never hurt by one. I came off a horse who bucked on landing after taking quite a flyer over a jump so I was already unbalanced, and landed face-down. I had a bloody nose, but with my Jewish-sized nose, suspect the brim prevented a broken nose.

[Snugglerug]

Wow, so much good info and commentary here to consider! I just wanted to pop back in and thank everyone who has commented, and let you know I am reading and learning. As with most things horse, there doesn’t seem to be a consensus, but I’m getting a lot of good input to help me make my personal decision. So thanks, and as long as the discussion continues, I’ll keep following along!