bulls and trail riding? Behavior?

OMG!!#$%^&*!!! We went for the 3 hour trail ride in the new territory and saw a HUGE bull with his cows! I never saw anything this big! He was humongous! He was 2xtimes wider than any of his cows and much taller! His head was 2xtimes larger than my horses!

He looked at us very close and we talked very loud and passed him at walk, didn’t look directly at him, but both of us were almost peeing our pants! Now, we can go back there, but I’m wondering if that would be a good idea.

How do usually bulls behave towards horse riders? And how do horse riders should behave towards bulls?

I never had a problem but I can’t say I like it either. Before we moved to our farm I boarded at a place that had a mix of cattle and horses. The horses were pasture boarded in a huge field. The owner of the place failed to mention when discussing board rates etc. that the bull/cows SHARED the field with the boarder horses. Talk about a heart attack when I went to get my horse to work with her the first week, I came around a clump of trees and there was the big old bull smack in front of me! I never did have a problem with him but after that I kept an eye out for him and gave him wide berth too. More up close and personal…fast forward to playing polo at the grounds of Cowtown Rodeo. Weeellll it turns out when the CTR grounds owners granted permission to mow the field into a polo field for the Cowtown Polo team that did not include actually moving the rodeo bulls off of the pasture. Almost every game we played there as the visiting team…at some point the bulls would mosey out of the woods and decided to lay down on the polo field (mid game) to graze and nap. Some of the horses (like the OTTs!) would make it obvious they were not getting near those things and the QH/stock types (some of whom had cow working pasts) would have their riders smack the bulls with polo mallets to move them off the field. Now mind you the bucking broncs there were also turned out with the rodeo bulls and would also come to investigate the polo ponies tied at the horse trailers as the guys were busy chasing bulls off of the field. Some of the ponies thought it no big deal, some got pretty unhappy about the visitors coming over to investigate them. I learned pretty quickly to stay at the horse trailer to shoo off the broncs when the guys were off bull shoo-ing. I think Cowtown wins the award for Most Unique Situation To Play In.

[QUOTE=Dressage Art;3536422]
How do usually bulls behave towards horse riders? And how do horse riders should behave towards bulls?[/QUOTE]

Ignore each other. Most bulls could care less but there are those - especially if there are females in season - that will get a bit territorial.

In this area, every ride has a fair amount of cows and usually run into a bull or three. Just ignore them and do your thing, ride on past. I’ve never had a bull act aggressively yet, even with a new horse who insisted on stopping and staring at a bull beside the trail for a good 15 minutes with the deer in the headlights pure shock of 'omg what is that???"

Nah!

Nah!! shouldn’t be a problem. Remember cattle, like horses, get desensitized to each other with frequent exposures so any bulls that’ve had horses come by frequently won’t even raise their heads!! Never seen one attack!!! :winkgrin: I don’t think they are smart enough to see horses as predators. I HAVE seen cattle approach you when you get OFF the horse and walk them by. Some even can follow or appear to chase a human on foot. They think they’re going to get fed ie: associate humans w/food. So don’t be scared. You gotta be brave for your horse!! :smiley:

Well, I have to disagree somewhat with the “ignore him and keep riding” opinions. I worked on a dairy farm for 3 years and saw bulls attack the tractor or charge fences numerous times. A man here was just mauled and killed by a dairy bull a week ago.

First of all - what is the breed? The hottest and most volatile cattle we have in the States are Holsteins, followed by Herefords. Black and white Holsteins, in particular because the color is not natural to the breed so selective and inbreeding has occurred for so many generations that the personalities have gotten hotter and more unpredictable. I have even seen Holstein cows charge and attack the dog, or the gates. A young heifer once ran us all right out of the barn when she broke her chain and charged. Most of our cattle were very sweet, very very well trained. But young heifers who are in the milking barn for the first time were hotter and crazier than anything I’ve ever seen. On the other hand though, we never had a Red Holstein that acted this way. The Reds were always very very quiet.

Angus, Jerseys, Brown Swiss, Dutch Belt, etc. are much calmer and saner.

There was a saying on the dairy farm where I worked - there is nothing in the world more dangerous than a full grown Holstein breeding bull, never ever trust them. Obviously each bull’s personality and breeding will affect his temperment, but as a general rule, I would never trust a Holstein bull, followed by Herefords.

The farm had a young Angus bull that would sit in your lap and lick your neck if you let him. Very very sweet guy, all 1,800 pounds of him.

Conversely, one of our farmers went out with the tractor to move a water tank and the Holstein breeding bull, defending his cows, charged the tractor and got head to head with the bucket. We had to run down the fence line yelling and clapping to distract him so Chuck could get out of there safely with the tractor. They told me they’d seen breeding bulls flip tractors over, depending on how angry they are.

So if it were me, depending on the bull’s breed, I would likely give him a wide berth. If it is one of the gentler breeds, I would be cautious and keep my distance, but wouldn’t worry too much. But a Holstein or a Hereford? I’d probably find a different path. The good thing is though, they usually respect electric fencing so I’d feel a lot safer if he were in electric than if it weren’t electrified. Breeding bulls are raised to respect fencing from an early age. But if you are riding THROUGH the field, inside the fence with the bulls, you’re taking a very huge chance. One that I wouldn’t take.

Also I disagree about - if there are females in season they are more territorial. I’ve seen exactly the opposite. When cows are in their heat cycle, the bull is 100% focused on the cow, and doesn’t even know you’re there. We would wait for a bull to be courting a cow and then go out and do a fence repair, or put out mineral salt, etc. It’s when the bull has nothing else to think about that they focus on you.

DA - you’re in CA, which is 2nd to WI in dairy production, so I’d be curious to know if this is a Black/White Holstein or not.

I, too, am very cautious around bulls having been chased before. We had already passed the cows and my horse began glancing back…when I looked over my shoulder there was a bull at a dead run straight after us. We took off at a mad gallop and I even zig zagged a bit but that didn’t phase him!!

Another rider came up and distracted him off us finally!! Later I was told to always keep your horses rear toward the cow/bull because your horse will be knocked off his feet if broadsided!!

Never take them casually! Cows will also go after you sometime when they have young.

That’s what they always said at the farm too. Never get your truck or your tractor broadside to the bull. Always maneuver so he is going straight at the bucket or the grill because they can flip them over.

You know in all the movies where the bull is snorting and pawing the ground - that’s not just Hollywood. :lol: I’ve even seen cows snort and paw. It’s their warning that you’re about to get toasted.

Yeah, I was going to say something about Holsteins but it’s a rare farm that has a bull these days. They are just too hazardous to have around so the majority of cows are bred via AI. Holstein bulls are just about the biggest bovine I’ve ever seen! I came face to face with three wild Holstein bulls once. I rented use of some corrals and a barn from a rancher for my Paint stallion. The corral fences were huge, 6’ tall, telephone poles with 2"x12" boards, designed to originally hold grandfather’s imported Belgian stallion and then used to move cattle thru to a scale and loading chute. I was walking thru one corral with my horse following me, opened a gate and stepped around the corner of the barn. There in front of me, about 10’ away were three of the biggest creatures I had ever seen! I froze in place momentarily, brain unable to encompass the reality of these immense beings. The bull closest to me lowered his head, pawed the ground (just like in the cartoons) and took the first step towards me. OMG! then they all thre their heads in the air and turned around and ran! My horse came around the barn corner and started to give chase. The bulls had run from my horse who I had occasionally used for herding the neighbors angus bulls. I manged to get my horse back and we both got the heck otta Dodge and shut the gate. found out from the rancher that these wild bulls belonged to an old man who had sold off his dairy cattle except for these three calves that had grown up wild on his place. They were constantly breaking thru fences and the rancher with help had rounded them up many times. He finally brought them to his place where the big corrals could hold them until they could be sold offfor the owner. It’s why they ran from a horse which saved my fanny from becoming a greasy spot in the dirt.

Bonnie S.

If you trail ride often and run into the herds on a frequent basis get yourself a GOOD herding dog, preferably one already trained. I had a friend who worked on one of the big AI farms and they didn’t go anywhere near the bulls without 3 dogs. If they did they were fired on the spot. As to the breed of the bulls it almost doesn’t matter, any bull, on any given day can be nasty.

chic - You’re right that most farms use AI now. The place I worked always had a bull because he wore a paint ball and marked the cows that were in heat. He had a vasectomy (versus being castarated) so he still mounted and “bred” them but the sperm just didn’t make it to the cow.

Part of my job was to locate cows with paint ball markings and get them in so the breeder could come and do the breeding.

In fact, every farm I’ve ever visited keeps at least one marker bull. If you don’t have a marker bull, you are relying on your own eyeballs to continually monitor the herd to get cows in for breeding. Being that they are actively in heat for only about 12 hours, you end up with major lost income by not having a marker bull or two. Maybe the small farms that only milk 30 or 40 head can manage it but we’d have never been able to do that. There’s just too many spread out across too many acres.

Some farms use young bulls for this and replace them every year or two, which is what this farm eventually ended up going to. They are slaughtered (hamburger - not good for good cuts of meat) when they’re around 1,000 lbs. versus growing to fully mature.

They use AI not only for safety but because that way you can select specific features for your cows, just like picking a horse stallion for your mare. When you use one herd bull, your lines get really close and any flaws your bull might have, it just keeps passing on to the next generation. The place I worked frequently sold heifers for around the $6,000 mark and in order to produce cows that nice, they paid big bucks for breeding fees to really REALLY nice bulls. You could never get that kind of $$$ out of your heifers if they were always by the same sire. The chance that one bull can adequately compliment all 300 cows on your farm is slim to none.

With milk prices steadily dropping since the 70s, dairy farmers who really want to stay afloat have to find other ways to make revenue. And selling really nice show quality heifers is big business and really supplements the milk income. You HAVE to go to outside bulls to be successful at that.

[QUOTE=eventchic33;3538370]
If you trail ride often and run into the herds on a frequent basis get yourself a GOOD herding dog, preferably one already trained. I had a friend who worked on one of the big AI farms and they didn’t go anywhere near the bulls without 3 dogs. If they did they were fired on the spot. As to the breed of the bulls it almost doesn’t matter, any bull, on any given day can be nasty.[/QUOTE]

Working stock dogs are amazing at their jobs, but that job isn’t guarding trail riders from cattle.:slight_smile: Part of a stock dog’s job is holding the stock so a human can work nearby safely, but only a small part. The price for a trained stockdog starts around $1500.00, and the handler must also be willing to invest some months (at a minimum) into learning how to work the dog.

Of course, if DA did all that she wouldn’t have much time left over for riding, so her bull problem would solve itself.:winkgrin:

DA - are you riding through the bull’s pasture? I wouldn’t do it personally - if the bull doesn’t come after you, sooner or later when the calves come a mama cow will take offense at your presence.

Did you know that on a global basis cattle kill more people annually than any other animal?:slight_smile:

[QUOTE=Auventera Two;3538264]
DA - you’re in CA, which is 2nd to WI in dairy production, so I’d be curious to know if this is a Black/White Holstein or not.[/QUOTE]

I have no idea what breed that bull is but he was a light brown color with a big white face. Looked kind off like this one, but bigger, his 5th leg was literally a 5th leg that was touching a ground - probably well used? :lol:
http://reddevoncattle.com/red-devon-photos/red-devon-bull-leef.jpg
http://www.ansi.okstate.edu/breeds/cattle/shorthorn/Shorthorn%20Bull.jpg
http://luingcattlesociety.co.uk/commonfiles/images/luingbuzzard.jpg
he looked like a buffalo rather than a cow bull (?)

but in my eyes he was HUGE and looked more like this one to me :wink: http://boldt.us/4749-4/charging-bull
also check out the largest bull in the world photo: http://www.funis2cool.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/05/largest-bull-in-the-world-011.jpg

[QUOTE=pAin’t_Misbehavin’;3538777]
DA - are you riding through the bull’s pasture? I wouldn’t do it personally - if the bull doesn’t come after you, sooner or later when the calves come a mama cow will take offense at your presence.

Did you know that on a global basis cattle kill more people annually than any other animal?:)[/QUOTE]Yes, we rode thru the bulls pasture and we had no idea until we climbed up the hill and saw him 30 feet away from us! It’s common to have cows here and small bulls that are growing up - those kiddy bulls just start bucking when you ride next to them, but they run away from you. But that was the very first time that we saw a bull that was towering above the rest of his cows. I think I lost my sponge on the string there… but I think I’ll pass on looking for it next to that bull!

If he looked like a Red Devon or a Red Shorthorn with a white face, it was probably a Hereford. http://www.owlsbarn.com/ron%20hereford%20bull.jpg. Or could have been a Simmental http://www.simmental.com.au/images/06_Brisbshow_GCB_P.jpg but they’re more rare than Herefords.

What did his cows look like? Sometimes Red/White Holsteins can have maximum red and minimal white but it’s rare they end up red with a white face, but I suppose it’s possible??? If the rest of his cows were Red/White and/or Black/White Holsteins, then he could have been a Holstein with poor genetics and poor coloring. I saw a cow like that once but she did have a couple white pots along her back though also.

:lol: :lol: :lol: Hey, I’m with you on that one!

http://www.ausredgenetics.com.au/media/images/swedishred/bulls/2182%20S%20Adam.jpg

This is a huge picture, but worth the wait for the loading. Isn’t that just beautiful! I just love it when they’re all washed up and shaved.

Watch the video at the bottom of this page :D: Wow. That guy is a powerhouse.

http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.aberdeenangus.co.uk/images/netherton-foreign-cruz-small.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.aberdeenangus.co.uk/bulls.htm&h=220&w=344&sz=23&hl=en&start=4&um=1&usg=__0ALmBZmhygTHQvP5BBjqMXoQsfo=&tbnid=5rxk51Elip5Y4M:&tbnh=77&tbnw=120&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dshow%2Bcow%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den

I think DA is probably talking about cattle grazing on public lands, like county parks. I ride in those same places in northern California, I don’t think these cattle are for milk and they certainly aren’t black and white holsteins (I grew up in the dairy state). I have been told by my friend the 4H mom that the only ones to be wary of around here are the Charolais, the big solid cream color ones, they can be agressive. I always feel just a tad nervous when the bulls are around, but I have never had a problem. They sure are a lot more confident than the other cattle around, they look you right in the eye and make no effort at all to yield the trail. It can be kind of unnerving when they stare at you like that!

[QUOTE=Rachel L;3539034]
I ride in those same places in northern California,. . . I have been told by my friend the 4H mom that the only ones to be wary of around here are the Charolais, the big solid cream color ones, they can be agressive. I always feel just a tad nervous when the bulls are around, but I have never had a problem.[/QUOTE]

How interesting. Charolais bulls are popular with our cattle farmers too, way over here on the east coast. A friend’s gelding used to have a terrible habit of getting out of his pasture and going to stand right beside her daddy’s Charolais bull, refusing to come back so that my friend had to trudge out there with a lead rope and retrieve him from beside his bovine buddy.:lol: