Bosal Suggestions? (Horse dislikes a bit)

[Palm_Beach]

@Sparrowette - I understand your points. But as horsemen, shouldn’t we advocate learning and education and problem solving over sending the horse to the trainer for a fix? Because the bitting problem is not likely the only problem this horse will ever have. And a post of a hundred, or even a couple hundred, words on a bb will not do the same thing as a systematic education program will, and I feel that most people can understand and apply the concepts without having to be an expert rider or even particularly brave.

OP already had the horse with 2 trainers, and the discussion appears to be about what the horse “likes,” and the answer should not be “let’s appease the horse.” Training horses is a lot of work, and sometimes when you encounter a problem, you need to go back and figure out what lesson the horse really did not get, and fix that.

Some trainers are not really trainers, but simply good riders, and although they can ride problem horses, they don’t really understand the problem the horse is having and don’t make a behavioral change. And you don’t know this until you’ve spent the money and have sent the horse to yet another barn for training. And then you get the horse back and the horse regresses because you don’t ride as good as the trainer, and the trainer was not able to identify the problem and tell you how to keep it fixed.

I just advocate for everyone being a better horseman; it’s better for all of us, especially the horses, in the long run.

[kkmrad94]

The first trainer did a very good job and was taking it slow. When I asked him why he didn’t use contact he just said that she wasn’t there yet. He is an awesome trainer but unfortunately he is very popular and pricey so we were not able to take her there this year. We do have him scheduled for next spring but hopefully we can solve this prior to that.

The second trainer is where she is at and issues with the horse are not the only issues I’m having. I explained to the trainer all my concerns with the horse and how we have been unable to schedule lessons because the trainer doesn’t reply to my messages in a timely manner (or… every sometimes). I made a nice long polite email ( re-read it several dozen times) about the things I’d like the trainer to work on with the horse and with trying to improve communication and the response I got more or less was “if you don’t like how I operate you’re more than welcome to take your horses elsewhere.”

So. That is what we are trying to do at this point. I do like suggestions with how to fix things on our own because most cases we do not always need a trainer. At this point it is something I am not sure what the cause is and I will feed all the suggestions to the trainer we are going to talk to next week and see what she says. I am hopeful that she will be a better fit than the one we are currently at.

Thanks for all the suggestions so far.

[Sparrowette]

@Palm Beach

@Sparrowette - I understand your points. But as horsemen, shouldn’t we advocate learning and education and problem solving over sending the horse to the trainer for a fix? Because the bitting problem is not likely the only problem this horse will ever have. And a post of a hundred, or even a couple hundred, words on a bb will not do the same thing as a systematic education program will, and I feel that most people can understand and apply the concepts without having to be an expert rider or even particularly brave.

OP already had the horse with 2 trainers, and the discussion appears to be about what the horse “likes,” and the answer should not be “let’s appease the horse.” Training horses is a lot of work, and sometimes when you encounter a problem, you need to go back and figure out what lesson the horse really did not get, and fix that.

Some trainers are not really trainers, but simply good riders, and although they can ride problem horses, they don’t really understand the problem the horse is having and don’t make a behavioral change. And you don’t know this until you’ve spent the money and have sent the horse to yet another barn for training. And then you get the horse back and the horse regresses because you don’t ride as good as the trainer, and the trainer was not able to identify the problem and tell you how to keep it fixed.

I just advocate for everyone being a better horseman; it’s better for all of us, especially the horses, in the long run.

@Palm Beach, You are absolutely right. The horse probably has other things going on, and this bitting thing will not be the only issue she ever has. Horses are like that… But to advocate a particular trainer/program to excess can cause others to wonder why the excess exists, especially when there is money involved. Just ordering someone to spend money on a website is not, IMO, “problem solving”. If you signed up for some trainer, and learned something in particular that helped you, share what you learned and how it helped on the board. If people find it worthwhile, then your fav will be more respected. I advocate for truth in advertising.

Different trainers all have different skills and tool boxes. It sounds now like the OP has had a good one and was unable to continue.

@kkmrad94

The first trainer did a very good job and was taking it slow. When I asked him why he didn’t use contact he just said that she wasn’t there yet. He is an awesome trainer but unfortunately he is very popular and pricey so we were not able to take her there this year. We do have him scheduled for next spring but hopefully we can solve this prior to that.

The second trainer is where she is at and issues with the horse are not the only issues I’m having. I explained to the trainer all my concerns with the horse and how we have been unable to schedule lessons because the trainer doesn’t reply to my messages in a timely manner (or… every sometimes). I made a nice long polite email ( re-read it several dozen times) about the things I’d like the trainer to work on with the horse and with trying to improve communication and the response I got more or less was “if you don’t like how I operate you’re more than welcome to take your horses elsewhere.”

So. That is what we are trying to do at this point. I do like suggestions with how to fix things on our own because most cases we do not always need a trainer. At this point it is something I am not sure what the cause is and I will feed all the suggestions to the trainer we are going to talk to next week and see what she says. I am hopeful that she will be a better fit than the one we are currently at.

Thanks for all the suggestions so far.

@kkmrad94, I understand the boat you’re in, believe me. I’m glad that the mare had a good start with the first trainer. That the second won’t even return email would get me thinking thoughts. Sounds like an in-person chat may be in order. Also sounds like your mare is not a priority. You might contact the first, explain the situation, and ask for a recommendation to someone in your price range.

I’m not sure I understand what the horse is doing, is your mare trying to get her tongue over the bit? There’s a trick for that if she is, which involves plastic bailing twine. And you didn’t say how she reacted to you putting your fingers in her mouth. It is a good way to help the horse get used to something being there.

I’ll also vote in favor of making her stand tied while wearing a bit over the halter or tied to it, as others have said. Stick around, and be patient. We’re talking hours/days. Maresey needs to get good and bored. It’s possible that at some point, she may decide to throw some sort of hissy fit, and if you think that might happen, have your trainer there.

[kkmrad94]

I understand the boat you’re in, believe me. I’m glad that the mare had a good start with the first trainer. That the second won’t even return email would get me thinking thoughts. Sounds like an in-person chat may be in order. Also sounds like your mare is not a priority. You might contact the first, explain the situation, and ask for a recommendation to someone in your price range.

I’m not sure I understand what the horse is doing, is your mare trying to get her tongue over the bit? There’s a trick for that if she is, which involves plastic bailing twine. And you didn’t say how she reacted to you putting your fingers in her mouth. It is a good way to help the horse get used to something being there.

I’ll also vote in favor of making her stand tied while wearing a bit over the halter or tied to it, as others have said. Stick around, and be patient. We’re talking hours/days. Maresey needs to get good and bored. It’s possible that at some point, she may decide to throw some sort of hissy fit, and if you think that might happen, have your trainer there.

^^^

Trainer one likes trainer number two but doesn’t know what we have been going through with trainer two. I wonder if something is going on with trainer two that he isn’t talking about but it showing through in his work. I wonder if he thought she would be an easy ride and quick fix and since she isn’t trainer two has thrown in the towel.

She doesn’t seem to be trying to get her tongue over the bit… just trying to evade contact by poking her nose out. When you try to keep contact she throws her head. She is a bit over sensitive when it comes to her nose / bridle path. I have asked trainer one and two to clip her. Trainer one is tough and just keeps clipping despite horse flailing around. Trainer two clipped her once but didn’t try her bridle path and hasn’t worked with the issue since.

If she comes home with me I will work on just making her live in a bit (with supervision). I’m interested to see what the next trainer thinks of her. She is a good horse just needs some kinks worked out.

Horse is at trainer #2 still and we did schedule a lesson with trainer two for Monday.
I have scheduled trainer #3 to chat with and see if she would be a good fit on Tuesday. If all goes well I’ll be moving my horses next weekend.

If trainer #3 doesn’t pan out I will be bringing them home since I refuse to pay someone that flat out ignores me. I can do what I am able to with her until trainer #1 is available and just take lessons with trainer #1.

(sorry for the novel!)