Boarder won't pay horse dentist!

[OverandOnward]

So, I’m going to challenge some of the above post assumptions just a bit. I see misses all the way around.

I’m making an assumption that may not be true, though.

She said, Yes, but asked how much it was. I said it depended on how much he did and that she could call and ask him.

OP, you didn’t clarify if you know that she did call and ask. If so, what was the answer. And what she and the dentist agreed to. That makes me think that communication didn’t prepare the boarder for the bill amount.

Based on the situation that the dentist is now dropping into OP’s lap, I’m guessing that boarder and dentist did not have a conversation about costs and limits – although if they did, it may have been far less than $300.

$300 is a lot to some people, especially if someone had no idea that a bill would be that much. I understand that the work seriously needed to be done. And that some people don’t know the full responsibilities and costs of owning a horse.

But nonetheless, this amount was a) a surprise to the boarder and b) not an amount she had authorized in advance. If I understand the story correctly.

Overall – top level view – OP / BO/M – In my opinion your first priority needs to be the party that you most want to keep in your orbit on good terms. Without getting between them, at least give that party the most attention and a suggestion to resolve the impasse … see below. I’m assuming that’s the dentist, but of course it might not be.

Did the dentist call the boarder, AFTER he had assessed the work needed, and BEFORE he did the work? Let her know what was needed, and give her a quote? With alternatives if she responded that she couldn’t afford a bill of that size. Maybe he could have done the work in more than one visit, or paid it in installments, or limited the work – or some other idea.

OP, has the boarder given you any financial parameters for additional bills for care that her horse might need while boarding at your barn? Have you had a discussion with her about this? Is it in your board contract, where she gives an amount?

So, in my opinion as a business type …

Miss #1 was on the part of the dentist and possibly the barn in not getting authorization for a specific amount ahead of time. If the boarder authorized less than $300, then it was time for a phone call before the dentist went all in.

Miss #2 is on the boarder - It seems to be that when the boarder authorized ‘dental work’, the boarder find out how much, or set a maximum. At least the boarder asked the BO/M, but should have spoken directly with the dentist.

Miss #3 on the dentist and #4 on the boarder seems to be that no one is offering an alternative plan that would correct for the first two misses. Dentist: “I understand that this amount is more than you expected. As BO also explained to you, it was important for your horse’s health to have this work done. My rates are comparable with other dental equine specialists. Can you do four payments of $75 each, due the 5th of each month for the next four months?” Boarder could also have offered this. But now maybe she might accept it – from the dentist.

Regardless of who should have done what, right now the situation is what it is. Boarder might agree to the four payments. And then make, or not make, all of them. But it is a way forward from here. It’s better than a stalemate.

I do agree with others that this is between the boarder and the dentist, not the BO/M. That said, the BO/M set up the connection and the work. So I also understand why the dentist is peeved and wants BO/M to help out.

The other bottom line here is not just that the boarder is refusing to pay, but why the boarder is refusing to pay. Surprised by the amount she didn’t authorize? Over her head financially with horse care? Or thinking to get away with a service without paying? The answer to this matters a great deal to her future with BO/M.

Just for good relations all around, if I were the BO/M in this situation, I would communicate with the dentist only – as the party that BO/M most wants to maintain on good relations – and talk through the situation, and suggest the four-payment alternative for the dentist to offer the boarder. Along with the assurance to the boarder “next time I’ll check with you before I do the work”. Or if BO/M is more affiliated with good relations with the boarder, same thing but vice versa.

[Merlin_the_Mule]

I definitely plan to talk to the dentist before I talk to the boarder. Like I said, I thought this whole thing was settled weeks ago.

[2DogsFarm]

@Merlin_the_Mule

just figured she is going through a tough time or something. I will also talk to the dentist and see if he might do payments.

Her tough time isn’t your concern. Boarding should be a business relationship, not therapy.
You’re going above & beyond to ask about payments for her.
I’d suggest to her that she should do that. Let vet/dentist know you can’t get payment for them & hope that won’t affect your boarders who do pay timely.
Agree with those who say she might be stiffing you next.

[OverandOnward]

Just throwing another related thought into this issue that may need to be addressed with the boarder – future care needs for this 20 year old mare.

And, if this boarder is perhaps not up to speed on possible horse health events and what they can cost.

I edited and used a “Directive for Care” agreement (attached below) that a COTH member shared on a thread years ago. With a past vet record attached. It states what the BM is authorized to do if I can’t be reached. Colic surgery y/n; other surgery y/n, ok for things other than colic up to a certain amount. Euthanasia decision. And my horse’s insurance information, with instructions how to get authorization for an urgent euth. That sort of thing. I give it to every BO/M as part of the move-in process. And update it when needed. Making sure that every version has a date on it, so if more than one past copy is still floating around, people know which to use.

If boarder is hard to reach on hard questions and $$ questions, this might be needed. Maybe even for more general purposes with an aged horse. In your shoes I’d come up with an agreement with blanks for the owner to fill in for amounts, limits, and her signature on authorizations if you can’t reach her in urgent situations.

Such an agreement/directive is never a blanket solution to every problem. But its very existence might have her thinking forward. You might even require it for her horse to stay as a boarder.

Some people aren’t good with more complicated decisions – you don’t want that to become your problem, as well as hers.

I am constantly surprised that many board barns do not have a signed agreement with every owner about what care and how much the owner authorizes for urgent/emergent situations. Directives on who can make decisions if the owner can’t be reached. Updated preferably every year, but at least every two years, because things change over time. Care becomes more expensive. Personal financial situations can go up or down. So many unfortunate situations can happen suddenly where a horse is concerned.

Caveat that this is an informal document and was not prepared by an attorney.

TEMPLATE-Authorization-Directive_forCare.docx (37.3 KB)

[OverandOnward]

And in fact if she won’t sign some sort of outline of her wishes for her horse, that might be a red flag that she hasn’t thought this through and isn’t prepared for horse needs.

A $300 dentist bill makes me think the mare’s mouth hasn’t been corrected in a long time. Wondering what the owner even knows about equine dentistry.

[Calvincrowe]

If a boarder cannot cover a $300 vet bill, I’d be afraid they can’t actually afford to own and maintain a horse. (That’s a normal floating bill here in the PNW, a little low actually).

OP- use that contract to have a blunt discussion with boarder about what basic care is required for horses in your care. Do not pay the vet bill.

[walktrot]

What does your boarding contract say about services the farm provides, such as worming, vet visits for vaccines, various healthcare services and emergencies?

If you include anything you should revise your contract and have all boarders sign the new version.

[BeeHoney]

Just want to add that it’s not your responsibility to assist the dentist with collections.

I strongly agree that a boarder that can’t afford a $300 dental or vet bill cannot realistically afford to own a horse. A $300 dental bill is a very normal and expected expense for an older horse that likely has dental issues.

[Bogie]

I agree with others that it is not your responsibility to pay the dental bill. However, this is a huge red flag about the boarder – in terms of her understanding of the costs involved with owning a horse and her liquidity.

What’s going to happen if the horse next has a medical event that requires extensive treatment? It will likely be more than $300 and might put you in the middle again.

Most likely, the boarder did not understand the costs involved and it might have been prudent for the dentist to have provided an estimate (even a range) of the anticipated cost.

If there is nothing in your boarding contract about the boarder being responsible for paying outside expenses, this is a good time to sit down with her and explain what it costs to have a horse and suggest that if she cannot afford to maintain the horse she might need to find a less expensive place to board. My guess is her horse is not insured.

Horses are always finding ways to hurt themselves. I have a friend who has already spent more than the purchase price on a mare she bought last June . . . Luckily she can afford the vet bills but it can be disheartening.

[Posting_Trot]

I think you need to do as others have suggested: tell her that she needs to pay the dentist regardless of how she feels about it. By agreeing to have her horse done by the dentist, she essentially agreed to pay the bill that ensued. End of story. If she filled up her car’s gas tank and then decided that the gas was overpriced, she couldn’t (legally) just drive away without paying.

If you haven’t done this, it would be a kindness to sit down with her and, point by point, explain what the dentist did, and maybe show her your horse’s results from the dentist, etc. so she can get a stronger sense of what dental services cost and how essential they are.

Maybe you could explain some of the serious veterinary issues that could result from a horse not having their teeth properly floated, and how expensive those issues are likely to be. In other words, that dentistry for the horse isn’t a cosmetic issue, but a real, preventive veterinary procedure. And that, since the horse’s teeth obviously hadn’t been done in a while, she had more issues than (perhaps) your horse did.

Good luck! It’s not nice to be stuck in the middle like this.

[Djones]

You need to stay out of this mess between dentist and boarder. You also need to expect her to abandon said horse at some point and ghost you. She has zero interest in being responsible for her debts and responsibilities, she’s shown you that. She could have mailed the vet 50 bucks a month for 6 months, and she didn’t, did she?

[jvanrens]

@LCDR

In my 36 years of boarding when barn owners/managers have asked me if I want my horses scheduled along with the barn group for dental, chiropractic, massage, acupuncture, clipping and other such things I have ALWAYS been informed by the barn at that time what the cost will be. I believe you must assume a significant portion of the responsibility for this situation.

Maybe review the OP’s first post. She did tell the boarder that the cost would depend on what work needed to be done. She couldn’t give her an exact amount. Maybe the boarder should have asked for a phone call or text before the work was performed but she didn’t.

[SLW]

Your boarder is a creep. When first contacted by the vet clinic, one week after services were given, she said she didn’t have the money and that the fees were excessive. Then she ghosted the clinic anytime they called.

When I worked for an equine only practice if we encountered this issue, right away we set up a mutually agreeable payment schedule between the owner & clinic. If the payment was 2 days late I was on the phone with the owner. Most of the time we were able to get the fees paid.

Your boarders account would be flagged in our clinic “no services” to be given. The only way around that would be for us to run a credit card and collect the fees prior to giving any services.

You don’t mention how old your boarder is and her financial situation or if she is between jobs, etc. A lot of Goodwill can be extended when someone hits hard times but her judgment about the fees nixes that idea.

I’d give her 30 days to move and be done with this.

[fivestrideline]

@Djones

You need to stay out of this mess between dentist and boarder. You also need to expect her to abandon said horse at some point and ghost you.

This. I’m sorry, but a surprise $300 is chump change in the grand scheme of horse ownership. Responsible owners have savings/credit card for these things, or are ready to discuss payment plans/care credit with the providers BEFORE essential procedures are performed. What happens if maresy colics? Humane euth (higher power forbid) costs more than that, as does every gastric tube emergency call I’ve ever had.

@Merlin_the_Mule you have options here, since the deed is done and discussing what you/the vet should have done is not super helpful.

1. Notify Boarder that they are responsible for all vet bills for their animals per your contract. If the bill is still outstanding by X date, the horse must be removed from the property by Y date. Inform Boarder that if a payment plan is approved by the vet, the horse may remain unless Boarder defaults on the payment plan (which counts as not paying the vet, per your contract). Inform the vet of this action and provide all contact information that you possess. Written communication is your best bet here, and keep copies.
2. Pay the bill to the dentist, to maintain the working relationship with your vet. Notify Boarder that they must remove the horse by X date (if 30 days notice is in your contract, do that). Assuming the ability to ask Boarder to leave for any reason is in your contract (it should be). Count the $300 as a lesson learned, and remove the problem from your property.

Cut your losses here - it stinks but this is a classic red flag situation for your boarder. Someone in a tough spot that wants to pay their bills would reach out for options vs ghost. The fact that Boarder has become scarce and non-communicative is VERY telling that she knows she’s in the wrong and is hoping that the problem will just go away if she doesn’t pick up the phone or come out to the barn.

You might be able to cajole a payment for this out of her THIS time, but it’s been months. What happens with the next bill she defaults on? Months again of chasing her down? You’re out back board and have a senior horse on your property still requiring care? Agister’s liens are NOT easy to pursue.

[tabula_rashah]

I would cover the bill to keep the dentist happy if it’s important to keep your relationship with the dentist and then give the boarder notice

[CanteringCarrot]

Since when does a BO have to play “mommy” or “daddy” and talk to an adult about basic financial responsibilities, and/or cover a bill for them? The horse industry is wild. I can appreciate people wanting to help others though.

If the dentist let’s this ruin the relationship between him and the BO, that’s also a huge WTF. Putting the BO on that situation in the first place is just bizarre and borderline rude. This is between the boarder and the dentist.

I don’t know to what extent a BO should know about one of their boarders not paying other equine care providers. On the one hand that’s between the boarder and the provider. On the other hand, the BO might want to know that their boarder is irresponsible and take a moment to decide how he/she wants to proceed with boarder when it comes to their relationship.

I mean, if the BO wants to say there’s a zero tolerance policy for not paying care providers (whether it’s dentist, vet, farrier, chiro and so on) that visit the barn, and that can be grounds for eviction, that’s fine, but it should be in the boarding contract. As the BO, you can decide if you want to keep this boarder or not.

All that said, if I wanted to keep the peace and be on my merry way, I’d pay the dentist and give the boarder notice. All while keeping the above rant to myself

I’m so happy and thankful to have great BO’s out there, but you couldn’t pay me enough!

[Annie10]

She should have at least set up a payment plan with the vet if the bill was that big a shock. Dont just ignore it and then ghost everybody…

[red_mares]

I’d ask the boarder if she knows she owes the money and leave it at that. Collections is the vet’s problem. I had an outstanding vet bill because the vet wasn’t very good about sending me a bill. When I found out that I owed, I paid it.

[Willesdon]

The Boarder has just through a nasty divorce, purchased a house and is dealing with her ex and who knows what other major changes in her life. The reality is that most women take a drop in living standards after a divorce. She is having a tough time. However, that is her problem.

A BO or a Equine Dentist should not be paying for someone else’s life falling apart. Not their job. A horse barn is not a therapy centre, a BO not a therapist. Horses can create enough drama without adding in human emotions.

This is a slow mo car crash. The Dentist can take her to court. The BO can give her notice to leave.

[LCDR]

The OP is not blameless. She should have taken the initiative to check with her boarder about whether she had contacted the dentist and was informed about the cost and willing to proceed.

A simple “were you able to contact the dentist about his fee” would have prevented this problem.