Begging to make something out of myself in the equestrian world...

In defense of the English Major…

You can go to grad school with an English major, by the way.

I went to law school after finishing a double major (in English and yikes, History :lol:) and I graduated and have since passed the Bar. The attorney thing is the means by which I support my expensive horse habit.

My knowledge of the English language and literature has made me a far better communicator and writer than I ever would have been without it. The art of writing, spelling, and communication is becoming a lost art and I think that there is real value in an English major.

Minor Vent over.

There is a lot of great advice here, even if it might not be what you want to hear.

My experience as someone who considered herself a hard worker and one who would ride anything as a teen and twentysomething, is that working hard is not necessarily working smart. I think we of little means and big aspirations get so very stuck on the fact that we love horses and want to be with them all day, everyday. So how do we make it happen? We clean stalls, groom, braid, etc. and if we do it well enough, someone will reward us with a ride or two, or lessons, or a free horse to show. We don’t really think about getting paid for our work, or the value of our work in comparison to the value of the ride, lesson, or horse show, particularly if we are in a situation that is not set up to have a work to lesson/ride/show program. Let’s face it, a lot of the fancy places are not.

While always maintaining a positive outward manner, I worked so hard at one point that I had a pretty good job post college where I often worked more than 50 hours a week, plus my grooming and braiding responsibilities that were often full time, plus, as well. You know what? I did not have time to ride and barely slept enough to function (in the real job). Even so, I still couldn’t afford to do more than lesson weekly. Something had to give. It was the horses until I could afford to ride in the manner that I wanted to. Now, in my early 30s, is the first time I have a nice green horse ready to show 3’ (and hopefully beyond) regularly.

As a teen, I was fortunate enough to have decent OTTB that was capable of showing 3’, if I could have afforded it. I was able to ride the difficult or green horses, when given a chance. But it was my friends with the show experience who, thankful for my rides at home, got to show them. I was their groom, braider and moral support. As a horseless 20 something, I was groom, braider and moral support to those mortified adults, as you call them. Because of my support, they were kind enough to think of me when they went out of town and could not ride their horse. I rarely rode or lessoned otherwise. On occasion, I was fortunate enough to show a few horses.

The point of my above experience is that as a teen and 20 something, I really wished I could have made riding and grooming a career. I just did not have the experience, network or financial backing to do it. Hard to believe, I was working too hard to develop it.

My advice to you is to really look at your situation and what you can do to make yourself more saleable to the type of situation you would like to find yourself in. What experience do you need? Can you get this experience without a lot of financial output. What kind of networking do you need to do? What is the best way to network? Do you know someone who knows someone who might now someone with a situation that will help you gain the experience you need? While this industry is hard work, and I am not advocating not working hard; it is important to find ways to not work so hard that you can’t develop your career.

I think another great piece of advice that someone posted is don’t expect to get all your experience in one place. One place might be great to learn about stable management, another horse care, another good flatwork, another putting in the good show round. And never underestimate the amount of knowledge you can get by standing at the ring as a groom. Even if you are not riding, you can probably learn more by helping set jumps, prepping a horse for the ring, and watching how the pros handle the greenies on up to the performance hunters and big jumpers.

From what I can tell from your posts, you probably are decent at working with trouble horses or greenies, particularly under 3’. That, in and of itself is a great niche. However, to ride and show at the level you want to, is a whole ‘nuther ball of wax. It takes a lot of extra training and rides on good horses, which all takes $$$. You can get a somewhat “free education” by grooming for great trainers. Finding ways to clinic or train a few times a year with great trainers is another good way to broaden your experience. Also, take stock in the assets that you have available to you. Can you manage your parent’s farm and sales program in a way that will help you get a horse you can develop and show a few times in the 3’? I would really look at ways you can expand your experience given the assets you already have.

Good luck. There really is a lot of great advice in the other posts in this thread. I really wish it was there when I was your age.

[QUOTE=PonyPenny;6086124]
So your parents aren’t 100% on board. You can do Independent Study or Online School and if you are diligent you can be a groom at WEF, etc. and keep up with your school work. In order for this to work before you are 18, your parents need to be 100% on board. You need to have medical insurance and have the card with you at all times. You also need to have a signed medical form authorizing the trainer you are working for to seek medical care in case you are injured and your parents can’t be contacted. You parents need to sign a liability release too. You also need a drivers license. These items were required before my daughter could be a working student.[/QUOTE]

My DD was a working student at WEF when she was fourteen - granted it was a bit of a modified (mortified?) program but we arranged for her to meet with a tutor 4 days a week so that she could keep up with her studies. It was complicated to organize as she did not drive and obviously, the trainer she was staying with had no time to drop her at the tutor - but where there’s a will, there’s a way.

Her program was a little different as she was sent down specifically to ride and show a specific horse, but horses being what they are - the horse pulled a shoe after the the first week and was lame the rest of the time she was there. So, she ended up sitting on some of the sale horses, flatting them under supervision, jumped some of the ones that were further along and schooled the trainer’s daughter’s pony. But the rest of the time, she spent watching and learning how to train up a newly imported horse, how to present it to a potential buyer, how to interact with customers and basically living the life. While she didn’t end up riding and showing as much as she had hoped, the education she received was invaluable!

She loved every minute of being a WS - it did make her realize that she would rather go to college and get a good job that will provide her the opportunity to have nice horses, rather than be a professional.

So, while I’m guessing you won’t read this - my advice is to take whatever opportunity presents itself to you - grooming or whatever - because until you really see what the horse world is like, you won’t really know whether it is for you.

[QUOTE=LoveJubal;6086161]
You can go to grad school with an English major, by the way.

I went to law school after finishing a double major (in English and yikes, History :lol:) and I graduated and have since passed the Bar. The attorney thing is the means by which I support my expensive horse habit.

My knowledge of the English language and literature has made me a far better communicator and writer than I ever would have been without it. The art of writing, spelling, and communication is becoming a lost art and I think that there is real value in an English major.

Minor Vent over.[/QUOTE]

Yes, I totally agree–I have one brother-in-law who was pre-med as an undergrad–and an English major. He says the English major helped him to get into med school; it set him apart from the other candidates. My sister, another English major, became very successful working for big business, where her writing skills were in high demand. My own English major prepared me for life in a way no other could have.

The problem is that too many major in English thinking that they will get jobs in that field, or that they will get jobs right out of college with no grad school, and the field cannot absorb them all–hence its reputation as an “impractical” degree.

Please, don’t be angry with me for not reading all of these. There are just too many replies I wasn’t expecting this much. I never said I didn’t appreciate the tips and advice. I fight back with some of them because nine out of ten posts here are shooting me down and not understanding exactly what I’m saying.

I have gotten a lot of valuable advice and information, mostly from private messages of people responding to my post. These types of threads always turn into huge debates and I was prepared for that. I post these kinds of things because although 90% of people are just telling me how I can’t make it, 10% are telling me how I can, and I pay attention to that, and I’m grateful for that.

I will try to keep reading posts on here but if there is something you really want me to see or tell me, then private message me. I’m terribly sorry for the inconvenience, it’s just that I can’t read all of this.

Someone said before that if I really want this then I shouldn’t be spending my time writing these long messages on here, I should be out riding and doing something. That’s true. This is the result of being sick, and not being able to sleep, and looking for some type of help, and I’ve gotten quite a few very good tips that I will use and take advantage of.

Having re-read some of your posts & re-thought it…

…aren’t you already making something out of yourself? You work with problem/green horses & improve them. Perhaps that is your niche?

It sounds like you already have an ideal set-up…your mother has an established business that you can grow & expand upon. Start a lesson program, take in more re-sale projects, run a summer camp, etc…

My sister majored in English as well and went on to become a successful lawyer. Keeping my fingers crossed that one day she will re-enter the horse world, purchase a very nice horse and let me ride/show it! :cool:

Um? There is no way you can be an English major if you can’t read five pages of bulletin board responses.

And, no one is saying you “can’t make it.” They’re saying “This is how you make it in this industry” but you don’t want to hear their advice.

We understand exactly what you’re saying. Frankly, we’ve heard it all before. Repeatedly.

[QUOTE=xemilyx805;6086206]
Please, don’t be angry with me for not reading all of these. There are just too many replies I wasn’t expecting this much. I never said I didn’t appreciate the tips and advice. I fight back with some of them because nine out of ten posts here are shooting me down and not understanding exactly what I’m saying.[/QUOTE]

How many people on here have advised you to “take advantage of every opportunity?”

Reading a four page thread in its entirety should take you a maximum of 45 minutes. Come off it, honestly.

Taking every opportunity involves reading every post. THERE is the diligence you will need.
Actions speak louder than words. You SAY how much you appreciate the posts but your ACTIONS speak otherwise.

It is this sort of thing that makes people dismiss you off hand with a “no need to bother with that one again.” Those judgments come swift and they come hard; there are eleventy billion others of you out there and tossing one aside as not worth the time to help just leaves eleventy billion minus one.

Your actions here reflect a whole lot of starry eyed dreams and aspiration but a lack of the down-to-earth earnestness and diligence that will keep you putting one foot in front of the other on the long road. Seriously re-evaluate how you approach getting what you want, because this surely ain’t it.

In the end the men get separated from the boys by the little details, not the big dreams. It is easy to have big dreams. Having the attitude and the little details together and the willingness to maintain them ENDLESSLY seemingly FOREVER for very little short-term reward, but maybe the possibility of a good outcome 15 or 20 years later down the road, not so much.

I fight back with some of them because nine out of ten posts here are shooting me down and not understanding exactly what I’m saying.

I read them (even the ones you skipped) and I get the impression that people understand exactly what you are saying but you don’t want to hear reality. :rolleyes:

Thank you to everyone who has given me nice, constructive feedback. I am extremely grateful for it. If I haven’t replied to your post I’m sorry I just don’t have the time to read through every single one. I will probably in the future and thank you privately.

But I’m done posting on this thread now. I posted this for the purpose of getting feedback and I got a lot of fantastic feedback which I am very grateful for. But this isn’t serving much more of a purpose now. Again, for everyone who gave me good feedback, thank you. I have read most of it and I have taken everything into consideration. Although, this isn’t being very productive anymore so I have nothing more to take from it.

Again I say if there is something you want me to see, message me. And thank you everyone for everything.

:slight_smile:

First of all, rid yourself of the notion that training = riding. It does not. Yes, good trainers tend to be good riders, but making up a good riding horse has to be done in steps, and riding comes only after a bunch of other steps have been done correctly first.

Grooming isn’t just running a brush over a horse. Grooming well is being very observant, and not just “did I get all the dirt off?” It’s noticing the horse’s behavior, knowing what’s normal and what’s not. It’s noticing a little puffiness on the right hind and knowing the difference between a little puffiness because the horse stayed in all night and a little puffiness because the horse rolled in his stall and whacked his ankle on the wall. It’s learning how to handle the super-talented horse who’s an ass on the ground; it’s knowing which wrap to use when and how to apply it. It’s knowing what lameness looks like and how to identify it. It’s knowing what to do when one of the horses in your care comes out of the stall with a sprung shoe or a weepy eye or a fat knee or he just doesn’t look quite right.

Knowing these things is what separates good trainers from great ones.

As an aside, if you’re wanting to have a career that will let you do the horse thing on the side, I cannot (as the holder of an English degree) recommend majoring in English or creative writing. The money’s almost always not there. Tech writing is a bit more lucrative, but in general, there is a reason jokers refer to English degrees as degrees in waitressing.

And also, hard work is laudable, but in the real world, sometimes it just isn’t enough. Most trainers at the top levels are running a business; they need money coming in. Hard work can be useful, but it’s not cash.

You’re 16: It’s a lot easier to change your course now, before you’ve really gotten started, than to change it when you’re 40 and realizing that “breaking even” isn’t going to work in 30 years. At some point, your body is going to give out and you will no longer be able to deal with the physical demands of training. You need to have a backup plan at that point, and that will require money, so you need to be earning enough that you can stuff some of it away for your later years.

I know I sound like a crotchety old lady, but the real world is not kind and tends to eat people’s dreams for breakfast. Most of us had big dreams at some point … probably not many of us are living them now. That’s life.

This thread really reminds me of the properetiquette/skittlespony saga.

Wow this is so WRONG I don’t even know where to start. I was you when I was a teen. Worse than you, I was a high school dropout with no family to support me at all.

From 14-20 I did anything I could to work with horses. I worked the TB sales at Keenland, I groomed polo ponies, I rode any horse I could sit on. I broke yearlings at a TB farm, and also got the opportunity to exercise polo ponies from those grooming jobs.

I worked my butt off. I ended up at 19 with an assistant trainers job with a Hunter trainer and his GP rider wife, who literally had some of the nicest horses in the country at their barn. I groomed for them, then rode the green horses, then was allowed on their 6 figure horses…

Funny enough I left that job when I realized, after thinking it was the life for me from the time I could say “horse”, that it really wasn’t what I wanted. But I’m telling you, if you really want to be riding those nice horses, and have a job in the industry, you need to realize you will have to first pay your dues OFF the horses to get on their backs…

I have little to add to the wonderful advice that’s been posted here, except this: when I was in high school and again in college, two trainers gave me the chance you are “begging” for. I wasn’t anywhere near the most polished or proficient rider in either trainer’s program, but I worked very, very hard to make sure that I was useful in other ways. Most importantly, I tried to be the kind of person they wanted to have around even if I wasn’t yet the kind of rider they wanted to have around. Some of what people are telling you on this thread is that you are not coming across as the type of person they would want to have around. Some of the people telling you this have given other riders wonderful opportunities. Think it over, and re-read Trixie’s posts. She knows what she’s talking about.

Seems like she didn’t read and adhere to JackieBlue’s wonderful advice back on page 3, of “keep your mouth shut. (use tape if you have to).” I read that and was able to pull out that little gem :slight_smile: too bad emily missed it. perhaps it is just my advanced years or the fact that I understood the importance of an education, English and all :lol:

My dear Emily, khobstetter also had some VERY valuable advice on page 3. I strongly suggest you go and reread that. It should be published and posted in every 16 year old horse crazy girl’s bedroom and the bathrooms at every barn. I for one would like to thank all the generous posters. There has been A LOT of great advice for her here.

Emily, does starting as an assistant trainer and only riding without having to do the “grunt” work “seem like such and impossible target?” Unfortunately, my answer is yes. Go get an education before you try to become an educator.

No kidding! Even when I was riding I was still grooming the head trainer’s horses. 7am to 7pm 6 days a week, riding 4-6 horses myself some days, plus grooming, tacking up and cooling off the trainer’s horses! Boy was that an education.

[QUOTE=TheHorseProblem;6086271]
This thread really reminds me of the properetiquette/skittlespony saga.[/QUOTE]

Exactly…wheres the Tad Coffin saddle?

A serious suggestion for you.

You have a mom with a training biz and a barn. You want to somehow ride a better one. Why not get the job, buy the cheap OTTB, pay board to your mom and make him/her up as your first sales horse? You plough that money back into your budding little business to spend as you see fit-- for a nice horse, some shows, some lessons, whatever?

At 16 (with the legal ability to work and drive to the job, plus no “real life” bills to pay), a place to keep a horse cheaply and the knowledge/connections you have, you are ahead of many young 'ns who would like to turn pro.

Make the most of the time, energy and money you have between now and college. It’s one of the first times in your life where whatever you do in a day really directly counts toward building a foundation for a career.

Emily, we’ve given exactly the opportunity you’re looking for to several young ladies. They came to us at 16, worked at anything thrown at them, lived at the farm, groomed at the shows, got to ride some nice horses if they were capable–all wanted to be trainers when they came to us. What makes me most proud? They all ended up in college, earned degrees in business, engineering, law, chemistry, and the most recent is finishing vet school. Only one stuck with her training plan and she has her whole family behind her, including an amazing 40 stall facility, trucks and trailers and a home.

You sound just as enthusiastic and single minded as those great girls and I’m sure not knocking it. But some time in the next 3 years I hope the same lightbulb moment will happen for you and you’ll see what wonderful advice you’ve been given here.