[QUOTE=NoBSshoer;4569844]
Is my understanding that he’s been indicted for over 30 counts of mortgage fraud up in his home town of Boston. Of course with plenty of money to fight with, things like that can drag on for years but if the authorities can get a conviction that should get rid of him once and for all.[/QUOTE]
I just hope DeShawn Parker comes to his senses before he goes face first into the track at Penn one of these days. It will happen, just a matter of when.
I totally understand your points here but …
Why can there not be more people like " DickHertz, Jessie, or Laurierace" that we know about. they care. they voice their concern. and also they love their horses. what more could you ask for ?
Now, with that being said .I am sure you guys will throw other names out there. But these are the only ones I know of and therefore these are the ones I RESPECT as honest, good Race Track Trainers.
My Hat is off to them …
[QUOTE=DickHertz;4569331]
I’m not holding my breath that any tracks in PA will ban the guy any time soon. I think there’s probably a better chance that his mortgage business - which has been scrutinized several times in the past - would go under which would preclude him from losing money with his hobby.
As I said before, I do not have a problem with the people who are like Gill - those that claim and own a ton of horses - my issue is with the “win at all cost” mentality associated with it and the shear lack of regard for the lives, human and equine, placed at risk so that Gill can add another win to his tally.
What I do know is the PA Commission wants Gill out, but have been told to back off by the suits in Harrisburg which means they either don’t want to get sued or there is much bigger things a brewin…[/QUOTE]
What suits in Harrisburg … the politicians? I was hoping and praying that the Commission was working on banning Gill.
Now Dick… you know things operate to a different drummer at Penn… as all sorts of nasties occur that no one can explain…and people look the other way.
what one person can do…another is busted for doing the exact same;
and many get away with doing many no-goods with officicals looking the other way, or blatantly and openly ignorning any punishments due.
… and some get punished on simple hearsay from those who have the power to just offer hearsay.
fact fact.Deshawn used to ride for Dale Baird - who operated by the numbers at MNR. If he could ride first call for Dale he can take care of himself with Gill.
D is supposed to be riding here at Mnr this weekend, They gave me a call for my horse here Sunday but I scratched the horse (San Mark K) so I cant guarantee if he is riding here this weekend.
[QUOTE=Barnfairy;4570806]
No no, not Boston. He calls Windham NH home.
Loan firm charged with fraud settles in NH, MA[/QUOTE]
Knew he was from that region. I’ll stand corrected on the home town;)
[QUOTE=Little Hound;4571105]
What suits in Harrisburg … the politicians? I was hoping and praying that the Commission was working on banning Gill.[/QUOTE]
To clarify, the suits being the ones who work for the commission in Harrisburg, not the politicians. They told the commission at Penn to back down.
[QUOTE=brightskyfarm;4571108]
Now Dick… you know things operate to a different drummer at Penn… as all sorts of nasties occur that no one can explain…and people look the other way.
what one person can do…another is busted for doing the exact same;
and many get away with doing many no-goods with officicals looking the other way, or blatantly and openly ignorning any punishments due.
… and some get punished on simple hearsay from those who have the power to just offer hearsay.
fact fact.[/QUOTE]
What is true is the Chris Bouridis got caught with old, mostly empty bottles of injectables, many of which were vitamins and he got 3 years.
[QUOTE=Jessi P;4571310]
Deshawn used to ride for Dale Baird - who operated by the numbers at MNR. If he could ride first call for Dale he can take care of himself with Gill.
D is supposed to be riding here at Mnr this weekend, They gave me a call for my horse here Sunday but I scratched the horse (San Mark K) so I cant guarantee if he is riding here this weekend.[/QUOTE]
Don’t know about that, don’t think Dale was as aggressive.
[QUOTE=DickHertz;4572000]
Dale tapped horses. Gill’s outfit taps and blocks. Big difference. Although the one thing they do have in common is they rank 1-2 in terms of the number of horses sent to have a captive bolt put through their head. The other thing they have in common is that neither is/was a horseman. Dale was a better businessman than Gill though and was able to make a living without using money earned from fraudulent loans.[/QUOTE]
I might not be a 100% positive…but didn’t Dale get a bad test a few years ago for the blocking agent???
…now that I think about it – I’m almost 100% positive he did —& he got a bunch of days for it too, that were reduced. Might have been about 5 or 6 yrs. ago now, though…
Dale tapped and blocked.
Lusty is a riding horse in NH
Great! Thanks for the update on Lusty Latin
[QUOTE=NoBSshoer;4569245]
not unlike Frank Serpico saw in the NYPD. He said “about 10% are totally bad. and about 10% are completely good. The other 80% really wish they could be good.” This is pretty accurately what’s going on in racing.[/QUOTE]
I think that’s a good analogy. Except I think the % of totally good is way higher than 10%. 
It’s what makes that totally bad 10% stand out even more. As has been mentioned, it’s the sensationalistic stuff that gets attention, and they provide most of it. When a mere 10% accounts for almost 100% of the “black eye” racing gets, it seems it should be rather motivating to all, to see they are stamped out.
In essence, their existence is 100% negative, there are no positives, from any viewpoint or perspective.
A few tweaks here and there, within the industry, make it a priority, I see them going away. Not a real hard undertaking, is it?
I guess there’s something about the dynamic that I’m not pinpointing or not seeing…if such a small % can’t be eradicated? Even the simplest set of rules and consequences would seem adequate…so, how many must “look the other way” for it to continue? Must be a huge number then, or a small number, with a lot of power?
[QUOTE=WinterTriangle;4576662]
I think that’s a good analogy. Except I think the % of totally good is way higher than 10%.
It’s what makes that totally bad 10% stand out even more. As has been mentioned, it’s the sensationalistic stuff that gets attention, and they provide most of it. When a mere 10% accounts for almost 100% of the “black eye” racing gets, it seems it should be rather motivating to all, to see they are stamped out.
In essence, their existence is 100% negative, there are no positives, from any viewpoint or perspective.
A few tweaks here and there, within the industry, make it a priority, I see them going away. Not a real hard undertaking, is it?
I guess there’s something about the dynamic that I’m not pinpointing or not seeing…if such a small % can’t be eradicated? Even the simplest set of rules and consequences would seem adequate…so, how many must “look the other way” for it to continue? Must be a huge number then, or a small number, with a lot of power?[/QUOTE]
Well…where do we begin?
How does a decent or ethical trainer work for the likes of Mr Gill? Or people of his ilk? Most racehorse owners are the farthest thing from horsemen you’ll ever meet. Majority if they visit the backside at all need to ask which horse is theirs.
What they do want more than anything though is to win. They want a winners circle picture to put in their office and really don’t care how they get it. The guys who have the best medicine do the most winning and are always about three steps ahead of the testing. Thus, they get the most owners.
Add to this a track management who has races to fill. If you’re a trainer with horses on the grounds they need to be running. As much as possible. If you got a horse that needs a rest they’ll very strongly suggest you do what you gotta do to get the beast running sooner than you should or lose your stalls. Who then gets the stalls they take from the ethical trainer? You got it the one who injects, blocks, etc etc.
As these outfits grow bigger and bigger they gain more muscle and not only aren’t messed with by track management but more often than not get to the point of having stewards, secretaries, stall men etc in their pockets.
They then become leading trainers and pretty much own and operate a track. Especially a small time gyp track. Owners all want their horses in their barns and the cycle perpetuates.
I believe major strides could be taken to clean up racing by knocking these big outfits down to size. Years ago it was rare for an outfit to have more than 20 or so horses in their barn. This business of running a stable like Corporate America needs to end and it can very easily by doing as follows: Trainer saddles the horse That’s it. Period. No assistants. No authorized agents of. No flunkies of any kind. The trainer of record must show up in person to saddle any and every horse they have entered. No substitutions any time for any reason ever.
If this was done no trainer would take on any more than they could personally handle. It would keep stables smaller and give other trainers a fighting chance.
Will this ever happen? No. Why not? Because it is owners that finance and bankroll the industry. Owners like it the way it is. Mr Gill is not unique. There is plenty of owner avarice to go around.
Zidane broke down in the 4th race. The jockey Dana Whitney was airlifted to the hospital, condition unknown at this point. Four other horses were affected. Zidane was claimed.
My mistake, this was not a Gill horse just a Gill trainer. Same thing if you ask me but wanted to clarify anyway.
Cole Norman is actually a very good trainer, a decent human being who had some trouble in his past (who hasn’t?) and a mentor for those such as Tim Ice, (Summer Bird) in his own right. Until you know the man, pehaps you should get your facts straight. Maybe yes, a “convicted felon”, as you say but he has paid his dues and his “felony conviction” has absolutely nothing to do with his training or Thoroughbred race horses.
[QUOTE=Buck Off;4621075]
Cole Norman is actually a very good trainer, a decent human being who had some trouble in his past (who hasn’t?) and a mentor for those such as Tim Ice, (Summer Bird) in his own right. Until you know the man, pehaps you should get your facts straight. Maybe yes, a “convicted felon”, as you say but he has paid his dues and his “felony conviction” has absolutely nothing to do with his training or Thoroughbred race horses.[/QUOTE]
Buck Off,
Thanks for the clarification, but I’m still a bit confused. Mr. Norman has had numerous drug positives in his career as a “trainer” and he killed a human being due to no other fault of his own. I don’t think people would have an issue with Norman if he had a couple of positives for Bute overages and a couple of summary offenses for Jaywalking. The reality is the man is perhaps one of the most aggressive needle trainers of the past 20 years and he killed a person while driving a vehicle. It’s up to Norman to rebuild that image and over time people with some pretty checkered pasts can overcome that and regain respect. What is Norman doing to prevent others from making the same mistakes he made? Is he doing any community work to help others with the demons he’s suffered from (I’m not asking as a smartass, but you imply that you know the man).
Annnd he’s done it again :sigh:
Any word on how Melodeeman and his Jockey are after their fall in race 2 tonight?
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