Blue Pop Rocks for ulcers: I won't buy them again.

[Winding_Down]

I was introduced to Blue Pop Rocks for ulcer treatment here and was overwhelmed with the positive reviews.

AbPrazole™

Well, I won’t be buying them again. Last winter, I had my UL horse on three packets per day (2 am and 1 pm) for six weeks and he subsequently began showing signs of ulcers (nervous, anxious under saddle). I had him scoped and he had moderate to almost severe ulcers very evident in the scope.

Vet put him on gastrogard and he scoped clean 3 weeks later.

So the pop rocks did not prevent or cure the ulcers and the gastrogard did…

Anyone else have evidence for the effectiveness or lack thereof via scoping? Needless to say, I won’t be ordering from abler again.

[Jumper_girl221]

You shouldn’t have spaced out the dose like that for one, he should have been getting all 3 at the same time, also what type of feed does he get and what method? (soaked, dry, sweet etc).

I did not bother to scope, it was obvious that my mare had them. Her symptoms went away after getting the 3 pack treatment for 60 days then dropping to 1 pack a day over the summer. Over the winter I backed her off of them and transitioned her to U7 (doing both for 30 days then dropping the BPR).

Within a month of stopping the BPR my mare was very obviously flared. All her symptoms went away after a week back on the BPR.

I will say that if you do not follow the directions, then it will not be effective.

[scubed]

The first time I used them horse had mild ulcers at start (on scope) and none at finish. Now I use without scoping, but see definite symptom relief in all horses I’ve used it in.

[Winding_Down]

Jumper girl, he did not have signs of ulcers prior to the dosage. He was on 3x the recommended dosage for prevention. I was careful to not soak his feed since I understand that water can break down the coating and make the pop rocks less effective. I have researched the abler site and there are no studies cited that I could find using scoping for evidence of either prevention or treatment. I am just citing my own experience, using a definitive diagnostic test.

I realize that others have had great results but I did not. I just wanted to share this in case people are considering pop rocks. Scoping has its risks but is very inexpensive when you consider the cost of treatment for a month.

Also, if it takes 60 days of pop rocks and 1 month of gastrogard to “treat” ulcers, which is preferred?

[Winding_Down]

[QUOTE=scubed;7641424]
The first time I used them horse had mild ulcers at start (on scope) and none at finish. Now I use without scoping, but see definite symptom relief in all horses I’ve used it in.[/QUOTE]

This is good to know. I definitely want to hear about good results with scoping as the diagnostic tool… It may be that my guy was so prone to ulcers that he “overrode” the pop rocks, even at 3x the prevention dose. Regardless, he responded extremely well to the gastrogard.

[EventerAJ]

Are you sure he ate all 3 packets’ worth? My horse would NOT eat them in his grain; he either picked around most of it, or if moistened to stick, he’d just boycott his grain altogether. I had to administer them in a dosing syringe (with fish oil, because he wouldn’t eat that either, and the oil did not dissolve the coating).

I did not scope. But his symptoms greatly improved after a week, and I kept him on the 3-pack dosage for three weeks, then tapered gradually. By the time he was down to 1 packet daily, his appetite was excellent and he’d eat the granules with his grain (no more syringing).

[Winding_Down]

^^ that is awesome and I am not ruling them out based on all the experiences of others. There’s no way they can’t be effective given that so many others have had good results.

He did eat them all… he was quite a chow hound. I have since sold him along with 1/4 tube per day of gastrogard…

[Big_Grey_hunter]

Just out of curiosity, why did you do the treatment dose if you didn’t see any symptoms of ulcers?

[Winding_Down]

[QUOTE=Big_Grey_hunter;7641687]
Just out of curiosity, why did you do the treatment dose if you didn’t see any symptoms of ulcers?[/QUOTE]

Because I figured more is better. :winkgrin:

[SomethingSpecial]

I’ve got a mare with ulcer symptoms, in the past I had been giving her a generic omeprazole from prerace.com. (its $8 a tube vs $30 for ulcergaurd) Both my vet and trainer have told me to use only ulcergaurd. Is it worth the money I put in? I’ve ordered two weeks worth of ulcergaurd, I just want to know if it really is worth the money over the generic stuff. I haven’t gotten her scoped, but she is a nervous TB and has backed off her feed. And how long does the ulcergaurd work to keep symptoms at bay for horses that are extremely prone to ulcers? Thanks!

[pegasusmom]

Depends on the horse and the circumstances. We have one here that does fine at home with nothing (after being treated with the real stuff four years ago when he arrived) I can use generic stuff when we travel just up the street for a show and he comes home that night. Have learned the hard way he needs a full tube of gastroguard or ulcerguard when we travel away from home. In my experience it’s trial and error to see what works with which horse to yield the most economical treatment.

[Twisting]

It’s the same drug. Omeprazole is Omeprazole, and an enteric coating is an enteric coating. No real reason for them to do a whole bunch of studies on it. It’s not like it’s some kookie untested pseudoscience cure.

And because you spread out the dosage rather than lump it all in at once you never reached the peak drug levels that you would have if you had dosed all at once. When you gave the gastrogard, I’m assuming, you dosed all at once, as you were likely directed to do, thereby reaching a higher peak level of the drug in the horse’s system.

Because you didn’t scope at the beginning you don’t know that he didn’t have severe ulcers when you started, and he was on the mend down to moderate by the time you scoped. Then you switched to a dose of omeprazole that resulted in higher peak levels of the drug and he cleared up the rest of the ulcers quickly.

[Winding_Down]

Oh for cripes sake. I give up. :lol:

[wildlifer]

LOL, there is no winning on that topic on COTH, OP! But you are 100% correct – and that is exactly the reason that I am constantly astonished that horse people who, when presented with facts they don’t like, cry “CITATION???” even if they don’t know what a citation is, yes, will leap at anecdotal stuff like rabid raccoons!

Yes, the product IS a coated omeprazole product. HOWEVER, due to poor QA/QC when tested, the amount of omeprazole you get may be anywhere from zero to way too much. Fortunately, it is unlikely that omeprazole will kill a horse if overdosed, but the level of active ingredient in that product is completely inconsistent from batch to batch.

Everyone gets to make their own choices for their own horses, but I shall continue to stick with what I have a reasonable confidence in that at least I am getting what I think I am paying for!

Many people are (a) ok with that risk, which I can understand, since, as horsepeople, we are prone to be desperate to believe in something that can fix our horses, none of us are exempt from that! and (b) in the category which, by the laws of probability, happened to get enough batches with enough of the product to do the job OR they were guessing and the issue was something else.

While I’m certainly no friend of big pharma, when it comes time to use medications, I’m going to continue to do my due diligence, including consulting with my vet who always stays current on the science, to stack the deck with as many cards in favour as possible.

[wildlifer]

And SomethingSpecial, yes, it is worth it if ulcers are the case. I did not scope (my vet is awesome and has magic hands from long experience and we were able to diagnose ulcers as a result of a worm overload (I felt terrible, but learned hey, online worming schedules are outdated and don’t work!).

Listen to your vet. Mine said the same, I followed his instructions, problem solved. After the initial week of 1 tube per day of Ulcerguard, we backed off to 1/4 tube per day (the 2nd day saw results!) for another couple weeks, then he stayed on Ranitidine for the rest of his competitive career, with some added Ulcerguard during HT’s. Worked very well for him and money well-spent.

[EasternMkt]

Last summer, my mare started showing symptoms consistent w/ ulcers, so I ordered Abprazole, figuring it would arrive about the time I got back from vacation. Mare then had a mild colic the day I returned (having never colicked w/ me before) and managed to dehydrate herself slightly in the process so I dragged her to the clinic. While there, I had her scoped and, sure enough, vet counted 4 small ulcers. We gave her some Ulcerguard (preventative dose) for 3 days until the pop rocks arrived, then I swapped her to a treatment dose for 4 weeks. Symptoms cleared up and haven’t returned. I did not re-scope. YMMV.

[KellyS]

I will only use Gastrogard or Ulcergard (both manufactured by Merial) for prevention and treatment of ulcers. It is the only evidence-based product that has shown to prevent and treat gastric ulcers in horses (as far as I know).

Gastrogard is prescription and its indications are for ulcer treatment, while Ulcercard is OTC and its indications are for ulcer prevention; both products are the EXACT same thing. I know most everyone knows this, but I find there is some confusion.

My guys receive 1/4 tube starting 2 days before competition and/or travel and then throughout the competition and/or trip. If they are exhibiting signs of ulcers, I administer a full tube for a week, and see a huge difference within a few days. I then slowly taper the dose down as long as the clinical signs do not manifest again.

It is less expensive to use Ulcergard proactively than to use all the other supplements/products that “claim” to prevent ulcers. To me, it’s not worth the risk when there is a proven product out there.

Also, I do not have horses scoped for ulcers anymore, mainly because withholding food/water only increases their stress if they are showing signs. I find the 1-week trial of Gastro/Ulcergard less expensive and pretty diagnostically definitive.

[Winding_Down]

Kelly, my guy responded positively (returned to being relaxed and focused under saddle) within two days of beginning gastrogard. It was amazing the change. The only reason I scoped him was because insurance would not cover the gastrogard without the scope. We re-scoped 3 weeks later and the ulcers were totally gone. I was amazed. FWIW, my vet was not at all surprised and told me that if he had still had the ulcers, he would’ve contacted Merial immediately. Apparently, Merial stands behind their product. Insurance covers 60 days of full tx but if ulcers are still present, Merial will typically provide additional treatment.

I am also not a fan of big time pharmaceutical companies. However, I am a fan of clinical research and results and I must admit that Merial has done their research and provided their findings to the public. The findings of their clinical trials are pretty darned strong…

[retreadeventer]

Hmm. If I were designing a scientific test, I would do all of what you guys have done. Use the Ulcergard. Use the pop rocks. Use the pop rocks incorrectly. use generic omeprazole in some fashion. Feed with wet food. Feed with dry food. Syringe down. One horse would get a control of nothing and one horse would get double of everything. I would scope all at start. I would do it for a period of time and then scope. then continue some of the horses on a full dose for a period of time and scope, while continuing some on at half or reduced dose for same period and scope. That would be a fun experiment and I think it would be interesting to see the result. Anyone want to pay for it? Any vet school want to do it?

[elizabeth_Callahan]

As a FYI, smart packs ultra gut actually was clinically tested ( and there were scopings before and after) to prevent ulcers. Will not treat them, but did prevent them. Less $ than pop rocks, and clinically tested…