A friend of mine just got her colors and has been having trouble getting a coat that fits. Her husband ordered a custom one that turned out not to fit and he doesn’t know what to try next. I said I’d ask around for him and figured what better place to ask than in the hunting section of COTH?
You don’t say where you live. That would help people recommend consignment stores and such.
Of course there is always Horse Country, and in Va there is The Old Habit
Why doesn’t the husband take the custom coat back to the tailor and have it made right?
And if your friend has hunted enough to have earned her colors she should already have a coat that fits?
You have me confused, too. If your friend is a female, and just earned her colors, she should just slap them (and the buttons) on the black or navy coat she has been using. Only gentlemen members of the field wear scarlet (gawd I hate that ‘pinque’ affectation, if you subscribe to the theory just use ‘pink!’). Only if whipping in or hunting hounds, and by decree of the master, would a bearer of the XY chromosome be wearing scarlet/red/pink.
Also…agree that a ‘custom’ coat that doesn’t fit should simply be sent back and made to fit!
hmm, you obviously know more than I do about it. Maybe I misunderstood what he was asking for? Sorry to sound like an idiot… I don’t know why he can’t send it back. I never asked him. Sorry about the pinque thing too. I had no idea it was spelt that way until someone sent me an email with. I thought it was normal but I have sworn off it now.
Not intending to offend you! And you are not at fault re the use of ‘pinque,’ the tack shops use it commonly these days. For me it’s like fingernails on the blackboard though.
But I do wonder why your friend would need a new coat, in particular a red/pink coat should not be necessary!
is it pinke,pink or pinque?
I did some research on this and it’s not entirely clear to me that any use of the word is wrong. It’ s used in all variations in tack shops, historical data and of course on this BB.
Here is an example: http://www.freedomfields.net/foxhunting_in_virginia.html
I suspect the spelling “pinque” is a more accepted spelling as we can certainly adorn our manly men in pinque but do we want them in pink? Anyway, as we become more enlightened (metrosexual??) we will comfortably dress them in pink and know they are the men and women they claim to be. After all it is a privilege to be adorned with colors.
There is no evidence that a tailor named Pink or Pinque ever existed or made a hunting coat. The Myth originated in the USA sometime in the early 20th century and as y’all know, foxhunting had been practised for a very long time (with men in scarlet coats) across the pond. It is a lot more likely that the use of scarlet cloth originated in the fact that it was readily available for the manufacture of military uniforms in England.
“Pinks” are a shirt-maker in London. From their website:
“The brand name Thomas Pink came from an 18th century London tailor known for making sought-after red hunting jackets. If you were lucky enough to own one, you were said to be ‘in the pink’.”
Could be an apocryphal story, but it’s a good 'un. 
http://www.thomaspink.com/fcp/content/AboutUs/content
Why not just say scarlet? Or would that become scarlette. :winkgrin:
Where I grew up, scarlet was the accepted term, so I’m guessing the choice of scarlet vs pink is just a regional thang.
Oh, and to answer the OP’s question: keep an eye on eBay.co.uk riding jacket listings for red, pink, scarlet, etc (red being the most popular).
There are a couple of reputable sellers who regularly bring stuff in from Europe who sometimes have scarlet Pikeurs for sale, annadressur and farasi91; there are a couple of British sellers who sell heavier wool hunt coats; and there are frequently venerable old hunt coats to be found, eg
and she even has the chamois breeches to match:
The Legend of Tailor Pink
Jim Reeds
Pink can mean the red coat worn in fox hunting (a.k.a. ``riding to hounds’’). One theory about the origin of this meaning refers to a tailor named Pink (or Pinke, or Pinque). I am interested in establishing the truth or falsity of this theory, which I call The Legend of Tailor Pink.
What follows is a list of essentially all discussions of this point that I have found in print. If you can supply any information on the subject, please let me know, at this address: reedsj@dtc.umn.edu Oxford English Dictionary, 1933 (Neutral)
To begin with, the OED gives many examples from the 1800’s of the use of the fox hunting sense of ``pink.’’ Note that the OED does not mention the Tailor Pink story.
[INDENT]6. Scarlet when worn by fox-hunters; a scarlet hunting coat, or the cloth of which it is made.
1834 DISRAELI Corr. w. Sister 15 Feb., Although not in pink, [I] was the best mounted man in the field. 1860 R. E. WARBURTON Hunt. Songs 1. (1883) 143 A sect…Who blindly follow, clad in coats of pink, A beast whose nature is to run and stink. 1861 HUGHES Tom Brown at Oxf. They are the hunting set, and come in with pea-coats over their pinks. 1889 Daily News 12 nov. 5/2 Scarlet, conventionally known as pink', will, he trusts, last as long as fox-hunting. [B]1900 [/B][I]Ibid.[/I] 24 Feb. 6/7 A short coat in hunting pink. [B]b.[/B] [I]transf.[/I] A man in pink’; a fox-hunter.
1828 Sporting Mag. XXI. 323. Even in the strictest College a pink could unmolested walk across the Court. 1849 SHAIRP, in W. Knight Shairp & Friends (1888) 44, I see the pinks flocking out to the `meets’. 1869 E. FARMER Scrap Bk. (ed. 6) 91 Pinks call for their second [horse] to finish the run.
…
2. Applied to the colour of a hunting-coat; see A.6. 1857 TROLLOPE Barchester T. xxii, He… could not be persuaded to take his pink coat out of the press, or his hunters out of the stable.
[/INDENT]Anole Hunter, 1929 (Pro)
Anole Hunter (pseud. for Everett Lake Crawford), Let’s ride to hounds (Derrydale Press, New York, 1929), page 64:
[INDENT]For as soon as you don pink (really scarlet but called pink for a tailor who was famous for his hunting toggery) you are a marked man. [/INDENT]Mureau and Evans, 1961 (Pro)
Charles Mureau and David Sandford Evans, The Pink Coat, or The Why’s and Wherefore’s of Fox Hunting (Hill’n Dale Press, Calabasis, California, 1961), page 31:
[INDENT]The reason for the ``Pink’’ coat is that a tailor by the name of Pink was the original designer and maker. [/INDENT]Johnston, 1962 (Pro)
Lyle T. Johnston, 1962 Collier’s Encyclopedia article on Foxhunting:
[INDENT]The word ``pink’’ does not refer to the color of the coat but is a term applied to the state of being formally attired for hunting. It is thought to have had its origin in a tailor by the name of Pink who, in the old days, is supposed to have made the most perfect attire for hunting. [/INDENT]Self, 1963 (Pro)
Margaret Cabell Self, The Complete Book of Horses & Ponies (McGraw Hill, New York, 1963), page 277, has a variant spelling:
[INDENT]These coats are called pink'' coats, after a famous tailor named Pinke. [/INDENT]And, in a 1963 edition of a work first published in 1949 (the earlier edition of which I have not seen), [I]The Horseman's Encyclopedia[/I] (A. S. Barnes and Company, New York, 1963), page 261: [INDENT]These are commonly called pink’’ but not because of their color. A famous London tailor named Pink'' or Pinke’’ gave his name to the hunting coat and they have been called ``pinks’’ ever since. [/INDENT]Bloodgood and Santini, 1964 (Anti)
The entry for ``pink’’ in The Horseman’s Dictionary compiled by Lida Fleitman Bloodgood and Piero Santini, E. P. Dutton, New York, 1964, page 150:
[INDENT]Etymology: Variously ascribed to the pink' colour of a faded old hunting coat or, without any basis of fact, to the supposed name of a hunting tailer, called Mr. Pink.’ [/INDENT]Longrigg, 1975 (Anti)
Roger Longrigg, The History of Foxhunting, Clarkson N. Potter, Inc., New York, 1975. On page 119:
[INDENT]Red was known sometimes as red, usually as scarlet, and very occasionally as pink. (Cook, in 1826, is one of the first to refer to pink; he does so once or twice as a change from scarlet; this is true of Nimrod' into the 1840s, Surtees into the 1860s, Sidney into the 1870s. Scarlet remained the normal word into the last quarter of the century. The origin of pink’ is obscure enough; its elevation into shibboleth is baffling. There was no leading tailor of the name – to dispose of a frequent explanation – in London or any hunting centre.) [/INDENT]In a letter dated 22 April 1993, Longrigg expands on the last two sentences: use of pink'' in speech has been a snobby social class marker (similar to the ones given in Mitford's [I]Noblesse Oblige[/I] but for a slightly different social stratum). Tailoring is a trade as well documented as cabinet making,’’ and if there were a tailor Pink, Longrigg’s search would have turned up some documentary record.
Bryant, 1992 (Pro)
Bonnie Bryant, Snow Ride (Bantam, New York, 1992) has another variant spelling:
[INDENT]Did you know that's not actually pink?'' Carole asked. Sure, they’re red,’’ Stevie said. I still don't know why they're called pink, though.'' It’s P-i-n-q-u-e,’’ Carole said, spelling it out. ``It doesn’t have anything to do with the color. Pinque was the tailor who designed it.’’
[/INDENT]
According to a letter dated 6 August 1993, Bryant learned the story – including spelling – by word of mouth in about 1959 or 1960. Clothiers
A number of clothing retailers in both England and America repeat the Tailor Pink story in their advertising literature. None has been able to supply any evidence for the story.
Problems with the Tailor Pink story
If there was a tailor Pink (or Pinke or Pinque), what was the street address of his place of business? When was he born, when did he die, where is he buried?
Why is there almost a century’s gap between the first use of the word pink'' for the color of a red hunting coat and the first appearance of the tailor Pink story? Why did the tailor Pink story appear in America decades before it appeared in England? And why does the word pink’’ appear in lower case (at least in the 19th century) when eponymous words such as Wellington,'' Blücher,’’ Stetson,'' Levi’s’’ and so on are usually capitalized in English? Speculations
Here are some of the theories of the origin of ``pink’’ and the tailor Pink story that I have run across or have invented:
[LIST=1]
Many thanks to these people, who have kindly helped me in my search for information: Bonnie Bryant, Richard D. Carreño, Kristine Carroll, Andy Clark, John B. Glass, A. H. B. Hart, Denise Hughes, Roger Longrigg, John A. V. C. McGrath, Alexander Mackay-Smith, James Mullen, Charles A. Mureau, Aryk Nusbacher, Hilarie Orman, Sarah Pallas, J. Peterman, Diane Reichard, Catherine Rogers, Laura Rose, Brian Scearce, Matt Simpson, David Stockton, and Peter Winants.
Last modified 1 Jan. 2004.
Jim Reeds reedsj@dtc.umn.edu
Also, the term “pinks” is used to describe the pinkish-tan gabardine trousers formerly worn by military officers as part of the dress uniform. This form al attire name could have crossed over to formal hunting attire nomenclature.
[QUOTE=Xanthoria;3397781]
Also, the term “pinks” is used to describe the pinkish-tan gabardine trousers formerly worn by military officers as part of the dress uniform. This form al attire name could have crossed over to formal hunting attire nomenclature.[/QUOTE]
Seriously? Interesting. Which country? Which regiment(s)? Infantry? Cavalry? Citations, please!
I’m genuinely curious - I’ve only ever seen dark colours, or tartan; ooh, tartan hunt coats, mmmm. :yes:
Nope, on second thoughts, they could end up looking like British Caledonian girls. :eek:
I thought it was a much older term, but just found this on an ebay description:
"Pinks Gabardine Riding Britches were the icon of the high ranking, long time, veteran Army and AAF Officers. These were immortalized in the opening scene of the movie Patton. Pinks were the trousers of choice by US Army Officers during the war. "
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