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Before you turn down a horse with Kissing Spine

I hear a lot of people who are very resistant to any kissing spines found in a horse, and I wanted to share about one of my horses.

As a little background, I’ve become a lot more aware of KS in the past couple years, as I found out my green horse (5 at the time) as grade 4 KS and is now on a maintenance program for that (shockwave, mesotherapy, Equibands, etc.). His is pretty severe, but he is going well overall. I initially brought him in because I felt him get tight in his back, like a “hump” in his back, not for behavioral issues.

Since then I hear a lot of friends or clients say they would never buy a horse with kissing spines and how the horse is doomed for a life of pain and you’ll never be able to compete and blah blah.

So, yesterday, when I had my vet out (VEI, for those local to northern VA) for our heading-into-spring injections and soundness evaluation, I asked them to radiograph my coming 16yo Prelim/2* OTTB horse’s back. Out of curiosity. He has been Prelim over 20 times in his career and done two 2* events successfully. He is not the most correct in dressage (gets stiff in his poll, tight, etc.), but is a great tidy jumper and incredibly solid and saintly.

He ended up having Grade 1/2 KS in most of his back and some areas of Grade 3. Call that mild-moderate. His back had never been xrayed till this point in his life and he’s never had any special therapy or treatment for his back. He loves his job and has pricked ears the entire time we are jumping, especially XC. So, if you are out there vetting a green horse and it ends up showing kissing spines, consider that it bothers some horses and doesn’t bother others and to look at the whole picture. :slight_smile:

I’ll let you know in about 5 years how the Grade 4 gelding ends up!

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Different people have different risk tolerances based on their experiences with horses they have owned or known well and often depending in their budget for treatment and possible continuing maintenance, And some people just jump on the bandwagon because they read it on the internet and dont buy horses anyway.

“ It depends” is really the best answer even if its not the solution or answer most people are looking for.

Thanks for sharing your interesting personal experience and will be interested in seeing how the young horse does for you. Best of luck.

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There are many people who wont go near a horse with kissing spines because of their experience. I would not purchase a horse with KS based on my personal experience with two. Neither were able to be ridden after a ton of effort to make them comfortable. For me it is not worth the risk, worry and possible cost to maintain one with KS.

Wishing you success with your gelding.

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You’re talking about two different situations: the horse you might buy, or the horse you already have.

When you already have the horse, you deal with whatever problems come up as they come up, as you are doing with your two. Luckily, only one of them has caused you extra expense and worry so far. However, when you’re horse shopping, you have to decide whether to take the chance the horse with KS will be okay, or the chance that he’ll be useless in short order. Same for any other issues it might have. It’s much easier to walk away and avoid the risk than to take on the unknown.

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I think the OP knows this. I think what they are trying to say is, kind of like ugly side bone X-rays, ugly kissing spine X-rays might not be the end of career thing so take into account the horse itself, not just the X-rays.
I am sure the OP is not trying to tell someone to buy something by just ignoring the X-rays.

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I agree with Mango20, though. I do not think the original poster is saying “ignore x-rays” but “oh, it may not be so bad”. But then again, it may. I have not had a bad experience with kissing spine but I would not buy a horse with kissing spine - it isn’t worth the risk, I am on a limited budget, I have to board my horse so if I end up with a horse I cannot ride, then I am SoL as far as riding goes so why would I start with a horse with potential serious issues? Besides that, why buy a horse that may buck me off one day because of pain? I do not bounce well enough for that.

That being said, if I x-ray’ed my mare tomorrow and found out she has kissing spine, I would work with. She’s already mine, I am keeping her for the rest of her life, I already made that commitment. That is not the same as looking at a horse.

This falls into line with arthitic changes, navicular changes, previous colic or bowed tendons, and a host of other things that may or may not effect a horse. Some people are willing to take the risk, some not. It depends on a lot of factors like the willingness to keep an unsound horse for potentially 20 years or ability to have a second horse if this one is unsound - ties into budget, whether or not you board, etc.

I woul not fault anyone for sending back a horse that was 100% in everything except the ONE thing. They may not be clinical now but they may in a year, maybe never, but why start with a obstacle?

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I feel like that’s exactly what she’s trying to do. If I vetted a horse and it was sound and doing the job I wanted but showed kissing spines, I’d pass. Unless there was a major discount. If it wasn’t doing what I wanted it to do already I’d pass despite any discount.

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Interesting timing. (If you do have a horse with KS and are interested in becoming part of the study, maybe call because the submission date is today!) I’m sending my information in.

Regarding, this study and discussion with vets, there is a hypothesis that the reason KS is becoming more prevalent or a larger “Red Flag,” is that more people are now taking x-rays for it, and many horses that are in work, or previously were, were just never diagnosed. (So it may be more common than presumed.)

From personal experience, my current 3*** mare of the past 5 years, I finally took xrays last fall, she has it fairly extensively. To far for surgery. But, she has great results and reactions to monthly PEMF sessions.

My barn also has a very large sales program, we’ve had 3 horses come in with KS, sent them to UGA to have the surgery. They come back with a little patch on their back, and then they’re back to regular work in a few week. I am not familiar with the costs of the KS surgery, but it’s enough that some under “10k sale horses” have had it done, and the recoop time was very quick.

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Good link! That’s actually my vet practice that’s part of the study.

I thought the recoop time for KS surgery was several months?

So I believe there’s two types of surgeries. The ligament transection, the recoop time is 6-weeks to have a saddle on. But ours (the ones at my barn) could go on turnout fairly quickly. It’s just for the wound on the spine to heal. I think the cost is $800-$1200. This must be what ours did, I mean the horses came back in a day, few days, a patch on their back, then out on turnout. (Also, I know at least one used insurance to take care of.)

The second is a bit more invasive because bone is actually removed, and I think ranges in the $3,000 with a few more weeks rehab.

I mean, Idk, if its true that so many more horses have KS than we know of and the horse has had a successful career, with my own previous experiences I don’t think I would be so dissuaded while consulting with my vet his opinion.

Having had the misfortune to own two horses with kissing spine, it is not something I would ever willingly undergo again. The myriad of ways I tried to manage their discomfort - the saddle fitting, flocking, vet visits, the injections, the chiro, the massage, the robaxin, the surgery, the bills, the heartache, the hours invested. The constant internal questioning if I was unfairly asking my horse to work through (what level?) discomfort for my riding pleasure. No thank you.

I am glad the OP had different mileage than me. My journey was not easy or successful, and ultimately neither horse was able to successfully hold the low-level job I asked of them :frowning:

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This. We just had a horse diagnosed with severe KS about a month ago, the only symptom being some mild girthiness when tacking up and tail swishing when asked to canter. When our vet showed us the x-rays he said he couldn’t believe the horse let us ride him because he must have been in a large amount of pain. In my opinion it would be difficult to tell if the horse is actually not in pain, or if they are just good natured and trying to work through it for you.

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I thought this snippet was interesting

The horse’s height, for example, “has a very, very strong impact,”

Now I’m curious to know what heights and what impact!

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This is quite interesting as I wouldn’t have thought the surgery would be a worthwhile investment for a sales horse in that price range. Presumably the surgery is being disclosed to buyers? Any idea how the asking price is affected by the diagnosis and surgery? Meaning, if the horse started out at $10k, what does it go down to?

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I wondered that also. I contacted them and asked. Good lordy I was raised with the 5 W’s of journalism and it’s not practiced these days.

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I look forward to when they publish their findings in peer reviewed journals. They are trying to develop genetic tests to sell. While that’s a great goal if there truly is a solid genetic link to KS, it makes me think of the PSSM2 genetic tests that are popular right now for which there is no peer reviewed publications and the interpretation of the genetic results are questionable at best. Based on the last line of the article, they clearly haven’t really tested enough horses without KS to determine the validity of the findings they have so far. It also doesn’t address other published research that indicates a huge number of horses with KS of varying degrees that are never symptomatic. In the meantime, it seems wise not deliberately breed horses with symptomatic KS (which can be tricky to determine in the first place), especially where that symptomatic KS has proven impossible to manage (e.g. resulted in untimely retirement or euthanasia). But for all other cases…I’m not convinced…

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5ws and H for how was my middle school English teacher’s motto. Scarce these days for sure.

Please let me know if you find anything out!

I think it is good that research is being done. Research has to start somewhere. I got the impression the study was ongoing so I look forward to further information being available.

In a slightly similar situation, there is evidently some sort of genetic component to a particular aggressive, unstable temperament disorder in some dog breeds, one of which is Belgian Malinois. Certain sectors are calling for a halt to be placed on breeding dogs with the identified gene(s). Others are advocating for euthanasia for these dogs and even young puppies. On the other hand, many have adult dogs with the responsible genes that do not exhibit the aggressive, unstable temperament. Many argue that the presence of these gene(s) is of less concern than proper raising and training. I’m not terribly up to date on the whole thing as my Malinois has a solid, reliable temperament. But I understand the matter has ongoing research.

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I got some answer back pretty asap. The research article was on Horse.com

Thank you for your message. Though Christa was summarizing the overarching take-homes given in this scientific presentation, I am also curious and see how detailing this example would be important.

I pulled up and listened to this part of the session. Dr. Brooks, the geneticist, asks Dr. Whittaker, the veterinarian, for a rundown on the biomechanics of what she had just said. It was pretty technical, but my understanding is that as a horse gets taller and body mass increases, more forces are exerted across the back, and the soft tissue structures supporting the back do not increase in strength accordingly. He said this explains why veterinarians see greater rates of kissing spines in taller horses,

Before we add this detail to the story, we are double-checking its accuracy with the researchers. In the meantime, I hope it helps.

Thanks for the constructive feedback.

Stephanie
Editor-in-Chief

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