Business Owner - What to Do?

[Impractical_Horsewoman]

I’m giving advice as a small business owner (an author) myself.

She can talk to her friends, she can rage offline in real life, but she has to let it go (even if she’s 100% in the right) online.

It’s especially difficult given that this is a rather complicated scenario to explain (again, even though she is in the right), which can quickly turn into a game of telephone she said/she said online. You don’t want to distract from the positive associations with your brand online. You learn from the experiences, and, as others have said, don’t send two finished products to someone with the expectation one will be sent back, especially without getting payment for either.

Also, putting a customer “on blast” is off-putting for me as a customer. Even if the business is in the right, no one (especially a horse person and a trainer) likes to worry that if you buy an item from this person, and there is a conflict, that they might throw a tantrum online. A business today lives and dies by positive reviews.

If there wasn’t a contract about sending one back, I think it will be hard to fight in court for a small item (even if there was a verbal contract). Also, if the trainer has friends, it’s not a great way to secure a foothold in the industry, especially in the horse industry, to get a reputation as being sue-happy.

This is time to reevaluate business practices, and chalk up the loss as lost inventory.

[Impractical_Horsewoman]

@Arelle

Countless times, she has been slighted when it comes to advertising by these professionals - they don’t tag her in social media, they don’t hashtag her brand, they don’t show any public gratitude for her generosity.

I will also add as an author (who puts her heart and soul into her words), I think your friend needs to detach herself emotionally from the product a bit more, to be able to weather the ups and downs of her business. Ultimately, the future of the business will never mean as much to the consumer in the same way it does the owner. Some riders who get freebies from big horse companies blast this because it’s gratification for THEIR brand as an equestrian. There’s less incentive to do this for small ones. I agree that funny videos, an engaging social media presence on Facebook and Twitter, and establishing relationships (via joint giveaways, or with other local businesses) is more important. You can’t assume people will advertise for you for free, if you give them a product, and it’s also challenging because then you can’t control how they speak about the product.

That’s my free advice, for what it’s worth! I understand about protecting your friend, but if you say what the product is (without naming it), we might be able to offer more specific advice.

[Displaced_Yankee]

To be a little forward-thinking for your friend…

Maybe she offers an influencer a pair of “chaps” at cost, then a promo code “TrainerJane10” for 10% off valid for any months she makes XYZ social media posts with XYZ product mentions. That way, the ongoing discount to influencer and influencer’s contacts is contingent on said influencer’s posts.

The other thing that I have noticed on Instagram (no longer a Facebook user) is that the adult amateur or “professional-amateur” is a lot better at this sort of promoting than a trainer or professional. They have a lot less on their plate, IMO.

I am going to agree with the others: no social media blasting (specific or nonspecific of trainer). Just a business mistake, lesson learned.

[Jealoushe]

Your friend should look into courses for those who are wanting to have influencers/or people who represent them on social media. A lot of people forget that that part too, is business. A fully understood agreement between both parties needs to happen before money or goods are exchanged.

Lesson learned for your friend, but also suggest they get some further education on these things.

[trubandloki]

I just want to say, that it sounds like the friend of the OP thought she had an understood agreement with the person they sent “the chaps” to. It is probably in writing (email or text) too.
I think one point is that many people do not think something is a real contract unless it is a real written contract.

[Scribbler]

@Impractical_Horsewoman

@Arelle

Countless times, she has been slighted when it comes to advertising by these professionals - they don’t tag her in social media, they don’t hashtag her brand, they don’t show any public gratitude for her generosity.

I will also add as an author (who puts her heart and soul into her words), I think your friend needs to detach herself emotionally from the product a bit more, to be able to weather the ups and downs of her business. Ultimately, the future of the business will never mean as much to the consumer in the same way it does the owner. Some riders who get freebies from big horse companies blast this because it’s gratification for THEIR brand as an equestrian. There’s less incentive to do this for small ones. I agree that funny videos, an engaging social media presence on Facebook and Twitter, and establishing relationships (via joint giveaways, or with other local businesses) is more important. You can’t assume people will advertise for you for free, if you give them a product, and it’s also challenging because then you can’t control how they speak about the product.

That’s my free advice, for what it’s worth! I understand about protecting your friend, but if you say what the product is (without naming it), we might be able to offer more specific advice.

Ah yes. I agree, being “sponsored” by CWD or something might seem like it raises a trainers status. Whereas they don’t get any status points for promoting a locally made set of polo wraps or saddle pad or bling browband or “chaps” etc. And it may not be part of that trainers online presence to talk about their gear. They mostly don’t. You’re right, it’s more an ammie thing. I would target the ammies that run tack review blogs.

[AltersAreUs]

@anon40672407

I don’t think there’s any point in ‘blackening trainer’s reputation’. That just invites completely fictional reprisals and there’s no end to that nonsense.

See, I think just the opposite. If the trainer really did deliberately destroy a sample because she was peeved, she needs to be outed. The horse industry has way to many missing stairs in it - if people would just out the bad behavior, others could successfully avoid getting into business with them.

And any trainer who thinks this is an acceptable response to reasonable request is not someone most people want to do business with and certainly not someone other craftsfolk should be soliciting for possible sponsorships. At the very least, I’d be outing her in whatever closed forums for her craft she’s a part of.

[Scribbler]

@AltersAreUs

@anon40672407

I don’t think there’s any point in ‘blackening trainer’s reputation’. That just invites completely fictional reprisals and there’s no end to that nonsense.

See, I think just the opposite. If the trainer really did deliberately destroy a sample because she was peeved, she needs to be outed. The horse industry has way to many missing stairs in it - if people would just out the bad behavior, others could successfully avoid getting into business with them.

And any trainer who thinks this is an acceptable response to reasonable request is not someone most people want to do business with and certainly not someone other craftsfolk should be soliciting for possible sponsorships. At the very least, I’d be outing her in whatever closed forums for her craft she’s a part of.

I get the impulse. But if I was a potential buyer what I’d remember of the business owner, rightly or wrongly, is that she’s an unprofessional drama queen and I would avoid her. I likely wouldn’t follow the debate closely but would get a negative reaction from her.

I see a few horse professionals online who will post complaints about their (unnamed) clients not paying or missing appointments. Honestly I think: huh, how passive aggressive, why not talk to the particular client?

[trubandloki]

There is another way to deal with it, depending on the damage and the product.

Social media advertising post along the lines of - Look how amazing ZYZ chaps are. Someone can chop off the fringe (include some photo of the back of a small child holding scissors) and the smooth finish can get scuffed and they still work amazingly and do not look bad while they do it. Showing a photo or video of someone great rider wearing said ruined half chaps.

Now, I suppose this is not an option for some products. But most things there is a way to make it into a positive. Don’t mention the idiot trainer, just show how great the product is.

[AltersAreUs]

@Scribbler

But if I was a potential buyer what I’d remember of the business owner, rightly or wrongly, is that she’s an unprofessional drama queen and I would avoid her. I likely wouldn’t follow the debate closely but would get a negative reaction from her.

I see a few horse professionals online who will post complaints about their (unnamed) clients not paying or missing appointments. Honestly I think: huh, how passive aggressive, why not talk to the particular client?

That’s a complete contradiction, though. You don’t want to support a drama queen who names names but you also think complaining about an unnamed individual is passive aggressive and why don’t they just name them. Sounds like the only path you think is a good one is to just stay quiet and never talk about people’s bad behavior … which allows said bad behavior to continue and allows this “professional” to screw over other unsuspecting people.

[furlong47]

If it’s a serious business, your friend needs to be businesslike. That means not putting the trainer (or any client, ever) on blast on social media. What the trainer did was not right, but your friend needs to be above starting a public feud. If I were checking out a business and saw all sorts of drama and negative emotion on their website or social media, I’d be running the other direction immediately. It’s also possible there was some sort of misunderstanding, and we are only getting one side of the story here.

Friend should reexamine what she’s doing because it doesn’t sound like it is working out as intended. Also, handing out tons of free stuff in the beginning can get your name out there but it can also backfire later. I’ve seen companies that start off with big sales and discounts, and later you just see everybody saying “yeah, I used to shop at XYZ Tack a lot, but they never have the 50% off sales that they used to have every week, so I rarely use them anymore”

[Scribbler]

@AltersAreUs

@Scribbler

But if I was a potential buyer what I’d remember of the business owner, rightly or wrongly, is that she’s an unprofessional drama queen and I would avoid her. I likely wouldn’t follow the debate closely but would get a negative reaction from her.

I see a few horse professionals online who will post complaints about their (unnamed) clients not paying or missing appointments. Honestly I think: huh, how passive aggressive, why not talk to the particular client?

That’s a complete contradiction, though. You don’t want to support a drama queen who names names but you also think complaining about an unnamed individual is passive aggressive and why don’t they just name them. Sounds like the only path you think is a good one is to just stay quiet and never talk about people’s bad behavior … which allows said bad behavior to continue and allows this “professional” to screw over other unsuspecting people.

I am OK with the Bad Boarders FB group and any legit serious trainer complaints. Blood death SPCA seizures etc.

But on the other hand most of the low level ammies here play trainer musical chairs chasing a dream or delusion that’s beyond their skill or wallet, and end up disillusioned at each trainer. I don’t need to see that blow up online. Though I’m happy to hear about it as gossip.

The thing about online is that whenever I read about an interpersonal or business dispute, especially being broadcast to “tell the truth,” it does tarnish both parties. That may not sound fair to the party that considers themselves injured, but that’s how it goes. I don’t have the bandwidth to investigate the truth between two parties I’ve never heard of. I also assume that small businesses have legitimate legal recourse to get paid. So if some regional handcrafted bling brow band maker let’s say is blowing up over a sale gone sour, first thing I’m going to think is they are unprofessional or else the actual facts of the matter are that the deal was not so clearcut and they can’t take it to small claims court where it belongs.

[Impractical_Horsewoman]

Yes, basically it shows she doesn’t have a way of dealing with issues with a customer other than public shaming and blaming.

This time, she might be in the right. But, I hate to say it, but most tiny sellers who go “straight to social media” with a complaint from a customer, do it reflexively with issues both small and large. Even complaints about less than five-star reviews.

When I have an issue, I want it to be a private discussion with the business.

[StormyDay]

Businesses never should put someone on blast. It may feel good for a few minutes, but it looks unprofessional and the negative consequences will live much longer than that feeling.

However, it is ok to post a public message to their Facebook saying something like ‘Hey, I’ve been having a hard time reaching you and still haven’t received payment. It’s probably an address mix up, but can you send me a message confirming where you sent that to? Thanks!’

But, never be anything less than polite and never accuse the person of any bad behavior; let the other potential customers read between the lines. That’s showing other potential customers how cordial you are in business, even when something goes wrong. That’s the image you want to project.

Recently, I saw a post from a local restaurant owner who had a terrible experience with a large group of customers. They came in, got drunk, and didn’t tip. He blasted those people. And I get it, he was angry. But it just looked bad. He eventually deleted the post because even though he didn’t do anything wrong, it’s not a good look to complain about customers; even bad ones.

It’s like when you see google reviews that are poor and the owner replies. A simple ‘I’m sorry you had a bad experience, I hope you come back so we can make it right’ looks a lot better than ‘you came in, yelled at the staff, threw merchandise on the ground, and didn’t tip. And you think we caused your bad experience?’

[BrendaJane]

I’d send an invoice for the destroyed item with the expressed implication to receive full payment for the item.
And then entertain the option to take the trainer to small claims court, assuming the ‘chaps’ do not run over 5k - which in this layperson’s mind is the cut-off range for small claims?

It will cost time and some money, but should help her to recoup some money.

And send it snail mail, certified, with delivery confirmation.

[TheJenners]

This is a tough one, for sure. One the one hand, I’d like to know what trainer behaves like this and purposefully damages things they aren’t planning on paying for and agreed to send back. And the amount of crazy and petty to damage something before returning it free of charge? Sounds like someone who would cut tails and forelocks if you decide to move your horse. And I think it could be done tactfully by the business owner, and then shut down commenting to keep the drama at bay.

I know we aren’t actually talking about custom chaps, but if the item would have normally been more than $500, I’d honestly sue her butt. Sure it takes time and is a pain in the ass, but a judgement against someone is public record.

[Bogie]

I would not call out the trainer on social media. I would send them an invoice for the product they destroyed. If they don’t pay, a demand letter prior to taking them to small claims court might prompt some action. Is it possible they thought they were allowed to keep both? The wanton destruction of the “chaps” is so hostile and vindictive, it’s hard to imagine.

As a blogger, I do get products from people to try and review. Some companies let me keep the products, others ask for them back. I view it as a privilege and always return the items if asked for.

[trubandloki]

@Bogie

As a blogger, I do get products from people to try and review. Some companies let me keep the products, others ask for them back. I view it as a privilege and always return the items if asked for.

OK, I am curious. You do not have to name brands, but what type of product does one test and return and the manufacturer can do something with the returned item? It is now used.

[clanter]

@Bogie

Some companies let me keep the products, others ask for them back. I view it as a privilege and always return the items if asked for.

just be aware if one plans on just sending something that was not ordered hoping for a positive review you might not see the product back nor receive payment

" Under federal law (and I believe all states also have supporting legislation) , recipients of unordered merchandise may keep the goods and are under no obligation to pay for or return them. The recipient may treat the merchandise as an unconditional gift—and may use or dispose of the merchandise as he or she sees fit. The recipient also may refuse to accept delivery

.

In the outline of OP it appears that this was not the case but it always best to have a sample product (If you want it back) sent as a normal order.

[JanM]

I agree, where I used to work, the few times we had items sent to use without a purchase order or other kind of order from us, they were sent back. We could not pay for items we didn’t order, or have authorized to purchase.

At home, If I get something I didn’t order, I can’t be required to pay for it, or send it back.