Best Multivitamin that also includes E/Sel

[cmdrcltr]

Writing from midcoast Maine where the haying has been next to non-existent so far this year thanks to record rain. Our hay guy will not bale unless he can ensure the hay won’t be too wet/moldy, but the quality is just going to be meh this year.

My mare is on a mostly forage based diet. She gets hay-stretcher pellets and a relatively small amount of pelleted grain to make her two supplements more palatable. She gets GutX and Cocosoya. I’ve not given her a multivitamin before (owned her 3 years), because we’ve always felt with the grain (2 lbs) and the usually good hay, she’s been fine nutritionally, even with Maine’s E/SEL deficient soil. For context, I ride 40 minutes to an hour 4-5 days a week in the summer and 3-4 days a week during the school year, although mostly not at all January to mid-March. We play around at ranch pleasure, western dressage, and trail ride. Not really a hard job.

With the prospect of hay with a pretty poor nutritious value, I am considering adding a multivitamin this year. I would rather not add two (E/Sel + a multivitamin) so as not to put that on my BO.

Any thoughts on what might be a good choice?

For reference, here is the grain: https://www.poulingrain.com/products/172/decade-endurance-sport

And here is the hay stretcher: https://www.poulingrain.com/products/190/forage-extender-mini-bites

[candyappy]

Will she get all the e/ selenium/ minerals she needs if you up the amount to what they recommend feeding on the bag?

If your hay is substandard ( as it will be if it hasn’t been cut yet) she will probably need more calories anyway to make up for the crappy hay. If you fed more grain you shouldn’t need a supplement?

[JB]

Feed a ration balancer, add vitamin E if she’s on only hay

You’ll need to do a blood test to see where her Se level is. If it’s fine on the current diet which doesn’t include much if any Se, she’ll be fine on the additional 1-2mg most balancers provide.

If she needs more calories than the ration balancer (Poulin’s is E-Tec), then you can add more hay pellets, or switch the minimal feeding rate of the Decade

[cmdrcltr]

@candyappy

Will she get all the e/ selenium/ minerals she needs if you up the amount to what they recommend feeding on the bag?

Yes, probably. But I don’t really want to increase her calories with grain if I don’t have to. Thanks for the reply!

[cmdrcltr]

@JB

ration balancer (Poulin’s is E-Tec)

Thank you for pointing this out, JB. I didn’t think to look through Poulin’s other products. BO has grain delivered from one feed store, and the feed store closest to me doesn’t carry their products. I can request that she add a bag of that to her order.

[DoubleDown]

We have this same issue out in Oregon . Check out Horse Guard, and Equerrys supplements. Both are from Oregon with different formulations, but with emphasis on Se/E issues.

[JB]

As a general v/m supplement, HorseGuard is pretty meh. 15mg copper, might as well not be there. But 3mg is Se is significant, and too much for some situations.

I’d much rather use a much more robust fortified product, and address Se and E separately if needed, than spend that $ on a subpar product just for E and Se. Even the E is only 1000IU per 20oz serving but it’s synthetic, so it’s more effectively around 670IU.

[KendraLW]

California trace would be a good option! Reasonably priced, high levels of the nutrients commonly deficient in hay, and they offer options with and without selenium.

[JB]

Yes, any forage balancer, of which there are several, including CT, but also Vermont Blend/Pro, KIS Trace, High Point Grass/Alfalfa, Arizona Copper Complete, and a few others, are an option. All of them need additional Vit E based on the grass/hay intake of the horse.

[cmdrcltr]

Hi JB. I’ve read your recent comments on other threads and thought I would ask for help again. I board, so I’m trying to figure out the best way to maximize nutrition while minimizing additional headaches for my barn owner. We made it through last winter’s crappy hay and my mare has had some changes in diet, so I’ll lay that out.

Currently, she eats 1 1/3 lbs of Poulin’s Decade Endurance daily. (Recommended for her weight is 3 1/2 to 4 lbs, but she doesn’t need the additional grain.) With that she gets approximately 1 1/3 qts. alfalfa pellets and 1 1/3 qts. Poulin forage extender pellets (Soy Hulls, Wheat Middlings, Dehydrated Alfalfa Meal, Calcium Carbonate, Yeast Culture, Artificial & Natural Flavoring.); I’m sorry, I don’t have weights for those volumes. She gets 15-20 lbs of hay daily, and maybe a little extra when we have a run of days with bitter temps. Upping her hay intake is not currently an option. She is on a dry lot year-round. I would consider her workload light or light-moderate; this time of year I’m lucky to work her 3x a week for maybe 30 minutes, and in spring-fall we work 5x a week for 45-90 minutes, with the longer time being trail rides with some hills and more walking than faster gaits.

She is not on any supplements at this time. I have tested for E and Selenium; I don’t have the numbers in front of me. The vet did not feel she needed to be supplemented, although I wonder if I should have added some anyway.

In addition to ensuring she’s getting all the basics she needs, here are a couple of my goals:

1. Improve hoof growth if I can. Her feet hold a shoe well, but we’re working on correcting a slight negative plantar behind, and I’d like to encourage good growth to help with that.
2. Test whether there is a deficiency in something that could be contributing to her reactiveness, which she has had since I purchased her (It is much improved, but I’d love to take another step toward calm and focused on the scale.)
3. Not break the bank or annoy my BO by having 10 supplement buckets.

Thank you in advance for your expertise and thoughts.

[JB]

@cmdrcltr

Currently, she eats 1 1/3 lbs of Poulin’s Decade Endurance daily. (Recommended for her weight is 3 1/2 to 4 lbs, but she doesn’t need the additional grain.

I’d either add a 1/2 serving of a ration balancer, or switch completely to a ration balancer. Higher nutrition, without the calories

@cmdrcltr

I have tested for E and Selenium; I don’t have the numbers in front of me. The vet did not feel she needed to be supplemented, although I wonder if I should have added some anyway.

Adding 1000IU natural Vit E would be fine, potentially beneficial, but if her Se is normal I wouldn’t add more

@cmdrcltr

Improve hoof growth if I can. Her feet hold a shoe well, but we’re working on correcting a slight negative plantar behind, and I’d like to encourage good growth to help with that.

You can add straight biotin, 25-30mg/day, for cheap, and it may speed up hoof growth. You could also add some copper and zinc, and it may do the same. Either of these may also improve hoof quality if she’s prone to heels crushing or has thinner/weaker hoof walls. You can do each of them cheaply and make your own “Smart Pack”, or you could spend a bit more and go with Hay Harmony from Y’ucc It Up

@cmdrcltr

Test whether there is a deficiency in something that could be contributing to her reactiveness, which she has had since I purchased her (It is much improved, but I’d love to take another step toward calm and focused on the scale.)

This isn’t really reliable. You could try an elimination diet, and remove everything but forage for 2 weeks, and see if things change. If her reactiveness is regular, you should know something by then. If she improves, then I’d try a soy-free ration balancer - Tribute Wholesome Blends Balancer, Triple Crown Balancer Gold, Purina Omega Match are the 3 most likely to be available. Soy would be first on my list of things to eliminate for a food-reactive horse, especially a mare but not discounting a gelding or stallion

@cmdrcltr

Not break the bank or annoy my BO by having 10 supplement buckets.

Yep, the above is simple!

[cmdrcltr]

Thank you so much, JB! I get overwhelmed by all the supplements that are out there.

I should have clarified that she isn’t food reactive, she’s brain reactive. She’s been this way since I’ve owned her and perhaps her whole life based on what I was able to find out. I was wondering about adding magnesium and maybe a B complex? So many of the calming combos have Tryptophan, and I’d like to avoid that.

[JB]

Ah, ok, if it’s pretty clear it’s not food, then I think starting a course of B12 is a great idea. I’d actually do a B complex - horses make their own B vitamins when their gut is healthy, so if B12 is an issue and causing reactiveness, there’s a pretty darn good chance there are other B issues, hence the B-complex

If that works, I’d stay on that for a couple months just to make sure, then take her off and see what happens. If things revert, then she’s got some GI issue going on, and that would need to be addressed.

If it doesn’t start helping in a couple weeks - it really should be fairly quick - then I’d start magnesium. Magnesium oxide is cheap, with a very good bioavailability + elemental Mg content, and the least likely of the forms to cause diarrhea if there’s an excess. I’d start with 25gm, see if things improve, and if so, work down in 5gm increments to find the lowest effective dose

[cmdrcltr]

Awesome advice. Thank you so very much!