Bit Advice

[ammy4life]

Hi all

I have a spicy mare and need bitting advice. I use a fat copper Sprenger loose ring (single joint) to flat in with a flash. She is lovely in that. However, I’ve been experimenting with different bits for jumping and the show ring because like I said, she’s a spicy girl. I’m at my wits end trying to figure out what my lady will like!

She roots and makes a bid, which is more or less controllable. Her rooting is not necessarily downhill, it’s moreso uphill. Not evading the bit either.

I’ve tried her in a single joint 3 ring with 2 reins, that was OK. We tried a big cheltham gag with a flexible, thin rubber mouth. That was OK. Ported rubber Pelham with mild shank, that was a hard no. I tried a Beris combo with a snaffle rein and curb, no poll pressure just curb, and that isn’t anywhere near enough to get her back. She’s also not soft in any of these bits. I’ve dabbled jumping her in the loose ring, but it’s not hitting the spot and I do not have great control of her laterally.

She has a soft mouth and is actually very respectable on the back side of the jumps. Would appreciate all bitting ideas!

(And yes, she has her teeth done every 6 months, regular chiro, massage, vetting, etc., she’s a feisty GP horse with many feisty aspirations when jumping)

[Scribbler]

@ammy4life

Hi all

I have a spicy mare and need bitting advice. I use a fat copper Sprenger loose ring (single joint) to flat in with a flash. She is lovely in that. However, I’ve been experimenting with different bits for jumping and the show ring because like I said, she’s a spicy girl. I’m at my wits end trying to figure out what my lady will like!

She roots and makes a bid, which is more or less controllable. Her rooting is not necessarily downhill, it’s moreso uphill. Not evading the bit either.

I’ve tried her in a single joint 3 ring with 2 reins, that was OK. We tried a big cheltham gag with a flexible, thin rubber mouth. That was OK. Ported rubber Pelham with mild shank, that was a hard no. I tried a Beris combo with a snaffle rein and curb, no poll pressure just curb, and that isn’t anywhere near enough to get her back. She’s also not soft in any of these bits. I’ve dabbled jumping her in the loose ring, but it’s not hitting the spot and I do not have great control of her laterally.

She has a soft mouth and is actually very respectable on the back side of the jumps. Would appreciate all bitting ideas!

(And yes, she has her teeth done every 6 months, regular chiro, massage, vetting, etc., she’s a feisty GP horse with many feisty aspirations when jumping)

It’s a training issue not a bitting issue

[ammy4life]

Training issue is absolutely a factor! That said, I would like to find a bit that 1) makes her happy, and 2) works for both of us. Hence the reason I posted

[Scribbler]

@ammy4life

Training issue is absolutely a factor! That said, I would like to find a bit that 1) makes her happy, and 2) works for both of us. Hence the reason I posted

Any basic jointed snaffle will work. If she isn’t happy in bits generally or doesn’t really understand them, switching up the gear won’t help. There’s no magic

It sounds like you need to step back.from jumping and do some flatwork and basic dressage. I know lots of folk run willing green horses over courses, but when you get problems there’s no shared language to solve them.

That said, get a dental exam to make sure she doesn’t have a physical issue like impacted wolf teeth or a freakishly low palate or mouth tumors or whatever could be actually causing pain.

[ammy4life]

When home from shows, we do 5 days of flatwork, 1 day of small jumps. I was raised in the era in which flatwork was your everything! If you did not know how to move the horse’s shoulder, rib, and haunch on the flat, there is little hope you are successful over jumps. That is not our issue as she is not green to proper lateral work, nor is our foundation.

As someone who shows at AA shows year-round, I also have witnessed people run green horses over courses because they can. I will always jump 10cm too low than too high. Again, that is not our issue but I see you and I share many of the same concerns and can absolutely understand your POV!

And, like I said, she is regularly checked by her dentist and vet. Could she easily go around in a loose ring single joint bit? Sure, but she does not love that and, thus, I am looking for advice from those with similar experiences

[paw]

If she’s “spicy” and “roots and makes a bid” at shows when she doesn’t at home, she’s telling you she’s not ok with it. Hence, a training issue. She’s not confident she can make it around the course, so she’s taking charge.

More work over small fences (or even poles), making sure she’s coming from behind and taking you over the fence, is an answer. And no long, reachy spots! She needs to understand that she’s safeest jumping off her hind end, and adding rather than taking a flyer. She also needs to know that you aren’t going to make any big moves as she’s trying to negotiate the jump.

It’s definately a journey…

[ammy4life]

Love these training techniques and share your words!

What I meant by spicy is that she is a sensitive horse. I see I’ve misused words in my initial post. She loves her job and is very good at it!

[Rumorhasit93]

After a LOT of bit trials, my spicy red headed mare likes waterfords. I have a loose ring for flatting and a gag for jumping. I like that she can’t grab it. It’s been the only but I’ve stuck with, going on 4 years riding her in it.

I also rode her in a swale bit which she liked, but guessing your mare won’t based on not liking a port.

My mare also shockingly goes really well in a leather war bridle. Kind of a fun thing to try. I have jumped small fences in it, but can tell if we got to jumping up I probably wouldn’t have much control.

Good luck!

[ammy4life]

This is helpful, thank you!

I have a swale with a soft mouth piece I’ve been meaning to try, as well as a leather war bridle (that I’ve been scared to try due to… silly mare shenanigans that are always comical!)

I’ll give those a shot. If neither work, I might do an eggbutt Waterford and see if the stability will help with my lateral control. Thanks!

[Rumorhasit93]

I forgot to mention, I started with a full cheek waterford for steering purposes. I used both a snaffle and gag and then transitioned to a loose ring.

My swale also had a soft mouthpiece and a wide and low port. I found my mare likes anything with tongue relief.

My mare is also very quick and loves her job, so I totally can relate to the ride-ability aspect of a horse who is excited to do their job, but sometimes thinks they know better than the rider

[findeight]

Is she sensitive or is she saying “no”? Have you imaged her hocks? Injected? IME rooting often originates behind, not in the front half as they to unweight the rear. Does she tend to swap off behind or hunt the gap?

My spicier horses went far better in bits without moving parts, solid mouth with or without a port, no loose rings, nothing that moves. We tend to think movement=soft but it worries some horses and can scare them. Food for thought.

Since you are aiming for GP, if your coach has extensive experience developing 1.3m and up horses, they should have some thoughts. What do they say?

[Ridethroughit23]

Whenever someone says their horse is spicy I think pain. Look up sue Dysons research, super informative!

[ammy4life]

Sensitive, hocks are great, no swapping off behind or hunting the gap.

My coach and I have a list of bits we are wanting to try, I simply posted wanting to see if there are any others on here with similar experiences. It helps keep the options open.

[fivestrideline]

I’ve had some soft mouthed opinionated ones over the years, and almost all liked either a solid, no joint bit OR a Waterford.

Leather is a popular mouthpiece, as well as a really low port thinner Mullen mouth. The nicer Waterford with flat pieces on the bars (vs “bubbles” all the way to the cheek) makes a huge difference too for the ones that go well in that. I’ve ridden some horses in the various plastic and rubber bits popular in dressage circles right now, but honestly come back to my leather ones.

I also much prefer a D or full cheek when lateral control is needed (I ride a lot of greenies ).

Anyways, I find that a gag with two reins on the same mouthpiece you flat them in is usually a good answer. YMMV.

[one1horse]

My initial thoughts have been echoed here already but I immediately thought of a HS duo, or a waterford. The Neue Schule waterford in my favorite because like @fivestrideline mentioned, the mouth pieces are less “bubbly” and the pieces in the mouth corners are designed to relieve lip pressure. The Duo might be worth checking out because it is a solid mouthpiece but flexible and forgiving for a soft mouth.

[CBoylen]

Why not just get a thinner version of the same bit?

[Words_of_Wisdom]

Or consider adding a gag rein to it.

[foursocks]

This is perhaps not the solution for your girl but the NS Turtle Tactio Flex mouth has worked on a lot of different horses, including some of my eventer friends who need more bit going XC on their UL horses but don’t want to really bit up. It comes in different cheeks and a lot of sensitive horses seem to like it. My young (very sensitive) one hates it, for reasons of his own, but he’s an anomaly in my experience.

I ride my older jumper in one of those in the Universal model, which is a really nicely-designed two-ring. He doesn’t root but he will make his giant neck into a wooden block and get VERY heavy on the forehand when he wants to not work over his back. In this bit he just doesn’t do that, and now I can leg him up into it and he will reach for it and relax from his poll on down.

[ammy4life]

These are great suggestions! I’ve tried the universal combo and had a stiff-jawed horse… granted, that was years ago when I tried her and her teeth were horrible shocker. I might have to try it out again now that she’s in a much different place physically

[outside_leg]

My spicier horses have tended to hate single joints. They can be quite harsh, and these horses tend to prefer a “less is more” approach if they are truly sensitive.

My jumper goes in a NS Verbindend loose ring. I love this bit on most horses I’ve used it on, and they seem to like it too. My heavier horse prone to leaning went in the Ns turtle top loose ring and pelham depending on if I needed the extra leverage.

I’m not a fan of straight bars on horses prone to rooting or leaning. I find it makes them more inclined to bear down the bit. But in general, I vastly prefer a simpler approach to bitting. Playing around with more ergonomic shapes or different size mouth pieces to see what’s comfortable is one thing. I wouldn’t necessarily be looking for something stronger on a horse like this, just something that makes her more comfortable.